[WWW] Battleplans für Yugoslavia

[Voigt]

I never played a WW2 game before, but I deeply follow the development of HoI IV and eagerly awaits its release.
I think your WWW Stream are wonderfull and hope more of them to come.

But one thing always bugged me, when @Da9L played; he alwayed drawed a broad battleplan, to march his entire army along the front forward, although he would fight in Hills/Mountains/Across Major Rivers.

I know he is a just a type of player like this, and likes to micro everything himself, still I would like more detailed battleplans with the considerations of terrains.

Also especially against minor nations with pretty low National Unity, wouldn't it be sensible to use spearhead to quickly capture major Victory Points?



I quickly draw a battleplan with my glorious MS-Paint Skills. March forward and secure the major river (red), and in the west just stay at the border and dig in. As long as the enemy doesn't withdraw his force from there, why fight them in the hills and take losses.
After that launch three spearheads (orange) to secure the Captial and the Victory Points.

If this isn't enough for a surrender, mob up the enemy behind the major river, so you don't take the malus from crossing (green), and cut of the north-west from supply.

Finally take another two victory points (purple) to end the war.

But I don't know, would something like this be sensible, and Daniel just isn't the type of player who would use such a detailed plan, or are there some other major flaws with that so it wouldn't be useable in General?

 

[Nitan17]

Daniel's playstyle in streams really is pretty much "push forward, CHARGE". He plays very inefficiently and makes tons of mistakes. It is a bit understandable - it's a stream, so he has to play quickly, he doesn't have time to think up a detailed, smart plan. But when he throws his units without any organization into mountains filled with enemy forces, I die a little inside.

The plan you have drawn seems pretty good. Capture victory points as fast as possible, so they will capitulate and you don't have to battle the rest of their troops. Nothing wrong with it at all. It would require some micromanaging though, not everything can be done with battle plans' AI. And by "micromanaging" I mean PROPER micromanaging - pausing the game, carefully issuing orders to the right units, checking the terrain. Not Daniel's joke of micromanagement, which causes more harm than good.

I don't mean any offense to Daniel and his skills, really, but many things he does could be done much, much better, if he only spent a bit more time thinking about them.

 

[JerkyJerry]

I don't mean any offense to Daniel and his skills, really, but many things he does could be done much, much better, if he only spent a bit more time thinking about them.

But he can't think about battle plans. He has no time. He is just showing us about the game. Haven't ya'll hear him say at the start of every nearly (or every) video that he is just rushing it along for our benefit? How normally he would not be attacking this early in the war? That people have been posting that they want him to do this or that, so that is what he does. Wasn't there a vote on-line yesterday about joining a faction? Did he not say he was out sick and he just came into work today to do WWW?

Ya'll have to understand what the series is for. It's for Daniel to show us things about the game not to show us his skills.

 

[panzerzombie]

I don´t envy Daniel for having to show the game & explain it on a ticking clock ( I envy him for being able to play though ) to a critical crowd.

At least he is very entertaining. Ofc his play style is hair rising and stress inducing to a strategic ( but thorough) snail like me.

 

[Jurjen Olthoff]

Another problem with drawing up detailed plans like that is that they will likely run into problems on the way. As Helmut von Moltke said: "No plan of operations extends with any certainty beyond the first contact with the main hostile force." This means the more detailed the plan is, the more changes are going to be have to be made on the way.

In any case it might be better to just attack on a broad front, keep some reserves and break through whenever you see an opportunity. Of course you can make detailed plans, and they will work as long as you actively check if your plan is running into trouble and adjust accordingly. As for instance in the case of the Hungarian invasion of Yugoslavia, Daniel was able to break through several positions because he saw the lack of forces there. This kind of insight isn't always available in the planning phase.

 

[Sir Garnet]

Yes, narrow thrusts to seize key points, cut off and encircle enemies, and leave them to wither should be an effective style if the battleplan system allows it. It certainly works in HOI3 without fancy battleplans. So far in the streams we've mostly seen just broad fronts, some with a swinging element. But that may be due to the game speed.

Daniel fights in the great offensive tradition of Sweden's age of imperial glory. Swift, fierce offensive action, always trying to wrongfoot the enemy. Sometimes decisive, sometimes bloody disaster when the enemy is prepared in defensive works. The secret of the Swedish technique is to prevent the enemy from being prepared.

The ability to cycle through the OODA loop of Observe, Orient, Decide, and Act more quickly than the enemy yields accumulating advantages as the opponent falls further behind and starts responding ineffectively to events and to situations that are already superseded. The lagging commander not only lacks the initiative but may be positionally dislocated, uncoordinated, and temporarily blind to the the tactical and even strategic situation. Commanders revert to type then - some dig in until matters clarify, others react to events or rumors, and others may flail around searching for information.

The breakthrough in France in 1940 is a classic example. Manstein's classics of maneuver warfare also show the OODA loop at work.

Playing HOI4 at fast speed seems like another favorable environment for this, judging from Daniel's direct and Spartan playing style and lightning speed that probably works even better against people without quick tactical reflexes than against the AI, which responds similarly at any speed but fails against superior tactical play.

Roll speed back to a constant 1 or 2 as seems likely for full multiplayer and more deliberate and more careful players benefit from the more strategic pace. I bet Daniel plays more carefully, but with the benefit of more time for sharp tactical play as well as all the non-combat tasks.