AFAIK Gent, Ieperen and Brugge never were de jure or de facto part of east francia or HRE between 867 and 1453. This is annoying if you want to play as the count of flanders.
Why is Flanders considered de jure part of the HRE?
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Because - at least in the setup of the most recent patches - everything has to be part of an empire. And because kingdoms can't be split between empires.
Because that way, the whole of Frisia would have to be a part of the Empire of Francia. Which if anything makes even less sense.
For reasons just explained to you... A kingdom can't be split between empires. Flanders is DJ part of Frisia, and Frisia is in HRE.
Yes, it is because the game works that way. Flanders is part of the de jure Kingdom of Frisia. which is a de jure part of the HRE.
edit: lol, didn't see it was already explainded
edit: lol, didn't see it was already explainded
It's considered de jure part of the HRE because it's considered de jure part of the Kingdom of Frisia.
Bah. Emu'd.
Bah. Emu'd.
My personal preference then would be to reduce the size of Frisia. It contains many territories the Frisians never inhabitated AFAIK.
The Frisians did not inhabit, but they did rule over the region at the height of their kingdom
I would use that same map to argue that Bourgogne, Artois, Ieperen, Gent, Brugge should be part of France, and Brabant and Hainait part of Lotharingia.
You could change it so that Flanders becomes a de jure part of France, but having Flanders under Frisia makes more sense, especially in the TOG start date. Even the names Flanders and Flemish are derived from the Frisian language.
The whole "kingdom of Frisia" is nonsense - most of its lands were just ordinary HRE territory. Some count of Holland even was HRE emperor briefly.
They got their kingdom because of the Dutch lobby among the P'dox players
They got their kingdom because of the Dutch lobby among the P'dox players
I can see why Paradox decided to put Flanders in Frisia (the game's Dutch-culture de jure kingdom) but I do find it annoying that the HRE will declare war on France for (usually) Ghent as its opening move at the start of every game. This is especially frustrating in the sense that Flanders did not join the HRE until the reign of Charles V, which is a century after CK II ends.
I am certainly very tempted to move Flanders to France.
I am certainly very tempted to move Flanders to France.
That's basically what I'm advocating as well. My guess as to why they created the kingdom of Frisia is that the devs wanted a goal for the Dutch-cultured characters to strive for. Interestingly, before they split the kingdom of Germany the de jure split between France and the HRE was more historical.
Flanders should be part of the kingdom of France. It was de jure in our world, part of France.
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I believe that the current situation is just fine as the ruler of Flanders is dutch and for that reason (culture wise) closer to the German HRE than France however several counts are French and arefor that reason closer to the French what makes Flanders a constantly contested territory between the 2 what adds some interesting game-play mechanics and balance (more French-HRE wars instead of France VS Spanish Muslims and HRE vs East European Pagans).
As a test one should first add Flanders to France and see how much it will effect the world.
As a test one should first add Flanders to France and see how much it will effect the world.
Just remove the duchies of Flanders and Brabant from the Kingdom of Frisia and make a new Kingdom of Flanders, with the former part of the HRE and the latter part of Francia.
This would be worse. A kingdom of Flanders would be absolutly ahistorical. Why not simply make Flanders part of France? This is how it was historically. The border between Brabant and Flanders, was mostly the border of the HRE and France. So to put both together wouldn't be good.
There's no mechanical reason that every single Kingdom must be a part of an Empire, so it should just be excised from the HRE.
For that matter, there's no mechanical reason all Duchies should be a part of a Kingdom either.
For that matter, there's no mechanical reason all Duchies should be a part of a Kingdom either.