Your best Tank Division

[Simon_9732495]

In this thread we post our favourite Tank Division, before commenting the other Postings.

I'd say let's not post late-game stuff. (No Modern Tanks, use ~1941-43 tech)

Here's mine:

A 16-4 Medium Tank with Mobile Warfare Right Right, designed for speed and simplicity

Template:

In the Field (literally, it's in Plains territory):

Reasoning:

1. Max Speed: 20.7 km/h
2. Max Speed: 20.7 km/h
3. Max Speed: 20.7 km/h
4. Mobile Warfare because Speed
5. With it's Soft Attack, Breakthrough Hardness and Armor it can break Infantry Divisions quickly and wreak havoc with overruns or deep thrusts into enemy territory using it's speed.
6. 16 Tanks because 35 org is decent
7. Mot because it's cheap and simple. (Mech3 is not worth it, Mech1,2 too slow)
8. No TD because of simplicity (Would it be useful in that Division? I'm not sure...)
9. ENG for the speed buffs
10. Arty because +30 Soft Attack only for 12 pieces of arty is soooo cheap. Would I be better off without? I dont know...
11. Recon for the speed buff
12. Log for Russia
13. No Signals because micro
14. 385 XP needed -> cheap in regards of XP use

Details on how to get the speed:

• At least 12km/h needed for the Tank. I used Tank designer and XP Upgrades
• Plains +15% is from Recon
• Plains (Hasso von Manteuffel) +10% is the Improvisation Expert
• von Brauchitsch gives 20% (bug)
• Mobile warfare gives 20% (bug)
• Last 2 are Panzer Leader
• Field Marshal is listed full but counts only half, so +2.5%
• 15+10+20+20+5+2.5 = 72,5
• 12 km/h * 1.725 = 20.7 km/h

Your posting doesnt have to be that long and you dont need to explain your stats in detail.
I got carried away...

 

[Corpse Fool]

I'm not sure about MW R/R when you've already got 16 tanks. You don't really need more breakthrough, and mobile infantry is still offering more org until 17/3. The differences then are the breakthrough tactic and your recovery. Tactics aren't worth worrying about for themselves, so its just recovery, and you're getting boatloads of recovery either way.

The reason I suggest MI is because speed is the top 3 reasons you like this division, and MI gives your motorized +10%, which will up your basic cap from 12 to 13.2. You'll have to swap motorized recon for AC or LT recon though, because motorized recon doesn't get the speed boost, armoured recon does and AC and LT tanks can move fast enough anyway.

16 tanks is getting pretty aggressive, your HP ratios are going to suffer for it. 12379 IC and 137.2 HP is 90.22~ IC/HP. A 15/5 is going to be 11873 IC and 160.2 HP, 74.11 IC/HP, which is a quite notable improvement. This affects your manpower losses as well, which affects your XP retention.

 

[Simon_9732495]

I'm not sure about MW R/R when you've already got 16 tanks. You don't really need more breakthrough, and mobile infantry is still offering more org until 17/3. The differences then are the breakthrough tactic and your recovery. Tactics aren't worth worrying about for themselves, so its just recovery, and you're getting boatloads of recovery either way.

The reason I suggest MI is because speed is the top 3 reasons you like this division, and MI gives your motorized +10%, which will up your basic cap from 12 to 13.2. You'll have to swap motorized recon for AC or LT recon though, because motorized recon doesn't get the speed boost, armoured recon does and AC and LT tanks can move fast enough anyway.

16 tanks is getting pretty aggressive, your HP ratios are going to suffer for it. 12379 IC and 137.2 HP is 90.22~ IC/HP. A 15/5 is going to be 11873 IC and 160.2 HP, 74.11 IC/HP, which is a quite notable improvement. This affects your manpower losses as well, which affects your XP retention.

Thank you very much for your helpful answer. But it seems you missed the first sentence in the OP ;-)

 

[Corpse Fool]

In this thread we post our favourite Tank Division, before commenting the other Postings.

1 super heavy tank, 4 infantry 4 cavalry 1 para/marine/mountaineer. 20 wide space marines which counts as a tank division, for minimum cost. I used to use it as Soviets to get roko's +15% genius on as many divisions as possible.

 

[Kazakk]

Too much breakthrough, it's a waste.

My best tank divisions depends on whether or not we have air superiority. Air superiority is extremely important. It also depends on the doctrine, sometimes I go for mass assault as the SU even when going tanks, and so I add more mechanized infantry.
With air superiority: 5 mechanized infantry, 8 SPA, 3 tanks.

Without air superiority:

I only add more normal tanks when going against a massively buffed AI where I can expect many dozens of 40w tank divisions, because then I really need to be able to pierce them while not getting pierced myself.
This can also work with heavies if you have the industry. I love going heavies with the SU. When going mass assault you need more mechanized infantry.

 

[el nora]

I'm an old fogey. I like my classic SF r-l 12-8s. In the case of the USSR, who are playing pure defense until dday, that looks like anything between 11-2-8 to 8-2-3-8, depending on how aggressive the German tanks are, and how much I want to punish their lack of hp. And yes I will license American HTD for that. Even with the +45% production cost, they are still 34.75% cheaper than a tank battalion would be. And for the +25% hard attack, I consider it a steal.

Go ahead, click me with your 16-4.

 

[Simon_9732495]

Go ahead, click me with your 16-4.

No thanks...

I'll try to encircle you when you're not looking...

Jokes aside, do you think a fast Mediums build _could_ work in competitive Multiplayer?

 

[el nora]

No thanks...

I'll try to encircle you when you're not looking...

Lokes aside, do you think a fast Mediums build _could_ work in competitive Multiplayer?

Yes they absolutely can. Because nearly all competitive mp is not played in vanilla. Many mods bring medium stats to a more competitive level.

with only one player each on the USSR, mediums work because of how hard it is to micro the entire ostfront at once and how easy it is for all the other Axis memebers to slip something past while the one guy on Soviets is distracted. But if you've got three or four players on Soviets, it's much less likely to occur.

 

[walt526]

Is this intended to be best overall (i.e., balanced) design, anti-infantry, or anti-tank? Because that's going greatly alter the ideal composition quite a bit.

 

[Corpse Fool]

Is this intended to be best overall (i.e., balanced) design, anti-infantry, or anti-tank? Because that's going greatly alter the ideal composition quite a bit.

It is whatever you want it to be.

 

[Harin]

I'm an old fogey. I like my classic SF r-l 12-8s. In the case of the USSR, who are playing pure defense until dday, that looks like anything between 11-2-8 to 8-2-3-8, depending on how aggressive the German tanks are, and how much I want to punish their lack of hp. And yes I will license American HTD for that. Even with the +45% production cost, they are still 34.75% cheaper than a tank battalion would be. And for the +25% hard attack, I consider it a steal.

View attachment 674882

Go ahead, click me with your 16-4.

With that much health, armour, and hardness, does that division even take combat losses? It seems attrition is the only thing that division has to fear.

 

[Cavalry]

Go ahead, click me with your 16-4.

Yeah, tank division is always a race vs the opposite.

To save the cost, I often have 2 kind of tank divisions: 1 vs regular enemy infantry and 1 spearhead to break where it needs.

And it is a mix to get the best of things:

- HTD with +5 armor first: formula for cheap high armor level. Or you can use +5 armor on HT and +5 gun on HTD. The HTD can be used in AT Infantry.
- No HT for 40W or Sometimes just 1 HT for armor bonus, if I am low on land XP and have used the XP for gun of HTD.
- Medium tanks for cheap soft attack and breakthrough, also much cheaper IC than heavy tank. The heavy tank is just too expensive but is valueable in 20W when they can do both jobs as tank+ anti tanks. Use 1 instead of 2 will increase Org and save space.
- Medium SPAA. These also can be used on everything: infantry, MOT. Heavy SPAA is quite high cost and slow. And don't have enough XP for both.
- Cavalry for Russia forest and snow, or reduce cost or increase Org even more.

Tank design: heavy tank design + armor looks best. If the division has too much armor, you can reduce the number of tanks to reduce the cost.

If you play long enough, the Super heavy TD is an ingredient for cheap high armor level, or cheapest hard attack source.

 

[Simon_9732495]

Is this intended to be best overall (i.e., balanced) design, anti-infantry, or anti-tank? Because that's going greatly alter the ideal composition quite a bit.

It's the Tanks that you consider best (or good enough) to use in your games and are happy with it.

Best considers:

• good stats of course
• cheap enough in IC,
• cheap enough in XP,
• easy enough to research
• easy enough to produce,
• easy enough to field in relevant numbers at the relevant time
• enjoyable enough to field and to play with them
• ...

 

[AndTheBestGamer]

I don't know what you will think but for me the best tank division is Heavy Tank Division in case of Historical Mods the ss heavy panzer battalion.

 

[AndTheBestGamer]

For the tank designer I use Henschel company.

 

[demon72]

I'm an old fogey. I like my classic SF r-l 12-8s. In the case of the USSR, who are playing pure defense until dday, that looks like anything between 11-2-8 to 8-2-3-8, depending on how aggressive the German tanks are, and how much I want to punish their lack of hp. And yes I will license American HTD for that. Even with the +45% production cost, they are still 34.75% cheaper than a tank battalion would be. And for the +25% hard attack, I consider it a steal.

View attachment 674882

Go ahead, click me with your 16-4.

How many divisions of that type can you deploy?

And can you deploy enough to avoid encirclments?

Certainly you deploy massive numbers of w2 Divisions as a workaround for the AMTRAC-"Elite"-issue...

...but fuel and IC?



Myself I still use boring 4-3-2 as main template for vanilla SP (MW R&R). Might not be the best one, but works well with my strategy.

 

[AndTheBestGamer]

How many divisions of that type can you deploy?

And can you deploy enough to avoid encirclments?

Certainly you deploy massive numbers of w2 Divisions as a workaround for the AMTRAC-"Elite"-issue...

...but fuel and IC?



Myself I still use boring 4-3-2 as main template for vanilla SP (MW R&R). Might not be the best one, but works well with my strategy.

Depend, I try for the major to have 10 or 15 Heavy Panzer Battalion division deployed for both attack and defese same for avoid encirclement.

 

[FLUX2226]

Read it a few times now, what does MW R/R mean? Mobile Warfare, Right/Right (as in, Schwerpunkt and Modern Blitzkrieg as sub-branches)?

 

[demon72]

Read it a few times now, what does MW R/R mean? Mobile Warfare, Right/Right (as in, Schwerpunkt and Modern Blitzkrieg as sub-branches)?

exactly

 

[AndTheBestGamer]

? I only sayed what division for me it would be the best that for me is Heavy Panzer division.

exactly