You killed a game!

[Theodotus1]

It is a bit odd, to be honest, to hear these complaints from some about Prussia being too hard, while on the other hand there are just as many, if not more, who say that Prussia is not too hard at all. My suspicion is that the difficulties are due to a question of how one plays Prussia, as opposed to a fundamental problem with how Prussia is set up.

Actually, IMHO, this makes quite a bit of sense, as machine parts are the vital underpinnings of the Industrial Revolution. Yes, it does make things a bit hard on non-industrial powers, but historically they were quite a far ways behind the curve. How long were you playing the Latin American countries without being able to get any machine parts? Also, you can get machine parts via techs & inventions, which can help kickstart the economy.

I see a lot of posts from people who would rather complain than improve their strategies.

If some people can do well, it's an indication that the setup isn't fatally flawed. (If no one was doing well, that would indicate a problem.)

As for machine parts, if they're more scarce and more sought after than steamers, they're going to be more expensive. That's just basic supply and demand.

 

[Theodotus1]

Machine Parts either needs to come down in price...

or not be required for early stage factories.

Would not requiring them until later in the game help?

The Victorian era was not a time when there was a level playing field for all nations. One way this is expressed in the game is the uneven availability of machine parts. It's just part of the landscape, and it's better to work around it than to lament it.

 

[DukeWilleo1630]

But from what I can gather, the majority of the people doing well edit the prices of goods etc..
Maybe I'm not the best at this game, In fact, I know I'm not the best.
But It should still be made so that I can actually be a moderate success as a european nation on easy diffulty

 

[EUnderhill]

I forgot to say that I liked HOI very much - it had some flaws but it is good game - and concept that you could not worry to much about economy is good for me. In Victoria you made everyone started with a minus in their budget balance (their fnance ministers were very bad I see :rofl: )

I think that you made design error here - you were thinking to add chalenge here but part of fun was lost. For me most of fun in HOI was loading 6-8 transport boats in April 1936. and sailing with whole fleet to Brasil to take rubber - now this is fun part and in Victoria you cannot do this because program is forcing you as player to play like monkey to lower military maintenance (btw, all reserve divisions are gone from pool for Prussia...) etc... it just makes that players must play by some rules and there is no freedom of choice here...

Victoria 1.0 was OK - you just had to make AI better etc. - but making economy pain in the ass was very, very stupid move Paradox and I don't know who told you to do this???


Garrr

And this invasion army is going to stay in supply how?

There is plenty of freedom of choice in Victoria. There are also plenty of consequences for said actions chosen, for good or ill. That is the beauty of this game.

I am sorry that you find the economy to be a pain in the butt. The nineteenth century was a time of great booms and busts, and I wish that the game reflected that more. Yes, it would be nice if provinces could actually have more than one resource and proximity of inputs to processing, land localized supply and demand could be modelled, but it will do for now.

War can be annoying, but without it looming as a possibility I would not have to consider how much of my resources to divert to defense, and what kinds of risks to take.

BTW if only I could open an Excel file ingame, it would make analysis a bit more feasable on the fly, rather than to use a ledger book and calculator.

 

[Dinsdale]

As for machine parts, if they're more scarce and more sought after than steamers, they're going to be more expensive. That's just basic supply and demand.

Yes and no. Whatever quantity of steamers and machine parts which consists of 1 unit should not be priced simply by supply/demand alone. Using this economy Brittany Spears CDs would be 1000's of times more expensive than a classical CD

Manufactured goods have a price which is affected by supply and demand, but a car is not going to priced cheaper than a loaf of bread simply because of market forces. Goods need a min and max price, otherwise ludicrous swings will occur.

Looking at the files, Steamers have a resource_price of 112, machine parts 80. Do these values only affect game start or is this a price modifier? If the former, then the economy is pretty fatally screwed, if the latter then supply/demand is kicking in around 30% of the base price.

 

[Aetius]

Looking at the files, Steamers have a resource_price of 112, machine parts 80. Do these values only affect game start or is this a price modifier? If the former, then the economy is pretty fatally screwed, if the latter then supply/demand is kicking in around 30% of the base price.

The price in the file is the price "balanced" demand and supply, the actual price is based on a factor times the base price.

 

[Dinsdale]

The price in the file is the price "balanced" demand and supply, the actual price is based on a factor times the base price.

Well that's good news. So the poster in question's game has seen a change in price between the two goods of 30% which isn't too dramatic. That's not bad depending on prices of other goods.

Otherwise it's just a question of modding the file to make commodity base prices whatever people want them to be.

 

[Johnny Canuck]

But from what I can gather, the majority of the people doing well edit the prices of goods etc..

While a significant number of people may have done this with the 1.02 patch, I would say that it is too early to tell whether the same will hold true for the 1.03 patch (& personally, IMHO I doubt this will be the case).

 

[Aetius]

Otherwise it's just a question of modding the file to make commodity base prices whatever people want them to be.

Yeah but you have to be careful, if you for instance reduce the Machine Part price so it is below the cost of making them the AI won't build any Machine Part Factories. Then you get all kinds of knock on effects. The efficiencies of the factories are initially so low that great care needs to be taken.

 

[unmerged(15665)]

I don't see what it is with the complaints about Prussia either. They have a big population, many pre-existing craftsmen and clerks, starting machine parts, good prestige, lots of money, and good resources. If you can't make a profit then you are doing something wrong.

 

[unmerged(19825)]

And this invasion army is going to stay in supply how?

There is plenty of freedom of choice in Victoria. There are also plenty of consequences for said actions chosen, for good or ill. That is the beauty of this game.

I am sorry that you find the economy to be a pain in the butt. The nineteenth century was a time of great booms and busts, and I wish that the game reflected that more. Yes, it would be nice if provinces could actually have more than one resource and proximity of inputs to processing, land localized supply and demand could be modelled, but it will do for now.

War can be annoying, but without it looming as a possibility I would not have to consider how much of my resources to divert to defense, and what kinds of risks to take.

BTW if only I could open an Excel file ingame, it would make analysis a bit more feasable on the fly, rather than to use a ledger book and calculator.

As we see there are not just me who doesn't like this heavy aspect of micromanagment in Victoria. Some AI countries doesn't have problem with this, so playing on Normal with so many ecomony disadvantages is a torture.
Even easy and beginner is hard.

I tried to cheat yesterday and to give myself money and I pumped million € into my account but after 10 years I didn't have any North German culture for my divisions and no manpower, it was -54 all the time, and this bug killed even this game.

The game have serious problems and I will leave it in this state - I have another great game to play which is called Dominion 2. Maybe some of you have heard about this game?

Over & out.


Garrr

 

[Belissarius]

This is a gross overreaction. They did not kill the game.

I like 1.03 just fine.

While i agree that the game isnt too difficult for myself, There are alot of people who disagree with us. And just dismissing him like that isnt doing anything but piss him off and people who agree with him.

 

[Derek Pullem]

As we see there are not just me who doesn't like this heavy aspect of micromanagment in Victoria. Some AI countries doesn't have problem with this, so playing on Normal with so many ecomony disadvantages is a torture.
Even easy and beginner is hard.

I tried to cheat yesterday and to give myself money and I pumped million € into my account but after 10 years I didn't have any North German culture for my divisions and no manpower, it was -54 all the time, and this bug killed even this game.

The game have serious problems and I will leave it in this state - I have another great game to play which is called Dominion 2. Maybe some of you have heard about this game?

Over & out.


Garrr

I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it - but you clearly did not understand how to play the game. Even the manual (!) tells you to convert POPs to soldiers for more manpower (or raise the slider). If you have -54 manpower all the time then I guess you haven't converted any pOPs or tried increasing the support slider.

 

[unmerged(5871)]

Dam!!

So, economy does't get any better in 1.03 than in 1.02. Can't ther just be something between 1.01 "too easy" and 1.02/1.03 "masochism"?

 

[Derek Pullem]

So, economy does't get any better in 1.03 than in 1.02. Can't ther just be something between 1.01 "too easy" and 1.02/1.03 "masochism"?

On what do you base this?

 

[Grosshaus]

So, economy does't get any better in 1.03 than in 1.02. Can't ther just be something between 1.01 "too easy" and 1.02/1.03 "masochism"?

In 1.03 it is very hard to make pops keep their cash reserves, but comparably easy to keep the national economy afloat. With working partisans warfare is quite easier than in 1.02. Those are the major gamebalance differences I can think of. I'd say it's pretty much easier with 1.03 than 1.02.

 

[unmerged(23687)]

Can't ther just be something between 1.01 "too easy" and 1.02/1.03 "masochism"?

Till the middle of January i thought the same about 1.02 and played with mods which makes things a bit easier. Now i believe that my problem was only a lack of experience and this is the key to success. Since then i have had a lot of fun with 1.02 and now with Prussia in 1.03

 

[unmerged(19825)]

I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it - but you clearly did not understand how to play the game. Even the manual (!) tells you to convert POPs to soldiers for more manpower (or raise the slider). If you have -54 manpower all the time then I guess you haven't converted any pOPs or tried increasing the support slider.

Support slider is on maximum and I know about increasing soldiers via converting POP's. It's a bug! Nasty bug! :wacko:

I didn't say that i didn't enjoyed Victoria, hmmm let's say that I did enjoy it like a horse enjoys beating with a whip

I will maybe try another game later....


Garrr

 

[Derek Pullem]

Support slider is on maximum and I know about increasing soldiers via converting POP's. It's a bug! Nasty bug! :wacko:

I didn't say that i didn't enjoyed Victoria, hmmm let's say that I did enjoy it like a horse enjoys beating with a whip

I will maybe try another game later....


Garrr

I don't think so - send me a save game to victoria dot bugs at btinternet dot com and I'll check it out.

 

[Grosshaus]

Support slider is on maximum and I know about increasing soldiers via converting POP's. It's a bug! Nasty bug! :wacko:

Not the support slider, that has no effect on manpower. Max defence spending instead.