Which National Ideas should be changed?

[AnguyTheArcher]

So, after spending such long time with EUIV, there were certainly some moments when you thought that some countries NIs either under or overpowered or simply don't fit the country historically. So if you had an opportunity which would you like to replace and with what?

I'll start first with England. I consider it absurd, that for a country that created world largest empire, they have no colonial ideas. So I'd take Eltham ordinances or Secretaries of State and replace it either with additional colonist ala Castille or simply some bonus to colony population growth.

So if you know any Ideas, that should be changed either for gameplay balance or historical accuracy, lets see some suggestions.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Generic ideas should be doubled or more across the board, except the starter idea.

 

[Rubidium]

Switch Hungary's +Coring Cost with...just about anything really. I just want to see the Ottomans occasionally threaten Vienna, not see them ignore Hungary because it's too expensive to core their lousy land.

Everyone who has +heretic tolerance, trade it out with +Religious Unity (or "negative tolerance gives no penalties"). Or better yet, get rid of that stupid event that makes heretic tolerance an actively bad thing. Also, Gujarati ideas should probably have either religious unity or heathen tolerance; it's a bit strange that they are practically the only Indian nation without it, despite being a Shiite state ruling over Hindus.

Manchu should get a bigger manpower boost, so they have an easier time conquering China.

I think keeping England without additional colonists is fine; other than the 13 colonies and a few islands, most of their empire consisted of things they conquered from other nations (either non-Western nations like most of India, or other colonial powers, like French Canada).

 

[justin6477]

I'll start first with England. I consider it absurd, that for a country that created world largest empire, they have no colonial ideas. So I'd take Eltham ordinances or Secretaries of State and replace it either with additional colonist ala Castille or simply some bonus to colony population growth.

Except England conquered a giant empire, it did not populate a giant empire.

It's been suggested that Castille's bonus colonist should actually be temporary (tie it the current idea, probably bump discipline from +5 to +10) to give them the edge the deserve, but not allow for Castillian_all_of_the_Americas. I'm starting to come around to that position.

 

[AnguyTheArcher]

I think keeping England without additional colonists is fine; other than the 13 colonies and a few islands, most of their empire consisted of things they conquered from other nations (either non-Western nations like most of India, or other colonial powers, like French Canada).

So? The same can be said about number 2 colonial power Spain, whose colonies consisted mostly of mixed native/spanish/black population. Even if we consider just NA, South Africa and Australia, England was certainly the largest "pure" (that means european colonists, not natives) colonial power in history. Who were the competitors? Portugesse and Dutch with their few trading outposts? France with Canada, that had 50 000 population? I already mentioned Spain. I think colonization buff for England is entirely justifiable. I mean who else deserves it, if not England?

 

[Jorlaan]

Georgia needs its own national ideas. Some core cost increase for their lands, plus maybe some fort defense.
I also agree that the generic ideas are incredibly weak, and I actually have brought most of the crummy 5% up to 10% in my game.

 

[Bagle]

I think that the ideas for Theocracies shouldn't grant an extra missionary at start, as they are often very small(mostly OPMs) it just feels like a waste. If it has to be included, make it unlockable later, not as a starting tradition.

I think Brandenburg's/Prussia's ideas need a nerf.

 

[Mortheim]

So? The same can be said about number 2 colonial power Spain, whose colonies consisted mostly of mixed native/spanish/black population. Even if we consider just NA, South Africa and Australia, England was certainly the largest "pure" (that means european colonists, not natives) colonial power in history. Who were the competitors? Portugesse and Dutch with their few trading outposts? France with Canada, that had 50 000 population? I already mentioned Spain. I think colonization buff for England is entirely justifiable. I mean who else deserves it, if not England?

But England had few colonies. Like 13 colonies and Australia + New Zealand. If under "pure" you mean their Indian territories - you're totally wrong
Also, i could remind you about South Africa, New Netherlands (with New Amsterdam) for Netherlands. And Brazil for Portugal (with some territories in Africa).
GB just take colonies from other countries, when they were too weak to defend them.

Georgia needs its own national ideas. Some core cost increase for their lands, plus maybe some fort defense.

Good idea. Also, i think, they need idea for attrition.

I think that the ideas for Theocracies shouldn't grant an extra missionary at start, as they are often very small(mostly OPMs) it just feels like a waste. If it has to be included, make it unlockable later, not as a starting tradition.

Theocracies have first idea, that gives them 10% discipline. For me this is good enough.

I think Brandenburg's/Prussia's ideas need a nerf.

STAHP NERFING BRB IDEAS.

 

[bbiaso]

Except England conquered a giant empire, it did not populate a giant empire.

Between the early 1600s and the 1950s, more than 20 million people immigrated from the British Isles to their numerous colonies. No other Empire exported so many of its people abroad.

 

[Rubidium]

Between the early 1600s and the 1950s, more than 20 million people immigrated from the British Isles to their numerous colonies. No other Empire exported so many of its people abroad.

Except most of that was after the EU period. And of course, most of the population of several of those colonies (pretty much all of the Caribbean islands, and several of the Southern colonies as well) was of African origin (for obvious reasons that I hesitate to discuss on this forum).

It's true that Spanish colonies had a more "mixed" population than e.g. Plymouth, but that really doesn't mean anything from a game perspective. Natives in-game assimilate to your colonial population if you don't kill them, after all. And it's certainly true that of the provinces that were "colonized" (in the sense of, not being owned by other in-game nations, to being turned into cities), the vast majority were Spanish. In contrast, of the provinces in-game that were colonized during the EU time period, the only ones that would be represented as English colonization were parts of the 13 Colonies (excluding significant areas of New York, New Jersey and Pennsylvania, which were captured from the Dutch), a few places in the Caribbean, some miscellaneous minor islands (e.g. St. Helena), and Australia (New Zealand was slightly after the game ends). That's hardly on par with Spain. It certainly isn't deserving of being one of the only nations to get a colonial bonus.

There's another aspect of this as well; putting a colonist in the English NI strongly encourages the player to go colonial. That's fine for the AI (and they do take Exploration, so they will go colonial at some point), but England has a lot of other aspects that a human player may prefer to pursue. The Iberians as colonists is fine; that's sort of the whole point of Portugal, and Spain was the colonial power par excellence, but England in human hands can very possibly win the Hundred Years War and become the dominant European power.

 

[Bonafide]

England should make it easier to get claims/CBs on exotic nations and/or boost vassals somehow, that reflects them better. My thinking behind boosting vassal management is that, as mentioned, GB usually had underlings fight their wars for them. Would be cool if it was possible to emulate that somehow.

 

[Lwantssugar]

What about changing Hungarys coring costs into higher costs to change culture? That way it's more worthwhile to conquer them but don't see them replaced by Austrians or Turks.

Maybe some Hessian ideas?

I'd buff the north African states, they weren't the ottomans but they werent steam rolled by Spain in 1450, maybe give them the Ghazi idea?

Take out the extra republican tradition from Irish ideas and replace it with the same malus against culture conversion

 

[Valkyrie-Lemons]

The Dutch Naval force-limits multiplier. Combined with Grand Navy, Global Empire, and their unique Dutch Republic, they can get almost 200% modifer. Considering they also have good base force limits due to centres of trade, estuaries and high tax, you can maintain an insane navy. Maybe it could 25% instead of 50%?

Although, historically the Dutch did have an insane navy, so I guess it's not exactly ahistorical.


Also, Ireland's "Loyal Catholics" idea (+3 Papal Influence) basically ties you down to being Catholic or having a useless idea if you convert. Maybe have it so you get a bonus to true faith relations?

 

[Dakilla TM]

I think that the ideas for Theocracies shouldn't grant an extra missionary at start, as they are often very small(mostly OPMs) it just feels like a waste. If it has to be included, make it unlockable later, not as a starting tradition.

I think Brandenburg's/Prussia's ideas need a nerf.

No, just no. No no no no no no no, and if I haven't been clear..... NOOOOOOOO. LEAVE PRUSSIA ALONE! PLEASE, ENOUGH NERFING!



Anyways, I'd like to see Manchu getting a manpower boost. Change the Lithianian +4 tolerance to heretics to "no religious penalties". Seriously, Lithuania is already unstable as is, and having religions flip to heretics is very annoying.

 

[ShadeDragon]

Except most of that was after the EU period. And of course, most of the population of several of those colonies (pretty much all of the Caribbean islands, and several of the Southern colonies as well) was of African origin (for obvious reasons that I hesitate to discuss on this forum).

1600-1950 is a 350 year time period with 220 of those years being in the time period of EUIV, how is that mostly after the EU period?

(your other points have some validity, I just had to nitpick about that)

 

[justin6477]

1600-1950 is a 350 year time period with 220 of those years being in the time period of EUIV, how is that mostly after the EU period?

(your other points have some validity, I just had to nitpick about that)

In 1790, the United States had around 4,000,000 people. 80% of this had ancestry British Isles. Considering the robustness of colonial families, I doubt that actual emigration into the US was even a quarter of that.

Also, I'm relatively sure that no other state had an enclosure movement quite like England & Wales... The important of which, when it came to driving emigration in the EU period, cannot be understated. Perhaps an ENG/GB specific event or decision to add colonial growth is in order?

 

[CelticMutt]

Also, Ireland's "Loyal Catholics" idea (+3 Papal Influence) basically ties you down to being Catholic or having a useless idea if you convert. Maybe have it so you get a bonus to true faith relations?

IMO, every single NI that gives +Papal Influence needs to be replaced. I get that it's partly to help AI nations that historically stayed Catholic remain so, but it's a wasted idea as a player.

 

[unmerged(26686)]

No, just no. No no no no no no no, and if I haven't been clear..... NOOOOOOOO. LEAVE PRUSSIA ALONE! PLEASE, ENOUGH NERFING!

+1

 

[Bagle]

Theocracies have first idea, that gives them 10% discipline. For me this is good enough.

So they have one really strong idea and one really weak. Yearly Papal influence/lower stab cost etc. would be more suitable.

 

[Hakairyu]

IMO, every single NI that gives +Papal Influence needs to be replaced. I get that it's partly to help AI nations that historically stayed Catholic remain so, but it's a wasted idea as a player.

Not really if you are one of the few of us who bother with the curia for the extra diplomat and what not as opposed just taking their -40 idea cost and being done with it. I'm on the side of the curia lovers. But it should give you an alternative if you are protestant I would suppose (why would you ever go protestant though, unless you want to form Prussia?).