Wheel of fortune for who you will be fighting

[Jack45]

ATM, defenders can call in their allies no matter how long the war has been going on for.

This means, especially near the start, that when you declare war on someone, you have absolutely no idea who you will be fighting.

For example, in a Swiss game I just started, I declared war on Savoy with the help of Genoa. 3 months in they allied and called in Hungary. 6 months it was Bavaria. Before the end of the year, Baden had also joined.

I suppose the alternative is that you can declare before they have any allies with would be stupid, but the 60 days previously given was more than enough for a realistic look for allies after a war declaration.

 

[GabbyDieJaeger]

I personally think it's entirely reasonable.
Looking at the wars of the timeframe, there are very, very few where every nation to take part in the conflict was already a part of within the first two months.
However, it is a bit annoying that the defender can make and call in as many allies as they want. Maybe the attacker should be able to make allies after declaring war, but only if the defender has made and called in allies too, or something like that.

 

[yyrkroon]

I'd even like to take a step farther and allow countries to proactively step into any war on behalf of their ally (called or not).

I hate seeing one of my allies getting crushed in a war that I can't find a way into...

 

[Jack45]

I agree that allies should always join unless their are special circumstances. What I am objecting too is countries that are neutral to creating an alliance with my enemy and joining half way through the war.

 

[slv]

AI should join wars in a more Human way.

When Player Join the war he thinks about "How likely that we win the war?" "Will I get anything of it" "Do I need this ally who calls me in?"
WHen AI joins the war he thinks about relations.

When Player tries to make a separate peace he thinks "Wll I get more than I can get from this peace now?"
When AI refuses to make a separate peace he thinks "Length of war" "Relative Strength of Alliances"

Humans do not care if the call was defensive or offensive, AI do.

 

[yerm]

I agree that allies should always join unless their are special circumstances. What I am objecting too is countries that are neutral to creating an alliance with my enemy and joining half way through the war.

What you are objecting to is standard practice for human players. I routinely use a defensive call to arms as a way to get into a war with someone I cannot or don't want to attack directly now. It was also always possible in multiplayer; a human player calling a human player into a war after 60 days was not limited by the silly penalty to acceptance that the ai had.

If it's been a long time since the war started and bigger and badder enemies are being called in, it just motivates the attacker to either finish up or peace out. It's still not even close to as brutal as having the war leader flip repeatedly in the past.

 

[Mikalos]

AI should join wars in a more Human way.

When Player Join the war he thinks about "How likely that we win the war?" "Will I get anything of it" "Do I need this ally who calls me in?"
WHen AI joins the war he thinks about relations.

When Player tries to make a separate peace he thinks "Wll I get more than I can get from this peace now?"
When AI refuses to make a separate peace he thinks "Length of war" "Relative Strength of Alliances"

Humans do not care if the call was defensive or offensive, AI do.

well, i mean, if you want to build working smart AI be our guest, im sure paradox will pay you to use your smart AI in its games.

 

[slv]

well, i mean, if you want to build working smart AI be our guest, im sure paradox will pay you to use your smart AI in its games.

In other words I meant that "Ally strength modifier", "Wants your provinces" should apply to joining the war. "Relative strength of alliances" should apply to joining wars instead of making peace. Defensive/Offensive call modifier should not be there. You should not have -1000 for allying with the attacker.

 

[Jack45]

What you are objecting to is standard practice for human players. I routinely use a defensive call to arms as a way to get into a war with someone I cannot or don't want to attack directly now. It was also always possible in multiplayer; a human player calling a human player into a war after 60 days was not limited by the silly penalty to acceptance that the ai had.

If it's been a long time since the war started and bigger and badder enemies are being called in, it just motivates the attacker to either finish up or peace out. It's still not even close to as brutal as having the war leader flip repeatedly in the past.

What I mean that these countries that join against you have no interest in you. Neutral relations, often with no border or reason to even care about you. It is not standard human practice to ally the AI just to help them attack someone you don't care about.

 

[Aries666]

Im fairly certain that the AI can only make and call in new allies if it has the open dip slots. Try declaring war on Austria with their massive relations limit.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I have seen AIs ally and join more than 5 years into a war.

Amusingly, the length of war modifier is so long that you can peace them out, instantly.

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

I have seen AIs ally and join more than 5 years into a war.

Amusingly, the length of war modifier is so long that you can peace them out, instantly.

lol

 

[zodium]

I have seen AIs ally and join more than 5 years into a war.

Amusingly, the length of war modifier is so long that you can peace them out, instantly.

or take more turf, instantly!

 

[TheMeInTeam]

or take more turf, instantly!

You would have to at least assault occupy or siege them. Potentially useful, but it usually winds up being some random minor crap out of the way where you can't core it and don't want to bother with a vassal, I think partially because those are the only types of nations desperate enough to go allying nations that are getting absolutely slaughtered. It's also reasonably rare.