"You won't need to sieged down that last province to make a peace deal"

[Twoflower]

This does not apply in any way to humans, be it in SP or MP, right? If a human was able to prevent/delay peace deals by just destroying all his forts, this would have the potential for exploity tactics. Since the AI is not going to burn down all its forts, there does not seem to be much of a problem if it just something to guide the AI.

One thing that does come to mind however, and that I can't check right now (at, err, work ): do the American natives start with more castles than their capitals? If not, this modifier might make it even more unlikely for the (European colonizer) AI to ever conquer the Inca or Aztecs, or for AI Inca to conquer Chimu, which seems kinda bad.

 

[s1234567890m]

If a human was able to prevent/delay peace deals by just destroying all his forts, this would have the potential for exploity tactics.

It would be a quick way to get massive amounts of rebels to pop up and insta seige the entirety of the players nation.

 

[Falc]

You'll have to siege a fort to take land. This is not REMOTELY the same as having to siege every province you want to take, and you full well know this, so cut the drama.

AI issues are being worked on.

I'm wondering if this can't be sort of abused?

I mean, what if Ming were to relocate their capital to the most defensible position it can find (up some mountains), destroy all other forts and just build their capital fort up and they only keep an army there.

That province becomes almost impregnable.

So the AI declares war and takes all the other provinces except that one...

Will it then accept a peace offer of white peace? Or concede defeat? Because any peace offer it could make me has this -1000 modifier, so if I offer something worth 10 warscore, that's a lot more than what it could ask...

 

[ringhloth]

I'm wondering if this can't be sort of abused?

I mean, what if Ming were to relocate their capital to the most defensible position it can find (up some mountains), destroy all other forts and just build their capital fort up and they only keep an army there.

That province becomes almost impregnable.

So the AI declares war and takes all the other provinces except that one...

Will it then accept a peace offer of white peace? Or concede defeat? Because any peace offer it could make me has this -1000 modifier, so if I offer something worth 10 warscore, that's a lot more than what it could ask...

That's not how the computer negotiates peace. It has a war enthusiasm, and you need to meet it. So, if the player were giving up things, the only thing besides the AIs war enthusiasm and the warscore is if the AI just doesn't want anything else, even after a long war. Besides "letting your whole country be occupied for a prolonged period of time" is a bad way to get out of a war, even if it did work.

 

[Falc]

Yeah, it doesn't look obviously abusable, but then again, I'm not the specialist. We'll have to wait for DDRJake to abuse an immensely fortified Ryukyu island and conquer the world with it

 

[Subbak]

I'll go ahead and point this out again, explicity. The point you tried to make is made through an absurd abuse of the system. It doesn't stand. The AI will never leave half the country completely without forts.

In my game as England, Burgundy took Lyonnais, and I took Poitou and Béarn. Narbonne and Paris are the only remaining forst in France, which means I can basically walk around everywhere in their territorry (except for Dauphiné), and so can Burgundy. France has not been building any new forts, and it's been a while since I last hit them because I want to keep Gascon as an accepted culture but there are no more Gascon provinces to take.

 

[Haccoude]

You'll have to siege a fort to take land. This is not REMOTELY the same as having to siege every province you want to take, and you full well know this, so cut the drama.

AI issues are being worked on.

I definitely agree with this. OP was being overdramatic in not wanting to siege any forts. However, a fort in St. Petersburg protecting Siberia is ridiculous. "Defense in depth" doesn't make sense to that degree. I'd say that taking a province covered by a fort without sieging the fort should be impossible. Similarly, you should have to take a fort if you want to take land that is separated from you by an ocean or sound. Countries should also be highly unwilling to make peace before you take one of their forts, OR until you've taken 9-11 provinces from them. If you've been able to take that many provinces from them, it's not because you're avoiding their forts, it's because they have deliberately left regions unprotected and you should be able to punish them for that.

 

[Kerschey]

The downside to using this strategy is that you'll get occupied really easily which will wreck your war exhaustion and economy, you'll probably have rebels popping up and adding revolt risk and changing religions in provinces that don't border forts (which will be almost all of your provinces), you'll probably be forced to release territory as independent nations in a peace deal, give up all your gold, be humiliated, pay war reperations, etc. Then when the war is over rebels will probably break off more of your country. So maybe you'll prevent a specific province from going to a specific other party, but you'll lose way more in the process.

 

[Haccoude]

The downside to using this strategy is that you'll get occupied really easily which will wreck your war exhaustion and economy, you'll probably have rebels popping up and adding revolt risk and changing religions in provinces that don't border forts (which will be almost all of your provinces), you'll probably be forced to release territory as independent nations in a peace deal, give up all your gold, be humiliated, pay war reperations, etc. Then when the war is over rebels will probably break off more of your country. So maybe you'll prevent a specific province from going to a specific other party, but you'll lose way more in the process.

The "Russian Spite" method of dealing with invasions?

 

[ringhloth]

I definitely agree with this. OP was being overdramatic in not wanting to siege any forts. However, a fort in St. Petersburg protecting Siberia is ridiculous. "Defense in depth" doesn't make sense to that degree. I'd say that taking a province covered by a fort without sieging the fort should be impossible. Similarly, you should have to take a fort if you want to take land that is separated from you by an ocean or sound. Countries should also be highly unwilling to make peace before you take one of their forts, OR until you've taken 9-11 provinces from them. If you've been able to take that many provinces from them, it's not because you're avoiding their forts, it's because they have deliberately left regions unprotected and you should be able to punish them for that.

Well, it should get fixed, but as long as the AI builds forts, we're fine. There will be a handful of weird results, and while it should be fixed, I'm sure it's not exactly high priority, and it's a very complex fix.

 

[josh127]

Would be nice if you've occupied a province, held it for X amount of time, and it's not in an unoccupied fort's zone of control they would be willing to negotiate for it. Doesn't mean you get it for free, you still have to get the warscore to take it, but would be nicer than the -1000 wall.

Holding it for a certain amount of time is key here too. That's the part that shows you've kept conrol of the area and aren't just running in and sniping it at the end of the war.

 

[Kerschey]

Here's another crazy trick, if you don't build any armies, your opponent can't get any army tradition for defeating them! Because they don't exist!

 

[dbruser]

Im not sure what the dramatic you cant take siberia if the only fort is in St Petersburg. The AI will build at least a fort or two and humans cant exploit no fort building (you can demand any province, AI are just coded to say no if you dont have nearest fort). And even if the AI didn't build any forts sending an army to seige St Petersburg is still 100x easier than the old you have to seige half their country and/or destroy there army before they give you a single province