And what makes HOI4 not grognard other than the fact it doesn't look like a board game from the 70's >.>
Just wondering because I see that word sometimes lol.
Just wondering because I see that word sometimes lol.
What does it mean to be "grognard" in HOI terms?
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Being older than dirt and growing up playing old Avalon Hill and SPI games, which you still have in a closet and cherish like a 40 year old bottle of scotch, and occasionally pull out to play, taking over the dining room and annoying your wife.
That is a grognard.
That is a grognard.
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English
Etymology
From French grognard (“grumbler”).
Pronunciation
Noun
grognard (plural grognards)
Etymology
From French grognard (“grumbler”).
Pronunciation
Noun
grognard (plural grognards)
- An old soldier.
- (historical) A soldier of the original imperial guard that was created by Napoleon I in 1804 and that made the final French charge at Waterloo.
- (games, slang) Someone who enjoys playing older war-games or roleplaying games, or older versions of such games, when newer ones are available. quotations ▼James is such a grognard, he only plays the original edition of Dungeons and Dragons.
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I'd say anyone who played hoi 1 or 2, when the game actually looked like a 70s Board game, can be considered a grognard or longbeard.
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To qualify as a grognard around here, you must do two things above all others: maintain the absolute superiority of both your skills as a player and the mechanics/interface of previous games, whether board or video in character. Romantic nostalgia is the preferred method for discussing these things with other players, even if you don't own or play Vicky or Vic2.
Actual skill or having actually played any of these superior early games not actually required.
Actual skill or having actually played any of these superior early games not actually required.
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That you don't play this game and instead prefer series like The Operational Art of War and Gary Grigsby's War in the [insert theatre here]?
Welp, guess I'm becoming one...
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That's me! Thanks for that. My WiF complete map set takes up 2 donut tables and the entire garage HAHAHAHA!
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You mean WIE with 9 maps and 4K counters. Yeah, I'm a Grognard. I wish HOI IV to grow into a real WWII game where carriers really are tops and battleships are obsolete. That planes actually get intercepted on their way to their assigned theatre of operations and not just in the assigned theatre of operations. That supply depots actually exist and get resupplied from ports and provinces not necessarily the capital of the country.
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Damn, this IS a good thread! (Secret Master had to point it out to me . . . .)
In gaming terms, I think a grognard is:
1) Someone who knows where the term originates
2) Someone who thinks that playing a Grigsby game, especially War in the Pacific, or War in the East, is the equivalent of dying and going to heaven.
Age is not a requirement here, although -ahem!- my first game was Tactics II.
Beat that, mates! (Actually, you can't because that was the first commercial board wargame. Technically it belonged to my older brother, who wasn't interested in it and let it languish in the closet until I discovered it.)
EDIT: There are other great grognard games, too, like The Operational Art of War, anything by John tiller, etc.
EDIT2: And yes, sad to say HOI does not come close to qualifying as a grognard's game.
In gaming terms, I think a grognard is:
1) Someone who knows where the term originates
2) Someone who thinks that playing a Grigsby game, especially War in the Pacific, or War in the East, is the equivalent of dying and going to heaven.
Age is not a requirement here, although -ahem!- my first game was Tactics II.
Beat that, mates! (Actually, you can't because that was the first commercial board wargame. Technically it belonged to my older brother, who wasn't interested in it and let it languish in the closet until I discovered it.)
EDIT: There are other great grognard games, too, like The Operational Art of War, anything by John tiller, etc.
EDIT2: And yes, sad to say HOI does not come close to qualifying as a grognard's game.
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You mean Europa -- seventeen boxes, 31 interlocking maps published (16 mile hexes, battalion to division scale units), just short of 11,000 counters.
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Never played it, but yes, there would also seem to be a minimum counter requirement! Just reading about it made it seem like one insane game.
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Yep, got both of these beasts. Those are set up in my workshop out back, which is furnished with a beer fridge, TV, and stereo system. The dining room ain't big enough.
Honestly, HOI is kind of close to the old games with the advantage of not taking up space. I just wish the production and combat ai wasn't so, ........challenged.
What I am REALLY looking forward to is War in the East 2. It is supposed to be out soon, and Grisby is following it up with Steel Tigers, an update on Steel Panthers. If the reviews on WitE2 are good, I may be locked in my office for a few weeks.
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Here's another definition of a grogmard: A grognard is someone who plays games that are developed by people who only "announce" their games when they're ready, and don't tease them for a year or two.
2By3's idea of "marketing" consists of Joel Billings occasionaly responding to a thread dedicated to WitE2 on the Matrix forums, vaguely describing where the game is in development.
I too am looking forward to it. Grigsby is insane, but he's my kind of insane.
And by the way -- can Europa be played solo? I have often considered buying it, but I would need someone to play it with! I have the same problem with World in Flames.
I was hooked on Avalon-Hill since "Dispatcher" when I was 5; and did a tour in Viet-Nam as a class 2 draft dodger [joined; not drafted] , so I guess I qualify .
My draft notice was mailed to me in Viet-Nam; the party lasted for 2 days !
My draft notice was mailed to me in Viet-Nam; the party lasted for 2 days !
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They've never actually finished it, have they?Yes, if you have lots and lots of time and are insane.
Wow, that's another of their oldest ones. It's roughly contemporaneous with Tactics II and Gettysburg, I think. It also makes you older than me by a year or two. The Vietnam refs are another clue, of course -- I turned 18 the very last year they had a draft, thank goodness.
According to wikipeia, over a dozen games have been published with several more planned or in production. I have the original Dran Nach Osten and Unentshieden, Narvik, Merita-Merkur, and Case White from the 70's. I had a ping pong table with hard cardboard extensions for DNO with Unt and I played as Germany while two friends played the Soviet Union while I was assigned in Germany in the early 80's. I got as far as the outskirts of Moscow and had captured Leningrad when my two friends were transferred stateside. That was the last time I played, after that I returned to the States, then over to Italy and finally back to the States, when I finally retired from the Army.
After Germany we started our family so I pretty much gave up on board games. I was so happy when computer war games started coming out. You can google The Europa Series to get more information about the series. Eventually rules were supposed to be published that allowed you to use all the maps and play the European Theater and North Africa and the Middle East. I think you would need to rent a warehouse to put all the maps together.
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The thing I used the "family's" ping-pong table for was setting up SPI's War in Europe and War in the Pacific. Those were loads of fun.According to wikipeia, over a dozen games have been published with several more planned or in production. I have the original Dran Nach Osten and Unentshieden, Narvik, Merita-Merkur, and Case White from the 70's. I had a ping pong table with hard cardboard extensions for DNO with Unt and I played as Germany while two friends played the Soviet Union while I was assigned in Germany in the early 80's. I got as far as the outskirts of Moscow and had captured Leningrad when my two friends were transferred stateside. That was the last time I played, after that I returned to the States, then over to Italy and finally back to the States, when I finally retired from the Army.
After Germany we started our family so I pretty much gave up on board games. I was so happy when computer war games started coming out. You can google The Europa Series to get more information about the series. Eventually rules were supposed to be published that allowed you to use all the maps and play the European Theater and North Africa and the Middle East. I think you would need to rent a warehouse to put all the maps together.
And by the way -- one other thing about grognards is that they mostly prefer to play turn-based, IGOUGO or WEGO games. I don't want to revive those endless bitch sessions they used to have all over the Matrix forums when HOI first came out, about whether RTS or turn-based games were better. I loved HOI -- and still do, in some ways -- but there's nothing quite like those games for detail and good AI play.
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@Meglok, my WWII tabletop obsession is almost as bad. I use several screw bin organizers for the thousands of counters. I have custom cut glass panes to perfectly cover my maps, making it easy to slide the counters around. The glass is even grooved along the edges so no one gets cut. My wife is not annoyed at me disappearing two weeks for a game. She is mad because I make her park on the street for two weeks!
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