There is a separate problem in the game that you are free to build infra up to any levels practically anywhere and it goes really fast.
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What are you supposed to do as Finland?
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There is a separate problem in the game that you are free to build infra up to any levels practically anywhere and it goes really fast.
Finland and the Wither War would become much, much more interesting once the DLC comes out.
No you see the Soviets, and Russians generally, sucked at one thing, and they sucked a lot. Combined Arms. But in their level of shitiness combined arms meant even coordinating infantry with artillery(from their own division mind you). Which means they bombarded with their artillery first but then they couldnt sychronize their infantry attack or even move the artillery barage deeper in the enemy defensive line to stop reinforcements coming in. So naturally when the infantry came the enemy was not supressed and just mowed down the Russian peasants. Its not like the other countries had any different tactics-the infantry can attack an entrenched possition in no other way after all. But they had the defenders suppressed until the last minute. Nobody was using their own infantry weapons for suppression back then btw, except of course the Germans.
As for TIK well look he has some good videos but when he talks about operations and economics he is litterally shit. I mean he had a video where he claimed the Germans were confiscating Jewish properties to save Germany from bankrupcy.Yeah ok, lets they say they consficated every Jew's property and miracusly liquidated it at the same time. That would keep the state afloat for what? 10 days? I wont even mention his nonsense about the 3rd battle of Kharkov.
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I don't know if you are being ironic or not by now because if you are not, then I strongly suggest not to use fanfiction or youtube fan movies as historical sources.
1921-1922 Soviet-Finnish conflicts and uprising backed by Finland, ended up with defeat if finnish forces. Educate yourself at least on your country's history.
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Correct me if I am wrong, but wasnt that war the reason Finland was considered a threat to the Soviet Union, and hence the Winter War 18 years later?
I suggest you read up on Russian tactics in the Winter War.
To quote myself:
CrazyZombie claimed the Russo-Finnish border was in a state of undeclared war throughout the 20s and 30s. This is simply false.
The volunteer expeditions to aid other Finnic peoples around Finland in 1918-20 consisted of some hundreds of Finns joined by locals and were not backed by the Finnish government; they were private individuals who organised and funded the expeditions themselves. It's also worth mentioning that during the time of the expeditions, with the exception of those ~500 Finns that went to aid the East Karelians in their uprising of 1921-22, a state of war existed between Finland and Russia.
Russian propaganda about these expeditions being state-sponsored do not hold water upon closer inspection, and this shouldn't even be surprising considering the small size of the expeditions. After all, Finland already in 1918 had an army of tens of thousands of men, and was fully capable of launching an invasion into Soviet Russia, had she desired to do so.
Considering how much ground even the tiny volunteer forces managed to take, a state-sponsored liberation of East Karelia and Northern Ingria might've been the wiser choice to make, and resulted in territorial gains for Finland in the peace treaty. Instead, Finland's political leadership, swayed by moderate liberals, was content with the liberation of the nation within her existing legal boundaries.
Oh I have.
As per Kremlin propaganda. In reality however, Finland had been a peaceful, Nordic-aligned neighbour to Russia since 1918/20 (I say 1918 because Finland attempted negotiations with Russia already in 1918, and the country attempted no aggression despite a de jure state of war existing until 1920), and the Winter War was nothing but an attempted war of conquest of the nation by Stalin. I have gone over this topic extensively on these forums in the past, e.g. in my thread from last year, see here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...-intentions-regarding-finland-in-ww2.1251115/
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Actually it was the goverment supplying the rebels. But its legit. Greece, my country, has done the same numerous times during the 19th and 20th centuries. Nothing to be shy about.
No, that was one of many border conflicts that boiled on all USSR borders. Threat to Leningrad and Finland support of Nazi germany were the main reasons. Stalin offered land exchange so Finland would get more land than they would give or 30-year rent of vital islands but Finland refused.
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It was the Western Allies that supported Finland, not Germany. It was their possible use of Finland as a base against the Soviet Union that Stalin was worried about.
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If you are talking about war support then there were a mix of both fascist(Italy) and democratic(Norway, Sweden) help, even white movement emigrees sent some men there.
The Finnish government gave some of the expeditions some loans and materiel, but they were organised by private individuals. The expeditions were not an official policy of the government, which is paradoxical since 1918-20 the government's goal was to incorporate East Karelia or parts of it into Finland.
Oh boy, going full-Molotov here. I guess next you're going to tell me the Finns started the Winter War by shelling Russian troops at Mainila. You got your transcript wrong though: 1939-41 the Russians were claiming Finland was doing England's capitalist-imperialist bidding against the happy family of soviet socialist nations, not Germany's.
It was neither. No-one was supporting Finland in 1939. Only Germany began supporting the country, beginning in August 1940 in the form of geopolitical protection (denying Russia's request to "finish the job" with Finland) and trade deals regarding grain and certain defensive armaments (mainly AA guns and mines).
You've insulted me twice now. I won't reciprocate: it's the mature thing to do and more importantly I don't want to get banned.
I understand you are most likely Russian and considering the political climate in Russia related to speaking the truth about historical events that display the country in a negative light, I do not entirely blame you for your attitude and lack of knowledge. However as you obviously speak English, I suggest obtaining information on these matters from non-Russian sources as well.
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Any suggestion that the initial USSR goal with Finland was anything less than a complete regime change in Helsinki is Stalinist era propaganda.
The USSR is gone. There's no good reason to keep perpetuating soviet era lies.
The USSR is gone. There's no good reason to keep perpetuating soviet era lies.
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Your "you are russian and brainwashed by Kremlin propaganda and your opinion should be disregarded" strawman attitude is insulting to many more people as well, yet most try to keep things civil but to no avail.
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Uhh i think if everyone would be as knowledgeable and open-minded as hkrommel is the world would be a better place
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You implied I am ignorant of history, even that of my own country's, and then proceeded to call me deluded.
Despite this I was trying to sympathize with your view of historical events, in this case some of it being based on false information, and encouraged you to seek less biased sources of education on these matters. Why would I ever think being Russian automatically makes one brainwashed? That's such a funny notion that I actually laughed while typing that. Heck, some of the data I use is from Russian historians who are educated on these topics, and some of them even taught me a few things. Obviously though a lot of that differs from Kremlin-sanctioned propaganda.
EDIT: If you want Russian sources, try using works from the likes of Yuri Kilin and Bair Irincheev.
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There is no white peace trigger in-game during the Winter War. White peace means returning to the state existing before the war.
However, there is an in-game trigger or a pop-up window allowing Finland to sign an early peace if ceding territory for the Soviets. It's not returning to the state existing before the war, but making concessions and agreeing the peace terms dictated by the Soviet Union.
I wouldn't say this as a main problem. The Finnish guerrilla warfare, known in English as long-range patrols (Kaukopartiotoiminta in Finnish) truely is missing from the in-game mechanics, but the long-range patrol activity was quite a minor event during the Winter War. Long-range patrol activity was at its peak during the Continuation War and the "stealth" operations had significance even in when solving the victor-side of some decisive battles like Ilomantsi in 1944. The main problem is that PDX and HOI4 still cannot represent how to trigger the Continuation War.
Another problem is Swedish aid, in the game Sweden gets the option of sending I think 500 or 1000 rifles, it doesn't help much. In real history so was it much more:
- 50,013,300 rounds of small arms ammunition
- 135,402 rifles
- 450 light machine guns
- 347 machine guns
- 301,846 artillery shells
- 144 field guns
- 92 anti-armor guns
- 100 anti-aircraft guns
- 300 sea mines
- 500 depth charges
- 83 motorcycles
- 83 cars
- 350 trucks
- 13 tractors
- 17 fighter aircraft
- 5 light bombers
- 1 transport aircraft
- 3 reconnaissance aircraft
Those weapons would make the job far easier then it is right now. The problem is that there is pretty much noway for Sweden to have that much stuff in the game to give away.
Swedish intervention in the Winter War - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Yes, I agree. Actually Sweden could be very interesting nation in-game if the country was reworked. The Swedish intervention in the Winter War released a significant amount of Finnish troops to other front sections as the Swedish "volontärer" took the front responsibility in the Finnish Lapland. Swedish neutrality was veritably tested during the "Midsommarkrisen". This was probably the moment, if the Swedes would like to join the WWII, this would be the exact time. Building the Skåne-Line Sweden balanced between the Allied and Axis pressure playing her cards with remaining "neutrality".
Not true. Finland is without the Karelian Isthmus and Ladogan Karelia, but still owns South Karelia and North Karelia.
Not so sure "guerrilla warfare" is the right term here (at least with regards to the operations deep into East Karelia). It was deep recon & sabotage into the enemy's rear, with small formations (I think many were even only section-sized).
Talking about this has made me want to rewatch Rukajärven tie...
This is not correct. I'll quote myself from page 1 of this thread:
You can go read the entire post for context here.
I used the term guerrilla warfare because there isn't better description in English. It's long-range patrolling, or like you said, deep recon & sabotage.
Rukajärven tie, the movie is a story of a Finnish spearhead bicycle company or a platoon - not actually operating behind the enemy lines, but doing recon during the Finnish offensive phase in the midst of the Finnish main attack and the retreating Soviets
Exactly what wasn't correct in my post? While the Swedish volunteers arrived in Salla, five Finnish infantry battalions were released from the front duty there and sent to south to more crucial and urgent fronts.