Your satellites, your SoI and you

[Danny-Dynamita]

Ok guys, I need some help to wrap my head around these doubts.

However, great powers can still attempt to place the satellite state within their sphere of influence or, if the satellite's government allows it, invest in the local economy. The mother country (if a Great Power) receives 100% bonus influence with its satellites.

Quoted from the Victoria 2 Wikipedia: http://www.victoria2wiki.com/Satellite



So, basically, this means that a satellite of mine can get out of my SoI. In terms of trade and economy, this means the satellite is getting out of my National Market? Cause I suppose the SoI is what determines that. Or in other words, such a thing means I have to keep the satellite inside of my SoI to benefit economically from him? (ie, access to rare and demanded resources that would be sold immediatly in the International Market).

And if I'm not a Great Power, there are no economical/trade benefits in having a satellite? Cause you can't have a SoI if you're not a GP, as far as I know.

Thanks in advance for the help.

Extra question: Is there any kind of event/way of annexing a satellite? I think I've read that somewhere.

 

[Krilnik]

Satellites are pretty much useless unless you want it for roleplay reasons or they are weak enough that they never become a GP.
You need to have countries in your SoI so they are inside your national market yes. Having them only as satellite doesn't do anything.

And as far as I recall there is no event for annexing a satellite, but there is one for annexing a SoI. There is one catch though, you need to be cultural union of the nation. For example USA is cultural union of all USA cores, so if you were to sphere Texas as USA they would eventually apply for annexation. Same goes for Germany, for example if there is some German minor still alive, like Baden or Bavaria, and they are in yours ( German ) sphere they will apply for annexation.

 

[Pornek]

Satellites are pretty much useless unless you want it for roleplay reasons or they are weak enough that they never become a GP.

They are useful if you want to conquer a better region but cant due to going above infamy and being too weak to fight multiple GP.

 

[Krilnik]

Well ofcourse I didn't say everything, but I think it has more negatives then benefits. I mostly do it for RP reasons.

 

[El Jojo]

There's the small advantage that they'll always answer calls to arms and you can have them without being a GP. I don't really see the negatives, being useless is a lack of benefits.

To be exhaustive, you have the Gran Colombia decision which allows to absorb all your satellites into Gran Colombia, so it's worth puppetting as much of south America as possible.

And it's easy to get satellite by investing in small countries and wait for them to have a communist revolution when they'll nationalize your investments, granting you the puppet CB. Greece is a good candidate and they have a lot of cores to gain back.

 

[LiberiusX]

Pop Demand comes with lots of decisions to establish satellites via decision. For instance, Yugoslavia can be formed as long as you the owner of the states is you or a country in your sphere. For Austria, this is incredibly useful since it allows you to gain control of most of the Balkans.

Outside of these decisions, puppets are useful because you get a boost to influence with them, so they make cheap(er) spheres to keep up.

 

[maxirage]

Satellites are generally a bad thing as they prevent you from annexing the country. If you go conquest happy as China, for example, you're stuck with a free Tibet that looks ugly on the map. Unpuppeting a country requires you to jump through very silly and extreme hoops.

 

[LiberiusX]

^meh. If you play in the civilized world, puppeting is very useful tool. If you annex too much, the crisis system will catch up with you. Countries like Austria have very insecure borders and puppeting someone on one of those borders really improves the strategic situation.

I do have a question though. In PDM, I played a Congress Poland game where I was puppeted by Russia. I noticed that military tech was insanely cheap for me. I later played a Congress Poland game where I wasn't puppeted and military tech seemed normal. Was I imagining things or do puppets get a discount on tech that their controller has researched already?

 

[Lwantssugar]

It's useful in Pdm Because you can only build certain units (ie the good ones) from primary and accepted pops, so satellites are a good means to assert hegemony over lots of otherwise unruly pops

 

[magitsu]

^meh. If you play in the civilized world, puppeting is very useful tool. If you annex too much, the crisis system will catch up with you. Countries like Austria have very insecure borders and puppeting someone on one of those borders really improves the strategic situation.

I do have a question though. In PDM, I played a Congress Poland game where I was puppeted by Russia. I noticed that military tech was insanely cheap for me. I later played a Congress Poland game where I wasn't puppeted and military tech seemed normal. Was I imagining things or do puppets get a discount on tech that their controller has researched already?

It's most likely because you are in the Russian sphere. You get discounts based on your master's techs. Ideally you'd want to be in Sweden's or Prussias, because they have huge rp gain due to literacy / size and thus usually lead in tech.
As an unciv it's really useful to get sphered in terms of tech. For income it might be disaster since you won't be able to run tariffs which some countries could use to be able to raise the level of bureaucrats and clerks to improve RP gain / westernization. Usually you don't have a choice, but giving 200 relations to your favourite and keeping the other one near 0 might help bevause the hgher relation one gets influence point growth bonus based on relations.

Satellites could be useful also if you don't want to bring large poorly educated state to lower your rp gain. For example if too small country ends up with say one of those Austrian or Prussian crown jewel states (the ones loaded with coal etc.) they are so big that nationalists etc. will eat you alive. Usually you have to absorb them at the highest militancy they'll ever be because of the war you've waged to grab them. So they might rebel in an instant and wipe all of your troops from other states.
For example I managed to siege and annex Belgium as Luxembourg. But they had so high militancy that I had no chance in the world to hold them. Unless I got one or two of those best militancy reduction events. Like they will come when you most need them.. yeah.

 

[Hethran]

Satellites are also useful for reducing infamy, each satellite you release gives you -5 infamy.

But yes, as a general rule, if you are not a GP, satellites will only be of help in wars.

 

[IncredibleHorst]

Can't you also push your research by releasing nations with lower literacy levels?
Does anyone know what technologies the satelites receive when they are released and what determines if they are civilised or not?

 

[Will Steel]

Satellites can also be a big problem though. Once you create a satellite out of a nation, that land is basically an invincible, unresponsive duck. You can never annex them, attack them or possibly harm them unless you lose in a war and AI has added a wargoal to free them (which it probably never will, because it has better things to do). All you can do after that is to sphere it (if a GP) and hope that nation manages economy well enough. You don't have an option to voluntarily release satellites ever.

So much for the restrictions of this game. Lazy development on the part of the devs.

 

[SR71]

I've noticed if the Satellite has the wrong party policies it prevents you from investing in the country. Seems strange an overlord can't invest in his puppet. So to not being able to load troops of a Satellite that you've commandeered onto your own transport ships. Would be nice to able to take control of a Satellite's troops during peace time to help deal with rebels in your own colonies etc also.