Why is everything so... cartoony?

[AlfredMV]

Complexity /=/ depth
Historical maps /=/ best or only option
Bad user interface /=/ depth
Hiding information /=/ depth
Low graphical fidelity /=/ serious
Easy to understand models /=/ toys
Yes generals did and do use models as representations throughout all of history. Rommel would have loved to have the hearts of iron map.

 

[Mabs]

What games are those first two? War in the east and...? They look intriguing.

It's not like one has to choose which one to like, but rather try to enjoy all of them.

right click pic
"search google for image"

drive on moscow apparently

 

[jaredstanko]

right click pic
"search google for image"

drive on moscow apparently

90 on meta critic with 4 reviews, and a lot of great user reviews. looks like a lot of fun but basically unheard of.

time to go give some indie devs some money, it seems...

 

[rjohansen]

There are lot of good (gameplay) improvements in HOI4 compared to HOI3 in my opinion, but the map and graphics it's not one of them. I like some of the UI and the leader portraits, but I also absolutely hate the map, the toy soldiers and the fancy neon graphics - too me, it looks more sci-fi than WW2.

I do have hopes for either DLCs or mods to fix these things though, so it doesn't put me off buying. And normal counters. I know the NATO symbols are in, but counters are not. My biggest concern so far is actually the lack of an OOB - I think that might be hard to mod in? So the only hope for this is a DLC.

 

[Modestus]

Yeah, that's right. Keep on complaining.

This thread is essentially about the appearance of the map I have every right to voice my opinion about the appearance of the map.


I did not say I disliked the game in fact most of it sounds good.


You basically told me to shut up in a thread discussing the appearance of the map, who are you to tell me to shut up?


I believe the map is directly related to the EUIV and CKII maps adjusted to create a more WWII appearance, at its core it is a simplified representation of a 3D world with large models to represent Divisions. An all too common method used by many developers to represent both a game world and game units, you can almost see Paradox beating the square EU IV\ CK II world into the round hole of the HOI IV world.


I should note that I consider the HOI III map to be very poor and the other two maps I posted to be examples of maps of a very high standard, both are artistically superior to the HOI IV map though you may not like them and prefer something in 3D.


There is nothing intrinsically wrong with 3D but its far from being the best choice to show the movement of a large number of units, across a wide area , engaged in numerous actions that the player must monitor, I cannot see how it will not turn into an almighty mess.


The day night cycle is just off the Richter scale when it comes to a poor design choice and has to be one of the most ugly effects I have ever seen for a game map, the fact that its almost completely irrelevant for game play suggests that it was simple done for the wow factor, wow that is really annoying how do you turn it off, click.


Of course nothing I say is going to change anything and nor do I care at this stage but if there is a thread on the appearance of the map or on Counters I will as is my right say what I think and you can respectively disagree with me.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

My biggest concern so far is actually the lack of an OOB - I think that might be hard to mod in? So the only hope for this is a DLC.

I absolutely don't know the answer to this, but I am going to assume not. This seems like an engine thing, and pivotal to how the combat system works. They have customizable combat groups now, rather than a traditional OOB system. I'd be surprised if it was something you could mod in a defines file or something.

I think it would be strange (and from a coding perspective, needlessly complex) if you could somehow switch between what they have now, and an OOB system. You'd assume the AI algorithms are written for one and not the other.

On-topic:

The day night cycle is just off the Richter scale when it comes to a poor design choice and has to be one of the most ugly effects I have ever seen for a game map, the fact that its almost completely irrelevant for game play suggests that it was simple done for the wow factor, wow that is really annoying how do you turn it off, click.

100% agreed. It's totally bizarre, looks awful, and cannot possibly be of any real use. I am glad it can be turned off.

 

[Zaku]

My biggest concern so far is actually the lack of an OOB - I think that might be hard to mod in? So the only hope for this is a DLC.

There is OOB in the game, it's just less detailed then it was in hoi3. (And less frustrating I hope.)

Look at the top right corner. There are two fronts, each with two armies. The French front armies with 2 and 13 divisions, and the Polish front armies with 4 and 11.

 

[GsusNSV]

100% agreed. It's totally bizarre, looks awful, and cannot possibly be of any real use. I am glad it can be turned off.

While I agree that on this speed shown it is at first a bit annoying, I want to damp this "not of any real use". Combat penalty during the night is still a thing and to know if it is day or night to start a fight seem in my eyes rather important.

 

[Zaku]

While I agree that on this speed shown it is at first a bit annoying, I want to damp this "not of any real use". Combat penalty during the night is still a thing and to know if it is day or night to start a fight seem in my eyes rather important.

Also the map looks really pretty in the night imo. I don't like the way it changes though, the day night cycle should be a bit more gradual and not a black/white line going around the globe.

 

[Modestus]

While I agree that on this speed shown it is at first a bit annoying, I want to damp this "not of any real use". Combat penalty during the night is still a thing and to know if it is day or night to start a fight seem in my eyes rather important.

Indeed there is a combat penalty as there should be but I presume there are better tools to coordinate the start of an offensive then the player waiting until what is effectively a large shadow moves off to the west and once your offensive starts your not going to be stopping because its night.


The best time to start an attack is around dawn very quickly after that your into the normal day night cycle and it becomes almost irrelevant to the player what time of day it is you will just keep pushing forward.



The air combat must also have a tool that can tell your planes to operate during the day or night, I cannot imagine I need to manually send my night fighters up every time a shadow rolls in from the east.


I suspect most people will turn it off.

 

[bestmajor]

Not too cartoonish, but Franco is way way too old for 1937.

 

[FUregistration]

Of course nothing I say is going to change anything and nor do I care at this stage but if there is a thread on the appearance of the map or on Counters I will as is my right say what I think and you can respectively disagree with me.

No dissidents allowed.
I find it funny that even when I'm actually defending the developers there's a rain of Respectfully Disagree's on my posts, they don't even read them, its already automatic ahahah!
Conform or face the argument-less rain of pointless posts and the RD Police.

 

[Zaku]

No dissidents allowed.
I find it funny that even when I'm actually defending the developers there's a rain of Respectfully Disagree's on my posts, they don't even read them, its already automatic ahahah!
Conform or face the argument-less rain of pointless posts and the RD Police.

It's because your posts are often arrogant and insulting and not because you have an opinion.

 

[Kapitalisti]

It's because your posts are often arrogant and instulting and not because you have an opinion.

Basic internet procedure:
"I think this change sucks, it's totally casual and aimed at nine year old kids and everyone who likes it is stupid! *company X* is a sell-out!"
<people disagreeing>
"OMG, you're just sad fanboys, I have a right to voice my opinion as loudly and obnoxiously as possible!"

 

[Aries666]

So if people stopped bothering with counter arguments because of threads like this, and that same people choose to respond with purposeless remarks on threads like this... you see where I'm getting...

Do you see those CAPITALIZED letters in my post? I guess my indirect criticism on some members of this forum really makes some people get moody...
And what is funnier in all this, I made a couple of posts defending the right to the op to post his mind in the forum while disagreeing with him on some things, and yet I'm accused of the opposite...
Logic isn't your strength but I won't hold that on you, after all one could almost say that its a human feature.

And yet more insults, clearly logic is one of your strengths...

 

[Razor]

I agree with the OP. The artwork does not really give me the WW2 war room feeling I would like to see. But that's me and I will happily play the game anyway.

Ok. You've read it! Now is the time to click the "Respectfully Disagree" button, if you haven't already done so

 

[Hiiri]

right click pic
"search google for image"

drive on moscow apparently

Thanks. =)

 

[Wallebever]

i really cant see how the game is cartoony at all, its the sexiest map ive seen and the countries doesnt look as small as they do in eu4 if you look at italy it looks so little in eu4. And i absolutely love the texture, its not cartoony at all. Can anyone please explain to me what you think is cartoony about it?

 

[Daelyn75]

This thread is essentially about the appearance of the map I have every right to voice my opinion about the appearance of the map.


I did not say I disliked the game in fact most of it sounds good.


You basically told me to shut up in a thread discussing the appearance of the map, who are you to tell me to shut up?


I believe the map is directly related to the EUIV and CKII maps adjusted to create a more WWII appearance, at its core it is a simplified representation of a 3D world with large models to represent Divisions. An all too common method used by many developers to represent both a game world and game units, you can almost see Paradox beating the square EU IV\ CK II world into the round hole of the HOI IV world.


I should note that I consider the HOI III map to be very poor and the other two maps I posted to be examples of maps of a very high standard, both are artistically superior to the HOI IV map though you may not like them and prefer something in 3D.


There is nothing intrinsically wrong with 3D but its far from being the best choice to show the movement of a large number of units, across a wide area , engaged in numerous actions that the player must monitor, I cannot see how it will not turn into an almighty mess.


The day night cycle is just off the Richter scale when it comes to a poor design choice and has to be one of the most ugly effects I have ever seen for a game map, the fact that its almost completely irrelevant for game play suggests that it was simple done for the wow factor, wow that is really annoying how do you turn it off, click.


Of course nothing I say is going to change anything and nor do I care at this stage but if there is a thread on the appearance of the map or on Counters I will as is my right say what I think and you can respectively disagree with me.

We've all voiced our opinions on the game. There are things that everyone would like to be tweaked a little bit, or have decided to live with because we like the game overall. So you decide to complain over and over, despite few people agreeing with you. Yeah, we get it - you like the old map. About a year and a half to two years after screen shots, you are either bringing this up again, or are needlessly complaining about it over and over in this thread.

The map cannot be changed now, and so you will have to live with it or don't play it.

"You basically told me to shut up in a thread discussing the appearance of the map, who are you to tell me to shut up?" I never said to shut up, I said "Please, by all means if you don't like what you see, feel free to play the other war games and forget about HOI IV."

 

[Secret Master]

What's important is that we are debating the map and OOB and not sitting in Stalingrad as part of the 6th Army on February 2nd of 1943 waiting for Paulus to surrender while we freeze.

As silly as Internet debates can be, there's always something worse.