Will I be able to do a world conquest?

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My guess is that if you have the capacity to go to war with the rest of the world all at once you can do it. So my guess would be only a small number of countries would be capable, namely China, the UK, and maybe Russia and the USA. The rest would lack the manpower to sustain such wars. China would be the most obvious choice as they would start with 1/4-1/3 of the world's population. If they successfully modernise you would be able to fight the whole world by yourself.
I mean in theory, yes China can do this. Can you as China's national spirit muster enough industry and resources to supply an army that can fight the whole world? I don't even think that is possible in vanilla Vic 3. Your colonialism and the diplomatic game must be S-tier and the very process to gain those resources will mean you will fight the entire world, BEFORE you have modernized.
 
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I do not think world conquest is possible. Napoleon tried to just conquer Europe and he failed. Let alone a nation with a general more competent than napoleon trying to take it all
 
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Don_Quigleone

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I mean in theory, yes China can do this. Can you as China's national spirit muster enough industry and resources to supply an army that can fight the whole world? I don't even think that is possible in vanilla Vic 3. Your colonialism and the diplomatic game must be S-tier and the very process to gain those resources will mean you will fight the entire world, BEFORE you have modernized.
The thing about China is that due to sheer size, you don't need to be especially industrialised to be able to swarm everyone else with massive armies. You don't need colonies or advanced industries to sustain such an industry, as your military, even if per capita a quarter the size of every other power, will still be the largest on earth. As China you will start with masses of territory, so you don't need more to access resources, and the largest "accepted culture" on earth, so you'll never need more people either. European countries, by contrast, will have relatively tiny "accepted culture" to access, limiting the size of their military. The main issue will be your anemic literacy and technology.

If you take a defensive posture for the first half of the game, and hard tech(getting as many universities as possible, and relying on tech spread) while maintaining a pretty Conservative government, it should be possible to build a formidable war machine that you can use to conquer all of eurasia, and then blitz the whole world in the latter half. Essentially you'll play like Russia, only more so.
 
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The thing about China is that due to sheer size, you don't need to be especially industrialised to be able to swarm everyone else with massive armies. You don't need colonies or advanced industries to sustain such an industry, as your military, even if per capita a quarter the size of every other power, will still be the largest on earth. As China you will start with masses of territory, so you don't need more to access resources, and the largest "accepted culture" on earth, so you'll never need more people either. European countries, by contrast, will have relatively tiny "accepted culture" to access, limiting the size of their military. The main issue will be your anemic literacy and technology.

If you take a defensive posture for the first half of the game, and hard tech(getting as many universities as possible, and relying on tech spread) while maintaining a pretty Conservative government, it should be possible to build a formidable war machine that you can use to conquer all of eurasia, and then blitz the whole world in the latter half. Essentially you'll play like Russia, only more so.
That seems like a very superficial reading of how Vic 3 works. Here are five obstacles to what you propose.
  1. Lack of Money and Capacities = Just the process of getting to universities is very costly. Can pseudo-medieval China afford it? Also, China suffers from a massive Bureaucracy deficit due to its large population. You will lose an immense amount of Tax money which compounds your financial problems as you are trying to scale with universities.
  2. Powerful Interest Groups = Now as you get universities, you are empowering the Intelligencia which will start to cause internal problems in your Conservative government and society. The more you boost your universities, the stronger the Intelligencia gets. As they gain strength, they will demand more and more political concessions as well as material goods. As you fix your Bureaucracy deficit, related Interest Groups will also gain strength.
  3. Dangerous Ideas Selected Randomly = Tech spread itself is also a threat. As you gain Society techs randomly, your population will gain all the benefits and costs of Nationalism or Marxism. Political thoughts that were not even ACTIVE in 1836 will be widespread by 1870.
  4. War Radicalism = Imagine that you are beginning your massive war in Eurasia and even if you do well against British India or Russia, you lose a substantial amount of Pops. It's not just a numbers game where you can ignore that because you are China. Your remaining Pops will be increasingly radicalized. What you suggest seems to be a great path to a revolution at the start of the 20th century.
  5. Population of Powerful Rivals = Lastly, you overestimate how much population you have in China vs your enemies. In 1850, Qing China had around 430 million people. In 1928, the population had only increased to about 475 million people. In comparison, the Russian Empire in 1897 had 125 million people. British India alone had 250 million people in 1900. So the British (with India) and the Russians have somewhere close to 80% of your manpower and both will be much more industrialized, richer nations with much better technology.
There is no way you can reliably blitz the whole world.....if the Vic 3 developers build the system they claim they are building.
 
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  1. That seems like a very superficial reading of how Vic 3 works. Just the process of getting to universities is very costly. Can pseudo-medieval China afford it? Also, China suffers from a massive Bureaucracy deficit due to its large population. You will lose an immense amount of Tax money which compounds your financial problems as you are trying to scale with universities.
  2. So that is the money aspect. Now as you get universities, you are empowering the Intelligencia which will start to cause internal problems in your Conservative government and society. The more you boost your universities, the stronger the Intelligencia gets. As they gain strength, they will demand more and more political concessions as well as material goods.
  3. Tech spread itself is also a threat. As you gain Society techs randomly, your population will gain all the benefits and costs of Nationalism or Marxism. Political thoughts that were not even ACTIVE in 1836 will be widespread by 1870.
  4. Imagine that you are beginning your massive war in Eurasia and even if you do well against British India or Russia, you lose a substantial amount of Pops. It's not just a numbers game where you can ignore that because you are China. Your remaining Pops will be increasingly radicalized. What you suggest seems to be a great path to a revolution at the start of the 20th century.
  5. Lastly, you overestimate how much population you have in China vs your enemies. In 1850, Qing China had around 430 million people. In 1928, the population had only increased to about 475 million people. In comparison, the Russian Empire in 1897 had 125 million people. British India alone had 250 million people in 1900. So the British (with India) and the Russians have somewhere close to 80% of your manpower and both will be much more industrialized, richer nations with much better technology.
There is no way you can reliably blitz the whole world.....if the Vic 3 developers build the system they claim they are building.
I'm not saying it will be easy, just that due to potential manpower and economy size it may be the only country where a WC is even *possible*. No other country in game can hope to have even a fraction of China's size. But the first 50 years of a China playthrough will likely be difficult.

A few quibbles :
1. We don't know how easy it will be to keep intellectuals satisfied, and due to the size of your country, you can maintain more Universities then anyone else while keeping intellectuals as a percentage of your population quite small. So the intellectual faction might not end up being especially influential.
2. While you're right about china's population in our timeline, the same is unlikely to be true with a player lead China. Indeed if a player chose to pursue policies that increased birthrates while avoiding the civil wars that happened historically, you could very easily see a scenario where China doubles or triples its population, as happened in Russia during the same period. Your population advantage could get even bigger, with China having almost half the global population, even more so if you acquire neighbouring uncivilised countries. With the size of your population, migration should render controlling such regions to be much easier.
 
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The thing about China is that due to sheer size, you don't need to be especially industrialised to be able to swarm everyone else with massive armies.
I'm sure raising a massive army and throwing them into a meatgrinder war against better-armed foes will have no consequences whatsoever. Never mind that there was an entire dev diary specifically about the consequences of this situation. They're probably bluffing.
 
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I'm not going to say it will never happen because I know better than to underestimate our playerbase.

I will say though, if nobody ever manages it I think that's perfectly fine and we are definitely not aiming to accommodate world conquest or make an achievement for it.
 
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I'm not saying it will be easy, just that due to potential manpower and economy size it may be the only country where a WC is even *possible*. No other country in game can hope to have even a fraction of China's size. But the first 50 years of a China playthrough will likely be difficult.

A few quibbles :
1. We don't know how easy it will be to keep intellectuals satisfied, and due to the size of your country, you can maintain more Universities then anyone else while keeping intellectuals as a percentage of your population quite small. So the intellectual faction might not end up being especially influential.
2. While you're right about china's population in our timeline, the same is unlikely to be true with a player lead China. Indeed if a player chose to pursue policies that increased birthrates while avoiding the civil wars that happened historically, you could very easily see a scenario where China doubles or triples its population, as happened in Russia during the same period. Your population advantage could get even bigger, with China having almost half the global population, even more so if you acquire neighbouring uncivilised countries. With the size of your population, migration should render controlling such regions to be much easier.
1. Most of your population is poor farmers. They are not even politically active (until later when tech spread can activate powerful ideologies that could be destablizing) in 1836. Your IGs will be the Armed Forces, the Landowners, and if you pursue the Universities, the Intelligencia. It's not 3% of your Pops that would problem you, it is like a third of your Interest Groups that's the problem I speak of.
2. Growing your population faster than what China historically went through can only be done through 3 methods, increase the birth rate and decrease the mortality rate and massive immigration. The former is pretty maxed out in pre-industrial societies. You can do plenty of moves to maintain the birth rate as you industrialize but you can't really increase it more than it already is in 1836.
3. To decrease the mortality rate means better technology, it means more industrialization, it means more social systems and more Institutions and more Laws, and smarter Pops and richer Pops and more political Pops. It means an increasing variety of Interest Groups. You just opened the Pandora's box you were trying to not open.
4. Immigration on a scale that actually matters to China would still mean making it an attractive place to move to. That means liberalization of the society, more freedoms and more rights, less concentration of political power, less autocracy, more industrial goods access, more education, etc, etc. You still get the same problems as decreasing the mortality rate gives you.

I really doubt that the population advantage will be greater than it was in history WITHOUT also giving up the advantages that you need for a world conquest run.
 
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I'm not going to say it will never happen because I know better than to underestimate our playerbase.

I will say though, if nobody ever manages it I think that's perfectly fine and we are definitely not aiming to accommodate world conquest or make an achievement for it.
Is it safe to say that, unlike older Paradox games, you are deliberately accounting for factors that make world conquest impossible in real life (say logistics and cost and war exhaustion and attrition and rebellions) and making sure there is a reasonable representation in Victoria 3?
 
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Having seen a few 'speed-forming' runs for EU4, I feel we must probably distinguish 'World Conquest' and 'World Conquest plus survival for x years' as targets.

I am pretty sure someone will find a way to cheese diplo plays and army wackiness into world conquest. It'll be strange, but it'll work. I am not as sure they'll be able to hold together the massive radicalized population clamouring for independence.
 
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Having seen a few 'speed-forming' runs for EU4, I feel we must probably distinguish 'World Conquest' and 'World Conquest plus survival for x years' as targets.

I am pretty sure someone will find a way to cheese diplo plays and army wackiness into world conquest. It'll be strange, but it'll work. I am not as sure they'll be able to hold together the massive radicalized population clamouring for independence.
It seems like a lesser problem to me. You don't have micro for army units so no more cheese strats of luring your enemies across a river, up the mountain into your army in the dead of winter all while you scorched earth all around your mountain. Or no more naval cheese strats of conquering Constantinople as Byzantium because you blocked all the Ottoman fleets so their armies are stuck in Turkey.

The AI can much better analyze and handle fighting wars. That is a good thing BTW.

You also don't have diplo cheese strats where you peace out nations, one by one, squeezing each loser for max gains. No more timing of wars or using coalitions to block out wars you don't want. Now there is only one war at a time that resolves all Diplomatic plays ongoing at start of the war and every nation's demands are explictly on the table BEFORE the war starts.

The AI can much better analyze diplomatic demands and the balance of power situation. That is also a good thing BTW.
 
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I feel that allot of people in this thread have a weird definition of the word Possible/Impossible, like many mention stuff like nationalism and logistics, but none of the actually make it impossible, they make it absurdly hard, sure, but at a fundamental level conquering the world does not go against the laws of physics so it can be done, ergo is possible, a thing being impossible in this context would be something akin to the game shutting down and deleting yuo save should you attain 99% of the world thereby rendering it impossible, there are no mechanics in the game so far that make it impossible, only hard/extremely unlikely.
 
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I feel that allot of people in this thread have a weird definition of the word Possible/Impossible, like many mention stuff like nationalism and logistics, but none of the actually make it impossible, they make it absurdly hard, sure, but at a fundamental level conquering the world does not go against the laws of physics so it can be done, ergo is possible, a thing being impossible in this context would be something akin to the game shutting down and deleting yuo save should you attain 99% of the world thereby rendering it impossible, there are no mechanics in the game so far that make it impossible, only hard/extremely unlikely.
It's actually possible that due to how quickly you can conquer land it's impossible to complete a world conquest in 100 years. There's also the possibility that holding all that land together is impossible and people rebel before you can complete it. It could be very hard or it may legitimately be impossible depending on things work.
 
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Victoria II is in 1836-1936.
Historically the closest that an empire was close to achieve a world conquest was the British Empire in 1920 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_empires).
How people say that is inaccurate to do a world conquest? Based on real history I don't think so.

I'm not going to say it will never happen because I know better than to underestimate our playerbase.

I will say though, if nobody ever manages it I think that's perfectly fine and we are definitely not aiming to accommodate world conquest or make an achievement for it.
To me this is good.
So Victoria 3 will not be design to a world conquest, but if someone achieve this, good for him. So maybe will be mechanics to prevent this but not to detain.
 
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Victoria II is in 1836-1936.
Historically the closest that an empire was close to achieve a world conquest was the British Empire in 1920 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_empires).
How people say that is inaccurate to do a world conquest? Based on real history I don't think so.


To me this is good.
So Victoria 3 will not be design to a world conquest, but if someone achieve this, good for him. So maybe will be mechanics to prevent this but not to detain.
Like I said before, if the idea of WC is to have every body in a single market, then I guess it’s easier than installing puppets or downright conquering everyone.
 
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