What's the point of Military Police? (Discussion)

[SophieX]

Going off info from HOI4 Wiki

Cav = 51.6 Production
MP = 56 Production
A.Car = 240 Production

So, let's just Wolfram Alpha this
Cav
x*(51.6 / (2*1.2)) + 56 = x*(51.6 / 2) == 13.02
x*(51.6 / (2*1.3)) + 56 = x*(51.6 / 2) == 9.40
x*(51.6 / (2*1.4)) + 56 = x*(51.6 / 2) == 7.59
x*(51.6 / (2*1.5)) + 56 = x*(51.6 / 2) == 6.51

A.Cars
x*(240 / (2.5*1.2)) + 56 = x*(240 / 2.5) == 3.50
x*(240 / (2.5*1.3)) + 56 = x*(240 / 2.5) == 2.50
x*(240 / (2.5*1.4)) + 56 = x*(240 / 2.5) == 2.04
x*(240 / (2.5*1.5)) + 56 = x*(240 / 2.5) == 1.75

This shows how many units in a division you need for MP to be worth it. So at a Cav unit with 10 Cavs would not be worth having MP. This changes if you upgrade your MP (or give the Cavs guns that require more production).

Armored Cars are so insanely expensive that it is almost immediately worth using MP...
Since we should assume we should always use a full 25 unit division.
(A.Car vs Cav with best MP) vs a pony boy
(2.5*1.5*25) = 93.75 Suppression for 6056 Production and 13,000 Manpower
93.75 / 2 = 46.87 pony boys for 2418.75 Production and 46,870 Manpower

(2.0*1.5*25) = 75 Suppression for 1346 Production and 25,500 Manpower
75 / 2 = 37.5 pony boys for 1935 Production and 37,500 Manpower

Good calculation!
Helpful to get an imagination of what could or at the end should be invested.
But it is not only a question of resources.
It's a question of longterm-strategy too; which one could barly put into such a "school"-calculation.

 

[Talamare]

Good calculation!
Helpful to get an imagination of what could or at the end should be invested.
But it is not only a question of resources.
It's a question of longterm-strategy too; which one could barly put into such a "school"-calculation.

Overall it becomes much simpler, MP is always worth it if you're holding a lot of territory.
Sure, There is a Research penalty and a Infantry XP, but those are 1x costs. Which the Production and Manpower saved are ongoing and ever increasing.

If you can't afford to make a full 25 unit MP Cav Division, just try to get as many as you can and slowly expand as time passes.

Finally, if you're a country with extremely low manpower and extremely high production, then Armored Cars become Optimal.
I'm not even sure what country would qualify in that sense.... Maybe Communist UK? Maybe Czech or Yugo? Doubtful...
Honestly, they need to reduce the cost of Armored Cars by at least 60. Probably more.

 

[FindFloppies]

I may be misunderstanding what you're describing, so apologies if I'm off the mark. But you don't need to have actual garrisons divisions anywhere on the map to match the number of divisions assigned to the 'Occupied Territories'. The game automatically recruits those garrison divisions and they're located off-map. The garrison system for occupied territories is abstracted and managed by the game for you. You don't need to handle those divisions. You just need to specify a division template for use as suppressing garrison.

By having your garrison divisions on the map, you're just duplicating what the game already does for you. And you're wasting manpower and equipment.

It's no big deal, but I thought you might want to know. You can try it: disband your garrison divisions, and you'll see your occupied territories are still suppressed like they were before you got rid of those divisions. That's a nice improvement to the previous system, eliminating a lot of micro-management.

I see that now. I edited my original post.

 

[Toybasher]

IIRC MP's add a decent amount of defense to a division, slightly less than engineers, although the usefulness of this is up for debate.

 

[Petite]

View attachment 591461

If you already have a cavalry template WITHOUT support use that. If your cavalry template has support, don't use it, becuase support companies are too expensive for garrison (except MP).
Removing 1 support costs 10XP.
Creating the template above costs 5 XP.

This Div. looks nice, i will use it next Time with GER, but without MP.
Thats too expensive because 1 minimum loss per day /DIV

 

[Zauberelefant]

It's not been mentioned in this thread, so I thought I'd put it out there.
Did you guys notice that MP Level 1 adds a +5.8% reliability bonus?

Not only is this a weird number, it's more than Maintenance Level 1, which adds +5% reliability.
It's not shown on the technology research card.

With this in mind, does reliability affect losses due to resistance? If the answer is yes, MP becomes even more useful, when used in conjunction with armored units in a garrison template.

View attachment 593285View attachment 593286View attachment 593288

Can you post the full template? I fear the reliability is because of the 90% of inf equipment raising the average.

 

[Mousetick]

Can you post the full template? I fear the reliability is because of the 90% of inf equipment raising the average.

Hmmm ok I see my gross mistake, thanks. I've deleted my post because it was completely wrong.

So I didn't know about the reliability bonus based on the ratio of inf equipment. I'll try to learn more about it and ask questions if needed, but not here, because that's off-topic.

 

[Zauberelefant]

Hmmm ok I see my gross mistake, thanks. I've deleted my post because it was completely wrong.

So I didn't know about the reliability bonus based on the ratio of inf equipment. I'll try to learn more about it and ask questions if needed, but not here, because that's off-topic.

The way of the hoi4 player is never ending self improvement...

 

[Petite]

its not useful under LaR

 

[Simon_9732495]

its not useful under LaR

After 28 Postings somewhat agreeing that there are use cases for the MP support company, you should bring arguments for you opinion.

I disagree. As Germany if I occupy 15 countries in Europe it's useful to add MP to my garrison division.

 

[FindFloppies]

After 28 Postings somewhat agreeing that there are use cases for the MP support company, you should bring arguments for you opinion.

I disagree. As Germany if I occupy 15 countries in Europe it's useful to add MP to my garrison division.

That's where I am on it. It's a percentage buff, one-time cost per increment.

 

[Petite]

lost/used equip kills any engine

If you use 0.1 Equipment at day, you loose 1 equip every day

 

[blahmaster6k]

View attachment 591461

If you already have a cavalry template WITHOUT support use that. If your cavalry template has support, don't use it, becuase support companies are too expensive for garrison (except MP).
Removing 1 support costs 10XP.
Creating the template above costs 5 XP.

I'll be honest, I have almost 2k hours in the game and I still don't know how to create a blank new division template, I always just duplicate the closest existing template to what I need.

 

[Petite]

try some like this

 

[Mr.Bajskorv]

I would wonder if not a MP-support should also give some minor other boost. To make MP more versitle what it added also a minor combat intel boost and/or a org boost. Just to make the MP support somewhat feasable in a regular combat division.

 

[PnGuin]

I would wonder if not a MP-support should also give some minor other boost. To make MP more versitle what it added also a minor combat intel boost and/or a org boost. Just to make the MP support somewhat feasable in a regular combat division.

One of the biggest jobs MP's do IRL is TRAFFIC CONTROL - not particularly glamorous, but really important. I've always thought MPs should provide some small bonus to supply (maybe a reduction in consumption like logistics companies).

 

[porta80]

I would wonder if not a MP-support should also give some minor other boost. To make MP more versitle what it added also a minor combat intel boost and/or a org boost. Just to make the MP support somewhat feasable in a regular combat division.

MP support company has same combat stats as a regular inf battalion, just lesss org and less hp. Same attack and defense values, i use them while playing russia in my 20.8 width inf template to get more defense.

 

[Petite]

Westpoland with collaboration needs in 12 Month




without MP suppression goes from 10.4 to 8

and you loose ~ 30% more
~ 1721*1.3 riffles ~ 2338
~ 4450 Manpower*1.3 ~ 5785
but you save 300 days research and ~230 Support Eq. and some MIC

 

[kettyo]

So conclusion is that armored cars are generally a waste?

 

[seattle]

AC and supply equipment are dirt cheap and only cost metal.

I typically use something like for off-map anti partisan: MP, 4 cav, 1 AC
Or: MP, 8 cav, 2 AC...

I believe the differences aren't that great in the end. Probably filling all slots scales best, but spends plenty XP as well.