Why are the Ottomans so overpowered?

[Vin55]

Well depends who you are and how many he can field. Before 1550 his tech group has a better army so your best bet is to have more troops then he has. After that you need about 100k as Western European. As persia in the mountains you need about 30-60k in the mountains. There you fight defensive until his manpower runs out then slowly advance. As Western you can call allies into the war beeline for straits try to blockade them and move in 25 k stacks close to each other. Beware of 3 star monster stacks.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

Well depends who you are and how many he can field. Before 1550 his tech group has a better army so your best bet is to have more troops then he has. After that you need about 100k as Western European. As persia in the mountains you need about 30-60k in the mountains. There you fight defensive until his manpower runs out then slowly advance. As Western you can call allies into the war beeline for straits try to blockade them and move in 25 k stacks close to each other. Beware of 3 star monster stacks.

It is 1502. I am France in a strong position, currently attacking the English mainland but I think I am going to try and expand as much east as I can (I already have the Aegean Islands and Cyprus) to limit their expansion. I have a very strong Spain as an ally so I hope that'll deter them, but still, they're growing at a scary rate and not sure what I can do about it. If they eat Mamluks it's the same as my last save, they're unstoppable.

Just saying, it's happening in every save I have.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

Lol they just wrecked the Mamluks. Maybe I am playing a different game to you guys but they ALWAYS win everything.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

Lol they just wrecked the Mamluks. Maybe I am playing a different game to you guys but they ALWAYS win everything.

And immediately after won a war vs Castile, Aragon, Naples and Austria. Not overpowered.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

Now at war with 10 countries including Austria and Hungary, but winning. Not overpowered or ahistorical at all!

 

[Vin55]

Well fact is until 16hundreds they were strong and on their heyday marched until Vienna by cheer luck did the city not fall. Also it is not so ahistorical the holy alliance also had many participants and still lost to the ottoman. The big problem is that the game does not have a disaster which cripples them after 1650 where they rapidly declined because of corruption and loss of military innovations. Maybe their need to be something for them which result in minus 100 percent to their forcelimit if it hits them. And morale debuff, ofc with ways to fix it.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

Well fact is until 16hundreds they were strong and on their heyday marched until Vienna by cheer luck did the city not fall. Also it is not so ahistorical the holy alliance also had many participants and still lost to the ottoman. The big problem is that the game does not have a disaster which cripples them after 1650 where they rapidly declined because of corruption and loss of military innovations. Maybe their need to be something for them which result in minus 100 percent to their forcelimit if it hits them. And morale debuff, ofc with ways to fix it.

This is actually what I wanted originally. For them to have some disasters 1700s onwards.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

They just DoW'd me. Game over cause of the Ottomans AGAIN.

 

[Question]

Started a new game with lucky nations off. By 1570, Ottomans had expanded into the balkans and taken most of Antolia, but got stopped by Mamluks and Austria-Hungary.

When Austria got weak, Ottos tried to invade Austrian Balkans again but the massive PLC proceeded to enforce peace and beat them up.

Do you guys not see Ottos being stopped by PLC? It happens extremely often in my games.

 

[Vin55]

Normally Poland kills itself within a hundred years. Lithuania does not convert Orthodoxie he does not convert it and bam they are dead same Problem for Hungary notmally it is free real estate for bohemia and muscovy. It does not help that ai hungary only expands in orthodox territory and the reformation hits both as well. They only survive if one of them takes religious or humanism. Which happens one in ten games.
So yeah that is kind of the gist of the Problem. I wluld make it that az least every third game they go humanist or religous. Especially lithuania whixh had also Orthodox princes of the Dynastie. Well it would also help if they learn to manage their monye, they are hardcoded into debt many forts big armies little income of trade so no money. As human player you will go for missionary rush religious and aristocratic and then stabilise your countries. Now it takes one carpet siege war in Lithuania and you have nonstop rebells.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

They just DoW'd me. Game over cause of the Ottomans AGAIN.

Why do people "disagree" with my post when what I said was an actual fact? When you guys say that the Ottomans aren't very good in your saves, I don't claim you're lying.

They invaded me, France, with a very strong Spain, Hungary, and Lithuania as allies for my provinces in Venice. They won, comfortably, as they had far more men and 3 star generals all over. During this time they also had a huge coalition against them that never fired despite the war.

My army and economy were wrecked. I don't feel like playing anymore.

After this, I am seriously done with EU4 and all Paradox products for good. This was finally the start to a campaign I wanted and it got ruined by the Ottomans. I can't be bothered to keep playing when one power is so overpowered. The only way to end them is to win a war with them on December 11th, 1444 otherwise they snowball all over.

This happens in 80-90% of my saves and I'm fed up of it.

I've already uninstalled EU4 from my machine so you won't hear me complaining anymore.

 

[Vin55]

Well as France you should be able to win if is on normal. Stack defensive ideas and take offensive ideas your armies will be strong. Siege slowly play defensive at first. Or if he fights against maverick rush Constantinopel and then defend your allies will not fight well against him they cannot deal with strait. Btw a small exploit against ai is is to wait 2 behind strait then wait until ottoman ships engage somewhere activate forced march you can claim strait then. I can understand the frustration of big ai ruining your game but it is always possible to win in eu4 that is what makes the game so great. As man I started from one island to conquer all islands in the world as Norway I took over all the wood etc... you can come from dirt and take home victory.

 

[sekelsenmat]

It is 1502. I am France in a strong position, currently attacking the English mainland but I think I am going to try and expand as much east as I can (I already have the Aegean Islands and Cyprus) to limit their expansion. I have a very strong Spain as an ally so I hope that'll deter them, but still, they're growing at a scary rate and not sure what I can do about it. If they eat Mamluks it's the same as my last save, they're unstoppable.

Just saying, it's happening in every save I have.

If you start close you need to relentlessly attack them as soon as they attack someone not tiny.

If you are further away like France, You need to improve relations with Mamluks, Hungary, etc. When the Ottomans attack them, demand enforce peace and join the war. Make a big stack, siege them, attack their smaller stacks when they come siege back their stuff, attack their navy. Don't let the Mamluks/Magyars fight alone!

If you do that, you can weaken them substantially. If they take neither Mamluks nor Hungary, they are manageable

 

[sekelsenmat]

Why do people "disagree" with my post when what I said was an actual fact? When you guys say that the Ottomans aren't very good in your saves, I don't claim you're lying.

They invaded me, France, with a very strong Spain, Hungary, and Lithuania as allies for my provinces in Venice. They won, comfortably, as they had far more men and 3 star generals all over. During this time they also had a huge coalition against them that never fired despite the war.

My army and economy were wrecked. I don't feel like playing anymore.

After this, I am seriously done with EU4 and all Paradox products for good. This was finally the start to a campaign I wanted and it got ruined by the Ottomans. I can't be bothered to keep playing when one power is so overpowered. The only way to end them is to win a war with them on December 11th, 1444 otherwise they snowball all over.

This happens in 80-90% of my saves and I'm fed up of it.

I've already uninstalled EU4 from my machine so you won't hear me complaining anymore.

You need to ally people you don't want to fight on your borders. As France I'd ally Spain since I don't like taking stuff which historically was not an expansion path.

As Russia I ally Sweden when they get free.

And if you hate the Otto's you need to ally Hungary against them...

And you should keep saves to go back to before things started getting wrong, in your case before Ottomans allied spain

 

[Question]

Started a new game. By 1570, Ottomans had expanded into the balkans and taken most of Antolia, but got stopped by Mamluks and Austria-Hungary.

When Austria got weak, Ottos tried to invade Austrian Balkans again but the massive PLC proceeded to enforce peace and beat them up.

Do you guys not see Ottos being stopped by PLC? It happens extremely often in my games.

Normally Poland kills itself within a hundred years. Lithuania does not convert Orthodoxie he does not convert it and bam they are dead same Problem for Hungary notmally it is free real estate for bohemia and muscovy. It does not help that ai hungary only expands in orthodox territory and the reformation hits both as well. They only survive if one of them takes religious or humanism. Which happens one in ten games.
So yeah that is kind of the gist of the Problem. I wluld make it that az least every third game they go humanist or religous. Especially lithuania whixh had also Orthodox princes of the Dynastie. Well it would also help if they learn to manage their monye, they are hardcoded into debt many forts big armies little income of trade so no money. As human player you will go for missionary rush religious and aristocratic and then stabilise your countries. Now it takes one carpet siege war in Lithuania and you have nonstop rebells.

The AI wont convert provinces if they are at 100% religious unity. Lithuania has +3 heretic tolerance, they shouldnt have religious unity issues.

 

[Sete]

Because they really were in history, and the last thing I’d want is sacrificing historical accuracy for game balance

*Looks at Portugal...

 

[Atomcreator]

Why do people "disagree" with my post when what I said was an actual fact? When you guys say that the Ottomans aren't very good in your saves, I don't claim you're lying.

They invaded me, France, with a very strong Spain, Hungary, and Lithuania as allies for my provinces in Venice. They won, comfortably, as they had far more men and 3 star generals all over. During this time they also had a huge coalition against them that never fired despite the war.

My army and economy were wrecked. I don't feel like playing anymore.

After this, I am seriously done with EU4 and all Paradox products for good. This was finally the start to a campaign I wanted and it got ruined by the Ottomans. I can't be bothered to keep playing when one power is so overpowered. The only way to end them is to win a war with them on December 11th, 1444 otherwise they snowball all over.

This happens in 80-90% of my saves and I'm fed up of it.

I've already uninstalled EU4 from my machine so you won't hear me complaining anymore.

Hey Travis, I think you will find that this forum is causing you more grief than you deserve. I agree with you personally on most points, I would like to see a corruption mechanic introduced for large empires because generally conquered peoples do not want to be conquered. We don't have to have whack a mole rebels, but certainly the game needs to simulate the problems associated with occupation a whole lot better.

I've experienced people just disagreeing with you for anything you say, because, well that's often how it goes on here. I would just take a break and come back later. Ignore those that tend to just dislike you for whatever reason. I wouldn't let it ruin your gaming.

 

[threetypesofcorn]

If you'd have said the Ottomans were overpowered, underpowered or perfectly balanced I'm fairly sure people would disagree who thinks Ottomans are either overpowered, underpowered or perfectly balanced.

 

[Travis_Bickle]

You guys are getting extremely frustrating, like you are not even reading my posts or my explanations and instead it's all my fault and if you guys were playing you'd have won.

Look:

Well as France you should be able to win if is on normal. Stack defensive ideas and take offensive ideas your armies will be strong. Siege slowly play defensive at first. Or if he fights against maverick rush Constantinopel and then defend your allies will not fight well against him they cannot deal with strait. Btw a small exploit against ai is is to wait 2 behind strait then wait until ottoman ships engage somewhere activate forced march you can claim strait then. I can understand the frustration of big ai ruining your game but it is always possible to win in eu4 that is what makes the game so great. As man I started from one island to conquer all islands in the world as Norway I took over all the wood etc... you can come from dirt and take home victory.

They invaded me after warring with Spain, Mamluks, Austria and Poland/Lithuania in separate wars AND they had a coalition against them. I thought I was fine until the Mamluks broke my alliance (because I was also allied with their rival, Spain) and the Ottomans invaded me. It was mid-late 1500s. I had the 2nd biggest army and 2nd most income in game as well as 2 very powerful alliances (Spain and a huge Hungary) as well as an expanded Milan as a PU. I was well ahead of tech in Mil tech and progressing with quantity ideas. What more could I really have done? They still had too many soldiers and most of them had 3 star generals.

If you start close you need to relentlessly attack them as soon as they attack someone not tiny.

If you are further away like France, You need to improve relations with Mamluks, Hungary, etc. When the Ottomans attack them, demand enforce peace and join the war. Make a big stack, siege them, attack their smaller stacks when they come siege back their stuff, attack their navy. Don't let the Mamluks/Magyars fight alone!

If you do that, you can weaken them substantially. If they take neither Mamluks nor Hungary, they are manageable

I was allied to both. Mamluks broke my alliance, see above, but I still had a huge Spain (that owned Naples too). I think the only way we could seriously attack the Ottomans is if every single power combined joined.

You need to ally people you don't want to fight on your borders. As France I'd ally Spain since I don't like taking stuff which historically was not an expansion path.

As Russia I ally Sweden when they get free.

And if you hate the Otto's you need to ally Hungary against them...

And you should keep saves to go back to before things started getting wrong, in your case before Ottomans allied spain

Again...

I was allied to Spain and a huge Hungary. What more could I have done?

Hey Travis, I think you will find that this forum is causing you more grief than you deserve. I agree with you personally on most points, I would like to see a corruption mechanic introduced for large empires because generally conquered peoples do not want to be conquered. We don't have to have whack a mole rebels, but certainly the game needs to simulate the problems associated with occupation a whole lot better.

I've experienced people just disagreeing with you for anything you say, because, well that's often how it goes on here. I would just take a break and come back later. Ignore those that tend to just dislike you for whatever reason. I wouldn't let it ruin your gaming.

I think this game in general is causing me more grief that I deserve.

I'd probably be enjoying myself if the Ottomans were even 20% less OP and it's frustrating that I think I have explained myself clearly, and put forward good arguments but everyone here has seemingly the answer to beating the Ottomans as Ulm so what's the point?

 

[Vin55]

Well get mercs and and play defensive and than you should win