Who or where is the pool of backers for plots drawn from?

[hansvanderdrift]

Hi

I am the King of Wessex and I am planing on killing some of my opponents. When I start a plot I see the pool of possible conspirators come from all over my realm. Is that correct?

I could not find on the wiki where a the pool is generated from.

Also, is it correct if there is a vassal plot I need to goto the other vassals to ask to join?

The reason I'm asking is I watched a paradox stream and a developer was using his councillor with improve relations action to help find conspirators for his plot. I thought the improve relations was at the top tier only.

 

[Migthy]

I think what you mean to say is that by improving diplomatic relations, the relations with the vassals are growing, so they will join your plots more easy.
Yes you can ask to join plot or they could ask you to join.

 

[Dragatus]

It seems the pool for potential co-conspirators is drawn from the target's vassals and all characters located in the same province as the target.

 

[Dracko81]

It is related to courts.

All you vassals are considered to be in your court, so if your target is there then vassals can be invited. If it is a vassal that is the target, then both your court and their count as the pool. If it is just courtier of a vassal that is the target, then only the vassals court counts.

 

[mjohnson85]

The pool of characters available is actually coded on an individual plot basis using a group of pools available. Here is a quote from the modding wiki which gives some good information on pools that I don't think is in the normal wiki.

Each plot must specify who is eligible to join the plot as fellow plotters. Each pool of potential plotters is enabled by setting it with "yes". More than one pool can be enabled. For example, if you have the line "murder_plot = yes" then the courtiers in the same court as the target will be able to join the plot.
These pools are defined by relationships to the target of the plot. If the relationship and the target type of the plot do not match there will not be any plotters in that pool. For example if you have a plot that targets a realm_character the vassal_rank_plot pool will not contain any plotters. This is because the vassal_rank_pool makes plotters eligible based on their relationship to a target title, not to a target character.

 

[Thrake]

I don't know if it was fixed but in previous versions part of the potential plotters could not be invited through the plot UI (you have to manually find the guy and right click him to invite in the plot through diplomatic interaction). I don't remember in which instances it happened, but you can this post is right about who you can invite:

It is related to courts.

All you vassals are considered to be in your court, so if your target is there then vassals can be invited. If it is a vassal that is the target, then both your court and their count as the pool. If it is just courtier of a vassal that is the target, then only the vassals court counts.

 

[Arsonik]

In the case of landless adventurers who are in no court, whether on a sea tile or otherwise, I've seen the pool as low as 2 characters fairly regularly. I think there is something wrong with this when, if a character declares an adventure on you, the game prompts the player to plot assassinate the adventurer. Kind of pointless if there are only 2 people eligible to invite who have less then 50% plot power between them.

 

[StarSword]

Hi

I am the King of Wessex and I am planing on killing some of my opponents. When I start a plot I see the pool of possible conspirators come from all over my realm. Is that correct?

I could not find on the wiki where a the pool is generated from.

Also, is it correct if there is a vassal plot I need to goto the other vassals to ask to join?

The reason I'm asking is I watched a paradox stream and a developer was using his councillor with improve relations action to help find conspirators for his plot. I thought the improve relations was at the top tier only.

It varies by the nature of the plotter and target. This is what I've observed:

• Liege against vassal: fellow vassals, the vassal's vassals and courtiers
• Vassal against fellow vassal: vassal's vassals and courtiers
• Other: courtiers only

 

[hansvanderdrift]

Thank you...

Now I need to decide between seduction or Carousing for the extra plot power.

My problem is whenever I try and target a woman via seduction the end up despising me, and Carousing is localised to my realm.

 

[mrinku]

Well, Carousing does add directly to your Diplomacy, which is a universal, and leads to the lifestyle traits that further boost that. Being a popular fellow makes plot recruitment easier all round. Plus many plots allow you to select plotters from your own court, so improved relations at home can translate into more plotters in general.

Seduction after the last round of nerfs is not a reliable tool (which I fully support), although for Plot purposes it's best used to get the Master Seducer/Seductress LS trait so you have the big passive attraction bonus.The reliable seduction strategy is to train up on courtiers until you unlock the trait, and then use the passive attraction bonuses to get the appropriate people to get what you want done.

Actually seducing important people should be done with great care. The likely result IS that someone (not always your lover, but often enough...) ends up hating you. Even an unmarried ruler who only seduces 45+ yo widows and sticks to one-night stands can get events that affect reputation.

Another strategy that either option can be used to expediate is sending a courtier who likes you to the target's court by marriage, up to and including marrying your lover/friend to your target. Family Values can also be used to set that up.

 

[Gans]

It is related to courts.

All you vassals are considered to be in your court, so if your target is there then vassals can be invited. If it is a vassal that is the target, then both your court and their count as the pool. If it is just courtier of a vassal that is the target, then only the vassals court counts.

Yup. As Byzantium I married every high intrique man and woman into the Italian court just so I could repeatedly kill of everyone till I could push my own weak claim. BTW, what's with everyone going elective nowadays? Strong claims are plain impossible to get, weak claims are almost impossible to push.

 

[StarSword]

Yup. As Byzantium I married every high intrique man and woman into the Italian court just so I could repeatedly kill of everyone till I could push my own weak claim. BTW, what's with everyone going elective nowadays? Strong claims are plain impossible to get, weak claims are almost impossible to push.

And as usual Muslims have the advantage. Open succession combined with their birthrate means there's any number of strong claimants after a generation or two.

 

[mrinku]

Yeah, but the downside is that that DO have many strong candidates and their own nasty mechanisms for splitting the realm.

Muslim advantages largely apply only to internal matters. And no female rulers is a major barrier for them consolidating peacefully. A noble in the HRE or Byzantine Empire always has some hope of working their way to the purple... but unless you start as a direct male descendant it's unlikely you can take over the Caliphate.