Why do planes still teleport and other Air War issues

[fuser312]

I agree with the op, and I don't get the arguments which just says it can't be done. It obviously can be as it was done in previous games. And as per micro, I am forced to micro in the current setting when trying to defend a airzone. Few examples :

I am USSR, defending my airspace, Germany can easily avoid everything enroute and bomb Moscow because I am contesteing the border regions and ideally this should have been enough but no for some reason 1000 german bombers can magically appear over Moscow. Ok, I will leave some planes for Moscow region, but they all are gone now. So basically I need to have planes in every region within enemy range and constantly looking for where I am getting bombed at rather than creating a defensive line in air and trying to stop the enemy going through.

Another example, I am Germany, I am starting Barbarossa I leave a good number of fighters in the west to defend, I build AA radars and everything to contes the skies in France and low countries but they all are useless as allied bombers in droves can come above Berlin. Once again I constantly have to keep looking where I am getting bombed and keep scrambling my fighters for that region rather than leave them be with periodic checks while they contest the skies in France and low countries.

This just doesnt only kills immersion but also takes out a legitimate and interesting part of air warfare. We really need to think the whole abstrraction/micro thing without going too much into micro we also should not be qucik in disregarding actual things that were integral part of the ww2.

For example will it be really worth to just teleport submarines in their assigned regions?, again I think not because it kills an interesting part of gameplay and immersion. Air warfare as it currently stands is just too simplistic and devoid of much strategical operational decisions apart from assign these numbers of factories on these planes.

Final point, please give us Air Generals, why we don't have one.

 

[myzael]

Wasn't most interception done near the bomber's target anyway? I seem to recall statements like that, I'd appreciate if somebody could link sources proving or disproving that.

 

[GrandVezir]

If you actually read my original post (another novel concept perhaps), I have specifically stated that I expected the system to be bare bones at release and to be polished over the next 4-5 years. So a 2014 dev comment is not useful in that context because the game has evolved quite a bit since then. For example, that dev diary sates air wings don't have the experience mechanic which was changed. The Naval rework is the another example of a significant and positive overhaul.

Secondly, I never said that I wanted to "micromanage air wings" so that comment is irrelevant anyway. As stated thrice already, the system works exactly like it currently does with the OPTION of prioritizing a specific tough battle if and only IF you feel the need to. Like taking a heavily defended London or Stalingrad etc.

And there is such an option: attach airwings directly to the attacking/defending army in the specific tough battle.

You just don't like how it works. Fair enough. But it's not as if you can't focus your airpower on a particular battle.

 

[Quantum_AI]

And there is such an option: attach airwings directly to the attacking/defending army in the specific tough battle.

I have already responded to that exact same point from you on the previous page. No point just going around in circles so let me just link it for you again:

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...nd-other-air-war-issues.1440098/post-27067549

 

[Louella]

I build AA radars and everything to contes the skies in France and low countries but they all are useless as allied bombers in droves can come above Berlin

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/45/303bg-moleworth-target-for-today.jpg

This is from a real briefing to an American bomber group based in the UK, to attack a target 150km N of Berlin,arriving and departing over Denmark, avoiding the vast majority of interceptor aircraft based in France, Benelux, and most of Germany.

Wasn't most interception done near the bomber's target anyway?

Pretty much, because interceptor aircraft use a lot of fuel and time to reach altitude, and have limited endurance once they're in the air. So you hold them until you have a good idea where the bombers are heading for, so they don't run out of fuel, or get caught on the ground refuelling/rearming.
Meanwhile, diversionary raids, and course changes by the bomber force, to try and get interceptors deployed to the wrong places.

 

[GrandVezir]

I have already responded to that exact same point from you on the previous page. No point just going around in circles so let me just link it for you again:

Since we're recycling:

You just don't like how it works. Fair enough. But it's not as if you can't focus your airpower on a particular battle.

 

[Tsavong]

You can literally have 10000 german fighters patrolling day/night over southern england , no presence of british fighters left and british bombers still starting from southern england to bomb berlin.
Idk how someone can say that there is not something off with that...

 

[Tsavong]

While partially discussed above any pathing-logic is something that PDS has explicitly expressed to be generally bad. While I'm not a game-developer I'm experienced enough in mathematics and computational complexity to understand why. It's simple enough with a small set of points but it's a NP-hard problem which generally doesn't work well with real-time applications as complexity grows.

But its in the game already:
1. the supply system works this way and it is done with much more zones then air-zones

2. the game already checks what i want to check in the air if you try to do paratroop drops.

 

[RELee]

If you actually read my original post (another novel concept perhaps), I have specifically stated that I expected the system to be bare bones at release and to be polished over the next 4-5 years. So a 2014 dev comment is not useful in that context because the game has evolved quite a bit since then. For example, that dev diary sates air wings don't have the experience mechanic which was changed. The Naval rework is the another example of a significant and positive overhaul.

Secondly, I never said that I wanted to "micromanage air wings" so that comment is irrelevant anyway. As stated thrice already, the system works exactly like it currently does with the OPTION of prioritizing a specific tough battle if and only IF you feel the need to. Like taking a heavily defended London or Stalingrad etc.

Sorry if it seemed I was picking you out of the crowd. I was not. I just have noticed a lot of threads and posts regarding plane teleportation and thought it might be helpful to search out the developer's posts explaining the decision to switch over as well as the post describing their decision-making process.

The snark is always a free addition provided by my own personality and does not reflect the views of Paradox or its employees. (my attempt at a personality disclaimer)

 

[oLii96x]

Hoi3 air system was much better in some regards. you could assign planes to PROVINCES and not pointless random regions that are much too big to gain efficiency...

 

[Zauberelefant]

That's such flawed logic. You could say the same for the army. You can move individual divisions but you cant tell your airforce to prioritize the attack on Stalingrad??



Of course it does. You can literally select divisions and tell them to attack or support a specific battle.



Not everyone spends all their time on the forums so if its "ad nauseum" to you maybe that has got more to do with your browsing habits. Either way, freelancers don't work for free. That is not what that word means so resources are still being expanded.

Anyway, that was not the point of this post so don't try to derail the discussion. And if you feel tired with some topic, the logical thing would be to not participate and simply move on instead of gatekeeping.

Thank you for misrepresenting or not getting my points.

Manual control is not the same as prioritizing. In hoi4, due to planning decay, you could argue the opposite.

And if you don't use the search function, someone will tell you to. It's binn like this since Usenet times.

That freelancers work for free is not a point I made. In fact, your implicit argument is that due to lack of (resources, will, whatever), it comes as surprise to YOU that country packs get released.
Well, both things are independent from each other.

On topic: system works, why it works is explained already, the rest is just your opinion, man.