Why does a CoT relocate?

[unmerged(29905)]

I'm playing AGCEEP 1.42 with Brandenburg. Since I start with a border to Mecklenburg and have a very bad economy, I decide to "liberate" the CoT upon start of the game.
I DOW their ally Bremen and invade both Bremen and Mecklenburg. After 2 short sieges I make peace with Bremen for 300d and annex Mecklenburg outright. Great monthly income boost! All is well for a few years while I annex Hanover and Bremen in the next war and buy Kuestrin from Teutonic Order.
Then, in may 1429 disaster strucks: the CoT is relocated to Copenhagen, wrecking my economy! Why does this happen and how can I prevent it? Is it cause I'm such a small country? Is it cause of my BB?

 

[Duke of Wellington]

In that particular case the move is due an event shifting the COT. AFAIK theres no way to stop it . Normally they can move due to lack of competition. E.g. when 1 or 2 nations only are trading in it.

 

[unmerged(49083)]

Danish Event "The Sound Due" provides a CoT for Sjaelland.

 

[unmerged(51378)]

If you're really eager to have it to yourself, reload and wait till Denmark takes the B choice. It's pretty fair as they shouldn't get a CoT but rather extra tax from the Sound Due anyway.

 

[unmerged(45766)]

If you're really eager to have it to yourself, reload and wait till Denmark takes the B choice. It's pretty fair as they shouldn't get a CoT but rather extra tax from the Sound Due anyway.

CoTs represent control of the trade of an area. If in EU2 there's really one place that justifies having a CoT localized in a province, it's Sjaelland. For the Danes, controlling the entry into the Baltic Sea is equal to controlling all the baltic trade. A CoT is greatly justified in that case.

 

[unmerged(51378)]

CoTs represent control of the trade of an area. If in EU2 there's really one place that justifies having a CoT localized in a province, it's Sjaelland. For the Danes, controlling the entry into the Baltic Sea is equal to controlling all the baltic trade. A CoT is greatly justified in that case.

I disagree. Sound Due was a tax rather than making it a center of trade. It's the same deal the Svealand shouldn't get a CoT either.

 

[unmerged(45766)]

I disagree. Sound Due was a tax rather than making it a center of trade. It's the same deal the Svealand shouldn't get a CoT either.

Not only a tax, but a heavy tax. And sinking those refusing to pay or enemy ships. As a matter of fact, it adequately depicts a CoT : taxes perceived from those trading in the CoT, and ability to embargo merchants of a country.
CoTs are just that : money from tolls, and ability to embargo other countries.


BTW, FYI:

Sound Dues
In 1429 King Eric of Pomerania introduced the Sound Dues (Danish: Øresundstolden, Swedish: Öresundstullen.) All foreign ships passing through the strait had to make a stop in Elsinore and pay a toll to the Danish Crown (regardless if the cargo was en route to or from Denmark or not). Refusing to pay was not an option; if a ship refused to stop, cannons in both Elsinore and Helsingborg would open fire and sink it. In 1567, the toll was changed into a tax on the cargo of the ship, thus providing three times more revenue. In order to avoid ships simply taking a different route, tolls were also collected at the two other Danish straits, the Great Belt and the Little Belt.

The Sound Dues remained the most important source of income for the Danish Crown for several centuries, thus making Danish kings relatively independent of Denmark's Privy Council and aristocracy. Since 1645 Swedish ships were relieved from the toll. After 1658, when the Danish possessions on the Scandinavian peninsula were ceded to Sweden, the toll could not be enforced as well as before.

The Copenhagen Convention of 1857 abolished the dues and made all the Danish Straits an International waterway free to all military and commercial shipping.

 

[unmerged(51378)]

Not only a tax, but a heavy tax. And sinking those refusing to pay or enemy ships. As a matter of fact, it adequately depicts a CoT : taxes perceived from those trading in the CoT, and ability to embargo merchants of a country.
CoTs are just that : money from tolls, and ability to embargo other countries.


BTW, FYI:

I disagree; A Center of Trade is a Center of Trade. Not center of tolls. If there should be a CoT, then the CoT should be removed if someone but Denmark owns Skåne. And how is taxes represented in game but by... taxe incomes?

 

[unmerged(45766)]

I disagree; A Center of Trade is a Center of Trade. Not center of tolls. If there should be a CoT, then the CoT should be removed if someone but Denmark owns Skåne. And how is taxes represented in game but by... taxe incomes?

All income in the game comes from various taxes :
- census taxes, yearly
- taxes on population, as in tax income
- taxes on production
- taxes on internal trade (trade taxes)
- taxes on merchants present in the local CoT, or tolls

Your argument is then irrelevent.

Venice has a CoT because it controled most of the eastern med's trade. Genoa has a CoT because it controlled trade from a vast area too. Andalusia gets a CoT because Spain controlled all trade to and from its colonies in America. It's all a matter of control : seeing the Centers of Trade as physical places where merchants from everywhere came to trake, akin to marcketplaces, is historically wrong.
With the Sound Dues, Denmark was in a position to control the trade of the Baltic more adequately than the remnants of the Hanse. And so is fully justified in receiving the CoT.

And since we're debating AGCEEP matter, further disagreement on your part should be ported to the adequate subforum. They may have had many discussions about that point when they made the change.

 

[unmerged(51378)]

All income in the game comes from various taxes :
- census taxes, yearly
- taxes on population, as in tax income
- taxes on production
- taxes on internal trade (trade taxes)
- taxes on merchants present in the local CoT, or tolls

Your argument is then irrelevent.

Venice has a CoT because it controled most of the eastern med's trade. Genoa has a CoT because it controlled trade from a vast area too. Andalusia gets a CoT because Spain controlled all trade to and from its colonies in America. It's all a matter of control : seeing the Centers of Trade as physical places where merchants from everywhere came to trake, akin to marcketplaces, is historically wrong.
With the Sound Dues, Denmark was in a position to control the trade of the Baltic more adequately than the remnants of the Hanse. And so is fully justified in receiving the CoT.

And since we're debating AGCEEP matter, further disagreement on your part should be ported to the adequate subforum. They may have had many discussions about that point when they made the change.

Still, Sevilla wasn't only about control. Almost all goods from the spanish colonies were taken to Sevilla and some to La Coruña, so a CoT is greatly adjusted there.

EDIT: I have hard to believe that you could control any trade in Vienna...

 

[ConjurerDragon]

In that particular case the move is due an event shifting the COT. AFAIK theres no way to stop it . Normally they can move due to lack of competition. E.g. when 1 or 2 nations only are trading in it.

There already is a way: Destroy Denmark before the event fires - no denmark, no danish event.

If my suggested modification is included in 1.43 there will be another way - make sure that island where Denmark has it´s capital is controlled by someone else than denmark, because the new trigger has control of that isle as condition.

 

[unmerged(29905)]

Thanks for all the answers. I started fresh, still annexed Mecklenburg but only vassalized Hanover, Bremen and Holstein this time (BB...)
My research will definitely take a big hit, but I guess I have to let the CoT go