Winning the HYW means... A 200 Years War

[Lehran]

In my England game France only break free once, as I started to integrate them. It is understandable that they declare independence when you want to integrate them, but if you win the independence war you should keep your integration process and they shall be forbidden to declare independence for like 5 years or so.
Since the current system is pretty unfair, I decided to keep them as a PU minor because they won't break free due to my power as long as I don't try to integrate them.

 

[StatikShocker]

In my England game France only break free once, as I started to integrate them. It is understandable that they declare independence when you want to integrate them, but if you win the independence war you should keep your integration process and they shall be forbidden to declare independence for like 5 years or so.
Since the current system is pretty unfair, I decided to keep them as a PU minor because they won't break free due to my power as long as I don't try to integrate them.

You'd want the opposite if you were playing as Norway, Naples, or Mongol Khanate probably is more fair to reset the integration process than not.

 

[aqvamare]

They will never revolt, as long England is stronger than France and france manpower is empty and both of you are in war!!!!

This can be difficult at the beginning, but with every province it comes easier.
Simple way, during PU process...try to make claims on burgund. After the PU starts, war against Burgund. When with Burgund finsihed, Scotland, HRE Elector 1, HRE Elector 2, Spain, Native, Ottoblob.

Simple, be permament at war, you do not have to fight anything, as long your enemies are weaker than france. They will crush everything. After 50 years (ingame, only 10 5year wars)

Intergrate...you will be at +200 thanks fought war together.


But never, never be at peace when the end of month comes...than, when france is ready for this, they will war england as long oyu haven't +200 Relation, which can be difficulty with Lolland Revolt -60.

But I puppet france for 50years with war tactic with -60 from Lolland, and -50 from anti papal desicion.

 

[Lessing]

I tried to integrate France once as England after the HYW, and I swore never to do it again.

Back then, PU broke for no reason specified anywhere in the UI, and my dont like wasting my time on guesswork.

Winning the HYW as England does not give you a reward appropriate to the effort that goes into winning the war. It's annoying and a huge letdown by Paradox.

At least in CK2, when you won the Norman Conquest, you had something in your hand.

 

[Kalderus]

I tried to integrate France once as England after the HYW, and I swore never to do it again.

Back then, PU broke for no reason specified anywhere in the UI, and my dont like wasting my time on guesswork.

Winning the HYW as England does not give you a reward appropriate to the effort that goes into winning the war. It's annoying and a huge letdown by Paradox.

At least in CK2, when you won the Norman Conquest, you had something in your hand.

But in CK2, winning the Norman Conquest (assuming you mean as William) was more the equivalent of winning the HYW as France. The better comparison was winning as Harold, which is pretty equivalent to the letdown of winning the HYW as England, since you'll likely only get a white peace, and William will still have his claim. He might even still have part of his doomstack, and use it to faction himself as King of France. And then you have to worry about those scheming vassals after the war.

 

[Viperswhip]

A terrific permanent war is the Crusade target. At least you get bonuses from it.

 

[descarado84]

this brings up a deeper question for the devs: -why- is this type of stupid gamey tactic necessary to keep a PU?

 

[Lehran]

You'd want the opposite if you were playing as Norway, Naples, or Mongol Khanate probably is more fair to reset the integration process than not.

No, seriously. It is not fair if it is impossible to integrate a PU minor since they can always break free at 99% and destroy all your progress although they might lose the war horrible. The AI does not do this since it won't break free if it's to weak although it would be clever. But a player could always.

 

[Frungy78]

200 relations. That's all it takes. You can get 200 from diplomats alone, plus being in wars together, royal marriage, etc. It's seriously not difficult.

 

[Zander]

this brings up a deeper question for the devs: -why- is this type of stupid gamey tactic necessary to keep a PU?

Well, from a realism perspective, PUs should be more common but almost always break rather than integrate successfully. From a gameplay perspective that would obviously be unfun. The current system where they are pretty easy to keep unless the subject nation is huge actually works pretty well.

 

[Rubidium]

But in CK2, winning the Norman Conquest (assuming you mean as William) was more the equivalent of winning the HYW as France. The better comparison was winning as Harold, which is pretty equivalent to the letdown of winning the HYW as England, since you'll likely only get a white peace, and William will still have his claim. He might even still have part of his doomstack, and use it to faction himself as King of France. And then you have to worry about those scheming vassals after the war.

Depends on which patch. Which side was favored tended to fluctuate rapidly from version to version

 

[atwix]

They will never revolt, as long England is stronger than France and france manpower is empty and both of you are in war!!!!

This can be difficult at the beginning, but with every province it comes easier.
Simple way, during PU process...try to make claims on burgund. After the PU starts, war against Burgund. When with Burgund finsihed, Scotland, HRE Elector 1, HRE Elector 2, Spain, Native, Ottoblob.

Simple, be permament at war, you do not have to fight anything, as long your enemies are weaker than france. They will crush everything. After 50 years (ingame, only 10 5year wars)

Intergrate...you will be at +200 thanks fought war together.


But never, never be at peace when the end of month comes...than, when france is ready for this, they will war england as long oyu haven't +200 Relation, which can be difficulty with Lolland Revolt -60.

But I puppet france for 50years with war tactic with -60 from Lolland, and -50 from anti papal desicion.

i doubt other countries have anything to do wether or not a subject revolts. Minor PU subjects can revolt even when you are at war now, also

+200 relation gives them vassal attitude, but i think they can still declare independence then. AFAIK its *your* strength vs theirs, allies not included, and who supports their independenca, is what makes AI decide to declare independence or not.

 

[Freudia]

i doubt other countries have anything to do wether or not a subject revolts. Minor PU subjects can revolt even when you are at war now, also

They can, but they take a -50 modifier in interest for doing so. Or at least that's what the support independence button leads me to believe. It's safer to remain at war than at peace if you intend to keep your union because of this.

 

[PAnZuRiEL]

And despite repeated wars with Burgundy there has been no inheritance event.

Burgundian Inheritance can only fire if France is independent. You need it to fire during one of your wars with France.

 

[The Baus]

One question on the screenshot: How can there be a peace offer with more than 100 value - I've never seen this before.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

You'd want the opposite if you were playing as Norway, Naples, or Mongol Khanate probably is more fair to reset the integration process than not.

I don't see how losing 1000's of monarch points for a war you won is "fair".

Then again, considering how PUs bypass many of the game's limitations otherwise, they're kind of unfair junk in the first place.

 

[StatikShocker]

One question on the screenshot: How can there be a peace offer with more than 100 value - I've never seen this before.

only with casus belli that allow full annexation no matter what. Only two I know of are the Independence War and the Annexation CB the Ottomans can get on Mamluks.

 

[atwix]

only with casus belli that allow full annexation no matter what. Only two I know of are the Independence War and the Annexation CB the Ottomans can get on Mamluks.

edit: seems they changed this, can't full annex anymore

 

[JohnnyAlpha]

Just won my third French Independence War.

I can confirm that Full annexation at 100% WS is no longer possible. It wasn't that they won't accept, it's actually greyed out as an option. Usual "their province value is too great" tooltip or whatever it is.

Made them release Guyenne instead.

 

[atwix]

Just won my third French Independence War.

I can confirm that Full annexation at 100% WS is no longer possible. It wasn't that they won't accept, it's actually greyed out as an option. Usual "their province value is too great" tooltip or whatever it is.

Made them release Guyenne instead.

bah seems they nerfed it then

Thx for trying it out!