Will there be a start date in which historic crusaders are alive?

[Bulan]

Playing Monarch's Journey has made me consider the fact that in the announced start dates for CK3 most of the historical crusaders are not in a place where their future significance is assured or are not even alive yet (in 1066 Urban II is not a priest, Bohemond de Hauteville is a bastard teenager, Godfrey I is a six year old second son, etc) Potentially the game will ship with the name Crusader Kings but we as players will not actually have encounter any of the real life Crusader Kings or kingdoms. Character matters in CK3; will larger than life real characters like Raynald of Chatillon be spawned like Seljuk in CK2, and will historic crusaders from the first crusade be steered to become significant when starting in 1066?

 

[prismaticmarcus]

CKII wasn't at all railroaded and i hope CKIII isn't either. the game's a sandbox and that's what people love about it

 

[Woifee]

I'm not a huge fan of railroading. Espially in a game like CK with thousands of characters and possible interactions. If the game railroads to much the players loses options to act in the game.

 

[J.B.]

I am OK with, and may even immensely enjoy a little bit of "railroading" to support some historical movements, with us able to either allow or disallow through the pre-game options, or to simply later allow them through console commands. They should be optional, however, as Paradox Interactive games are normally about historical start dates losing historical consistency at any point after the time marches on.

 

[LukeCreed13]

I may be OK with a bit of railroading if it's meant to represent something significant in the game. You could consider the Mongol Invasion or the Great Plague a sort of "railroading" the game into history, but you rarely hear someone complaining about them because they're something that "shake things up" and make the campaigns more interesting; about historical people: I'd like to have Seljuk (and Turkic warlords/conquerors) in at some point, but some people may find it too railroad-y and I understand it.

What I think we could see are historical "courtiers" (as the game would call them), important figures that could be useful to your realm without actually altering the map. I'm thinking about people like Dante Alighieri, Albertus Magnus, Dominic de Guzman, Thomas Aquinas (would be cool if Dominicans and Franciscans "spawned" in the game after them - though societies won't be at launch), Thomas Becket, etc.

It would also be cool, in my opinion, to have some events about cultural/economical development in some areas, even if they're just some flavour events with simple modifiers, about things like the spread of "courtly culture" and "courtly love", langue d'oc/d'oil in France, the birth of the sonnet in Italy, the mixture of Christian, Islamic and Jewish cultures in Spain, the German Ostsiedlung, and so on.

 

[Bulan]

Ck2 allowed you to interact with these characters by having start dates in which they were alive. I know the later start dates are less played but narratively they are compelling because of the people and global situations represented in them.

 

[jere8184]

Yeh, the lack of start dates is unfortunate, I'm sure we will get some more in DLC further down the line though.

 

[vandevere]

Ck2 allowed you to interact with these characters by having start dates in which they were alive. I know the later start dates are less played but narratively they are compelling because of the people and global situations represented in them.

I love playing in the 1189 Start because I get to play the Plantagenets, and even the vassals are names I know, the De Clares, the De Montforts, and all the others...

 

[Woifee]

Everything railroaded is an option taken from the player. I prefer the game has mechanics that simulate historic events and allows the player and the AI to follow a similar road with this mechanics. It's acutally not necessary that a guy named Seljuk with 60.000 Soldiers appears out of nowhere and takes persia. Maybe a mechanic that a duke or count can raise a strong army and invade huge junks of land somewhere.

 

[daniloy]

The problem is that a very small minority of players played other starting dates post 1066. Most play 769, 867 or 1066. Also consider that putting start dates from 1066-1337 is a lot of work. Currently, the start dates in CK2 are not well done.

 

[J.B.]

I would enjoy a start date when Saladin and Richard I are alive, and able to compete against each other for their respective factions. An 11 May 1189 AD Third Crusade starting date should be a notable one, and that same start date could also feature optional "railroading" selectable from before the start of the game to lead more neatly into the events of the dreadful Fourth Crusade, or disable that and just allow for usual game randomness to occur.

 

[Rubidium]

Honestly, the start dates I will miss the most are post-Manzikert and post-4th Crusade.

 

[Slayen]

I truly hope they do add a few additional start dates. if not at launch than at least sometime down the line.

I think an Alexiad/First Crusade and a Third Crusade date would be not an unreasonable request.

 

[BuddyLove]

Some of them could be put in earlier start dates similar to how Ragnar is in CK2. . .

 

[Ezumiyr]

Sure, more start dates, why not... But let's start on a good base first.
Before games are released people are always asking for more content already. Let's be patient and see how the game works first.

 

[treb]

Yeh, the lack of start dates is unfortunate, I'm sure we will get some more in DLC further down the line though.

I still weep for my boi Iron century

 

[Masternachos]

I truly hope they do add a few additional start dates. if not at launch than at least sometime down the line.

I think an Alexiad/First Crusade and a Third Crusade date would be not an unreasonable request.

If they tie them into related DLCs, that would work well. Adding a new Mongols bookmark for the nomads DLC, an Alexiad bookmark for the Byzantine DLC, etc. (Especially if they throw the bookmarks in for free in the patch. So if you don't buy the nomads DLC, you still get the Mongols bookmark... you just can't play as the Mongols.)

 

[Fitzjacob]

It's acutally not necessary that a guy named Seljuk with 60.000 Soldiers appears out of nowhere and takes persia. Maybe a mechanic that a duke or count can raise a strong army and invade huge junks of land somewhere.

This sort of thing would be perfect. Not railroading but rather politely sheepdogging. Certain appropriate characters (AI controlled obviously) can get character modifiers similar to child of destiny rather than straight up event troops. Maybe certain Oghuz tribals in the 9th century become prospective conquerors giving them +300% demesne troops and +100% reinforcement rate and unlimited invasion CB within Persia? These modifiers would of course be tied to the initial conqueror only making realms more likely to fall apart. And they would surely be applicable to many other areas (Berbers in Andalusia, Norse in Russia, Magyar in Pannonia etc).

 

[Arko]

No start date during Crusades' era is definitely a no-go for such game.

 

[Rubidium]

Np start date during Crusades' era is definitely a no-go for such game.

1066 is just a couple of decades before the Crusader era; most of the key individuals of the First Crusade are alive, but generally not ruling. So you can't start as Godfrey of Bouillon, Bohemond of Taranto or Raimond of Toulouse, but you can play as their relatives (fathers for Godfrey or Bohemond, brother for Raimond, and note that Bohemond, at least, is set to inherit his father's title as primary heir).