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    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
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YouMust99

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Hopefully they aren't to weak. I hate to see that islam is shattered more often than it wins. I know there was talk about it being 1 in a 1000 chance or whatever but who cares about that shit, its to important to not have a big part of the world.
I would hate if the exact opposite happens and Islam always triumphs, but I can see wanting it to happen half the time. Just a question, what will the zoros be like, as you wouldn't have the decisions of regular ck2? Also, how will holy wars start, will it just be a reaction to something like Islam? And are the holy sites changed at all?
 

Enlil

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I would hate if the exact opposite happens and Islam always triumphs, but I can see wanting it to happen half the time. Just a question, what will the zoros be like, as you wouldn't have the decisions of regular ck2? Also, how will holy wars start, will it just be a reaction to something like Islam? And are the holy sites changed at all?
Yeah, Zoroastrians have new standards for Great Holy Wars and Saoshoyant.
 

Kljunas

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Writing out a "Migration" casus belli right now for this mod and was wondering what you guys think of this.

I am also writing out Slavic migration but that is to be handled in a event series that works in conjunction with this.

I have it written out in its proper code, but I figured I should make it readable for you guys before I upload it to see what you think
Wouldn't it make more sense if the counties were given away to neighbouring cultures (like the vanilla Magyar invasion) instead of your own culture? It seems a bit weird that people of the attacking tribe would remain there since they have migrated.

Also you should make sure that the attacker doesn't only lose provinces but also duchy titles. You don't want them to instantly declare de jure wars to get their old land back.

And finally maybe add the additional requirement of holding a tribal title?

Btw white peace means that you keep the event troops? Sounds a bit OP.
 

Jokolytic

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Hopefully they aren't to weak. I hate to see that islam is shattered more often than it wins. I know there was talk about it being 1 in a 1000 chance or whatever but who cares about that shit, its to important to not have a big part of the world.
Alternate history should be based on chance and not fate, in my opinion.
 

anomanderus

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So it's possible, that Ali would be elected as Caliph and Shia schism won't happen? Wow.
And if you'll ever get to additional starts, look for the rule of Walid II (743-744), Caliph, who used Quran for target practice, wanted to set up a tent on the Black Stone with his hunting dogs and friends and sit there drinking and singing songs, and presumably, was Arab Pagan. I've always wanted to play as him.
It sounds like that guy really wanted to be overthrown...
 

Erik W

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So it's possible, that Ali would be elected as Caliph and Shia schism won't happen? Wow.
And if you'll ever get to additional starts, look for the rule of Walid II (743-744), Caliph, who used Quran for target practice, wanted to set up a tent on the Black Stone with his hunting dogs and friends and sit there drinking and singing songs, and presumably, was Arab Pagan. I've always wanted to play as him.
Oh PLEASE make that a bookmark! Make him an Arab Pagan that doesn´t give a squat about his subjects, enemies, family, anything! And PLEASE make him extremely difficult to convert. There should be events and decisions UNIQUE to this guy like:

Make Mecca and the Black Stone a tourist attraction

Move the Black Stone... somewhere

Give Independence to Christian vassals

Just give him the same decisions and events you would give Emperor Nero or Caligula!

Edit: These events and decisions would have to be impossible for the AI to implement?
 

OuanLynch

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Sorry I never got a chance to publish more on the religious/ political structure on the British Isles, as I made on my last venture on the forums which is located on page 4 of this thread. I had to take a break as I had surgery to aid me in the recovery of wounds I took last year. I just got back to the forums two days ago and it took me a bit of time to read the entire arc that has arisen in the week or so two since I was able to use the internet last.

I have a few topics that hold near and dear to me with regards to the post-WRE world, and the breaks and reaffirmations of the Christian Churches is one of them. One the be biggest challenges of a historical modder I suppose is to get it as close to historical truth as one can reasonably get to start with and then let it fly in big world shaking CKII style.

I was curious if you were including earlier splits in the churches that let rip right around the 480 start date. As you may be aware, the Arcacian Schism started in 482, just a few short months after the Start of the Mod. This happened of course after a string of events that began after the Chalcedonic Council which condemned Monophysitisim and all of its' heretical teachings. Emperor Zeno and Patriarch Acacius were at the head of it, but they brought the first great rupture in Communion between the East and West and set ground for further ruptures down the road even though this one had far less to do with dogma prima facie than the later ones that ruptured the Church around 1054 for the final time.

This rupture lasted through two Emperor's Zeno and Emperor Anastasius until 516 when Justin took over the ERE and reunited the faiths. I think this would make an excellent even if there is some way to trigger it, as it played very well into the crafting of the Ostrogothic kingdom, lead to ruptures in the Senate (Visigothic restored), the eventual death of St. Boethius (Anicicius Manilus Serverinus). That being said, is the Ostrogothic Kingdom going to have Senate events, as the Senate flourished along with a spike in Latin culture after the fall of the actual Roman Western Empire. http://historymedren.about.com/od/medchristianity/p/acacian_schism.htm

Similarly, the Frankish Kingdom was able to administer its lands because of the Romans that lived in it's borders. The ultimate spike in Latin literature before the demise of most things Latin but that of the Church Vulgate was under Frankish and Ostrogothic rule. I know that you are currently representing the culture as Romano-Gallic, etc, but how will the Latin flavor play into these lands as the game progresses? I ask this because a lot of the early advisers were full blooded Romans, the descendants of Emperors even in the case of St. Boethius. The Ostrogothic kingdom used counselor titles, on the Roman model and adopted many of the practices of Rome. Their eventual decline had a lot to do with the decline of technical expertise less than outside pressure (being unable to save Rome from being depopulated for lack of water after the destruction of the Aqueducts comes to mind and of course Justinian).

I know that I am rambling a bit and this has little to do with structure of the Isles, Amorica, and Northern Spain that I talked about before the end of my last posting, so I will back off for now, and go back to working on those topics. Just thought I would bring it up now as to how things in Western Europe were still far from Feudal in nature at this date.

The end of standing armies was close at hand and even had arrived for most of the West, but seeing that as the rise of feudalism is a tad trite, and I hate to see it bandied so casually on the forum posts. The civilized world known since the rise of the Greeks was changing rapidly, but the Codes of Justinian were still to come and were adopted into the West as well, and some of cases of Frankish Gaul made it back to the East in turn. Much of this era is unfortunately lost to modern scholarship or at least opaqued to most people, but the more we dig the more the past comes to light before us. I hope that this mod can bring some of the facets of this period to full illumination.

It was period of migrations and invasions, it is true, but it was also the stage that brought about the revival of the Roman world under Justinian, who ironically enough was born as this Mod starts, in Macedonia, the birthplace of Alexander, but unlike Iskander the Conqueror, he is known to most the world as the last Roman.
 
Last edited:

Mr. Capiatlist

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Can you edit your post so it isn't a large monolithic wall of text? It will help me absorb it with my sun-soaked mush-brain.
 

Abiot

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As a history nerd following this topic religiously, I second this.

EDIT: Breaking up the wall of text, that is. My brain is too melted today to read that.
 

OuanLynch

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A monolithic wall of text, eh? I actually edited down from my original 5000 words or so that I spit out this morning.. Sorry, I will make future posts a tig smaller, and I will re-edit the above post into smaller paragraphs that are perhaps a bit more coherent to those of us who are sun-soaked, mush-brained, or perhaps still a bit addled from last nights celebrations.
 

Mr. Capiatlist

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A monolithic wall of text, eh? I actually edited down from my original 5000 words or so that I spit out this morning.. Sorry, I will make future posts a tig smaller, and I will re-edit the above post into smaller paragraphs that are perhaps a bit more coherent to those of us who are sun-soaked, mush-brained, or perhaps still a bit addled from last nights celebrations.
Thanks, all I needed was spacing so I could keep my place. Been out in the sun all day.
 

geiseric

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Alternate history should be based on chance and not fate, in my opinion.
It presumably will be.

I am not advocating that it be railroaded especially since its just one event, and an important one at that.

Hell no matter what he does (unless he gives them an ungodly amount of event troops) they could still fail or be pushed back.
 

Zusk

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Huh, I have wicked question about Islam: What's Mohammed religion? And what's succession law in Rashidun Caliphate?;) What happens if Ali dies before Mohammed?



About that, I don't know. I want Arabs to win and became major power for the sake of plausibility. But they was so lucky in RL, that's crazy - Iran devastated by civil wars and wars with ERE, child on a throne, Rostam Farrokhzād randomly killed.
I don't think they should have amount of troops of healthy Iran.
Of course they were lucky, they were extremely lucky. But its also sort of important that you have them simply for familiarity and to ensure that Western Europe rises and the east suffers for it.

Perhaps simply give them troops equal to the mongols and also give their leaders a strong claim on e_persia and on the Palmyrene region?
 

Zusk

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Oh PLEASE make that a bookmark! Make him an Arab Pagan that doesn´t give a squat about his subjects, enemies, family, anything! And PLEASE make him extremely difficult to convert. There should be events and decisions UNIQUE to this guy like:

Make Mecca and the Black Stone a tourist attraction

Move the Black Stone... somewhere

Give Independence to Christian vassals

Just give him the same decisions and events you would give Emperor Nero or Caligula!

Edit: These events and decisions would have to be impossible for the AI to implement?
Make the same decisions able to be used by Insane rulers and you have me sold
 

flyguy117

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I think we should be a bit more sensitive when it comes to events relating to the rise of Islam. I worry that someone will get offended.
 

Enlil

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It presumably will be.

I am not advocating that it be railroaded especially since its just one event, and an important one at that.

Hell no matter what he does (unless he gives them an ungodly amount of event troops) they could still fail or be pushed back.
Ten Hundred THOUSAND Soldiers!!!!

I think we should be a bit more sensitive when it comes to events relating to the rise of Islam. I worry that someone will get offended.
That's why Mohammad won't actually appear as a character in game, only mentioned through Rise of Islam events.
 

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Well giving my opinion the "germanias" would be much better off by being named Germania Ocidentalis & Germania Orientalis and both part of the Germania Magna empire...
 
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