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John Poole

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So if the Germans take Paris France automatically surrenders regardless of how the battle is actually going...is that a good thing or bad thing?

On one hand it ensures that the war has a good probability of going its historical route. It means the German player wont have to put up with the tiresome possibility of getting bogged down on the Western Front for a few years while peering nervously over at the Red Menace.

It also means the possibility of a resisting France cannot even be explored...and besides so what is an Infantry division just happens to squeeze into Paris? Maybe the Allies could have easily thrown the Hun back out again? It means the French MUST fight stubbornly at the borders and exchange bodies for time and space...it seems to ensure that only a static and stubborn defensive strategy holds any chance for French success. There are much fewer possibilities for manuever because of the Achilles' Heel located just two provinces from your border. Also the threat of the capitol's fall might encourage some French players to begin an unhistorical scramble to get valuable units out of France and into likely Free French colonies. I think a Human France anyway should have a choice to fight on if Paris falls.
 

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Originally posted by Patric123
yes i think that in a future patch it should be made that the french player can fight on. and they didnt give up even when Paris surrendered. although they fought half heartedly

Yeah you got to admit you would have been pretty demoralized at that point. Several soldiers commited suicide...I admit it would have been tempting. Still if Paul Renaud had not recalled Petain from Spain I bet the French Govt. would not have signed the armistice and fled to Algeria to keep fighting like Renaud had planned. Of course the Assembly might have kicked him out of power anyway...
 

Yozhik

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Bad morale or bad morale, but when a single tank(!) takes Paris while French are sieging Berlin, we're got a problem, Houston...

If 1.01 ain't fixing that, I so am deleting the Vichy event from the database.
 

unmerged(2539)

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Vichy France can be formed when Paris is occupied, plus other key point geogrphical objectives are also held, not quite the same thing, and then it still only an option, available to the german player to take less than he might get by putting the french to the sword.

In 3 months time youl be worring why the paragugian gueatamialian 1937 war isnt included yet, practice a little patience.....

HB
 

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Originally posted by Yozhik
Bad morale or bad morale, but when a single tank(!) takes Paris while French are sieging Berlin, we're got a problem, Houston...

If 1.01 ain't fixing that, I so am deleting the Vichy event from the database.

Yeah that is even more ridiculous :D. But from a HoI game balance point of view, is it a good thing or not a good thing to help ensure the Germans dont get bogged down fighting the French for months on end after they have already clearly won? This is artificial but perhaps it helps move the game along. After all most American players will probably want to do D-Day and so forth. OTOH it seems to penalize the French player too severly because of the historical outcome of the battle of France.

What if the Germans paradrop a division into a Paris way behind the lines :D?
 

unmerged(2539)

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Originally posted by Patric123
yes i think that in a future patch it should be made that the french player can fight on. and they didnt give up even when Paris surrendered. although they fought half heartedly

What makes you think they cant already.

HB
 

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Originally posted by Hannibal Barca
Vichy France can be formed when Paris is occupied, plus other key point geogrphical objectives are also held, not quite the same thing, and then it still only an option, available to the german player to take less than he might get by putting the french to the sword.

In 3 months time youl be worring why the paragugian gueatamialian 1937 war isnt included yet, practice a little patience.....

HB

So the German player makes the Vichy offer, but can the French player decline? I think that would be preferrable. After the offer is declined though it cant be offered again...though why anybody would shed tears over Vichy France not being formed I dont know.

The Paraguyan-Guatamalan conflict of 1937 is NOT INCLUDED?! THAT'S IT!! BOYCOTT!! :D

Hey wait...those two countries have never to war with each other before...they aren't even remotely close to each other! :p
 

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Originally posted by Hannibal Barca
What makes you think they cant already.

HB

The FAQ by McGregor seemed to indicate that if you lose Paris *boom* Vichy is formed and all you have left are the Free French colonies (with no industry to speak of, of course). The Russian posts that Vozhik is so nobly translating for us also seem to indicate this.
 

Yozhik

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What if the Germans paradrop a division into a Paris way behind the lines

That is a fair game. A full division with a few more right behind them are a fair game. One tank isn't.

The Russian posts that Vozhik is so nobly translating for us also seem to indicate this.

Incorrect. I am yet to find a mention of the French colonies in the Russian posts... only on this forum.
 

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Originally posted by Yozhik
What's wrong with wanting to delete a few lines that would take 30 seconds to paste right back?

The event is there for a reason and it's historical.. But one sees a player aberration and it's bad and should be deleted ...
 

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Originally posted by BiB
Germans can offer or not and the French can accept or not.

Ugh, seeing people talking about "I'll delete that from the game" before they even got the game ... :rolleyes:

Ah good! Much ado about nothing then :D. That does make things better. Playing France doesn't have to be as hopeless as it looked at first. Vive La Republique and all that. I wouldn't want the French to abandon Brugge and Flanders to the German aggressors after all :D.
 

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I do think that vichy should require 2 french cities to be taken just to stop a sneaky unit from capturing it. Although I don't think one of them should be Paris as IIRC the french didn't defend paris they just declared it an open city. I don't know what cities should be used to trigger vichy but it shouldn't be too hard as you don't want get bogged down in a unhistorically lengthened french campaign and also it shouldn't be too hard for the ai to do.
 

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The event is there for a reason and it's historical.. But one sees a player aberration and it's bad and should be deleted ...

*grumble* But why does AI always accept it, no matter how gimpy are the forces that took Paris and no matter how successful French are in Europe?

It should be at least 80%/20% historical/random EU2 rule...
 

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Originally posted by John Poole
So the German player makes the Vichy offer, but can the French player decline? I think that would be preferrable. After the offer is declined though it cant be offered again...though why anybody would shed tears over Vichy France not being formed I dont know.

The Paraguyan-Guatamalan conflict of 1937 is NOT INCLUDED?! THAT'S IT!! BOYCOTT!! :D

Hey wait...those two countries have never to war with each other before...they aren't even remotely close to each other! :p

Sorry wrong tin pot dictors war, i was thinking of the Chaco war between paraguay and Bolivia in 38.

HB
 

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Originally posted by Cossack
I do think that vichy should require 2 french cities to be taken just to stop a sneaky unit from capturing it. Although I don't think one of them should be Paris as IIRC the french didn't defend paris they just declared it an open city. I don't know what cities should be used to trigger vichy but it shouldn't be too hard as you don't want get bogged down in a unhistorically lengthened french campaign and also it shouldn't be too hard for the ai to do.

Maybe Marsielles? :) It would be nice to see a Petain event where you get the choice to put him in the government and if you do the national assembly votes him into power, he then creates a Fascist State that surrenders to Germany.
 

BiB

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Originally posted by Yozhik
*grumble* But why does AI always accept it, no matter how gimpy are the forces that took Paris and no matter how successful French are in Europe?

It should be at least 80%/20% historical/random EU2 rule...

It is, aren't u paying attention?

And the likelihood that the French are succesful when the event triggers (bar a player aberration) are virtually zilch.