This is actually really annoying.
Moving to spockyt with claims of consolidation, also conveniently pushes Spockyt up above all other candidates.
Wow, really? It's almost like that's what consolidation
is: placing some candidates above others. Incidentally, what other candidates do you think I should have picked?
Says that Spockyt isn't that suspicious for voting me, although later she'd hop on the Spockyt case.
Later, after he makes
another really overcautious post. Right. I did not think he was suspicious for voting you, but rather for the manner in which he did.
Suggests Avatar for the switch and votes him. Gets jumpy that a few people are voting me.
Close to deadline. Placing you above the voteswitch (the same action you claim makes me look suspicious when done
earlier).
Not gonna spend much time on this since I already covered it, but starts going after k-59 for being inattentive. I still maintain that due to the above comment this was also an attempt to look like she was protecting me.
Remember how I freaked out after aedan accused me of making the same mistake twice? I try to not make the same mistake twice.
There's not really a possible defense other than what I've already said. I've
already explained.
Uses the excuse that she wouldn't have done that if she was going to be disproven. Well, she didn't know she was going to be disproven. Avatar had his vote off of me and could have easily sniped me to death which would have made her case look pretty damn good. Also, it's easy to pretend like you're convinced about a poor case especially early.
Jesus Christ. So you think that I was asking people to vote avatar because I thought he was a wolf because I thought they wouldn't do what I asked so I would look better? I don't know what kind of crazy wolf you think I am, but rest assured that this convoluted plan not only fails Occam's Razor, but also is a really stupidly risky thing to do. And you used Occam's Razor to argue k-59's innocence; if k-59 is presumed innocent I should be too.
Mentions MC maybe being a wolf, but quickly mentions that he was being run up so he it's not that suspicious. Casts suspicion on him for "saving" Spockyt as well (although a voteswitch necessarily means moving off the top candidates). Honestly, it looks like she's trying to set up MC to be "cleared" when Spockyt is lynched/hunted. Since she tries to say that MC could have tried to save Spockyt and if Spockyt turned up villager he looks less wolfish by being able to disprove the theory that MC was trying to save him.
Right, but the thing is,
he actually isn't suspicious because he saved himself. Tell me, exactly how would you expect me to analyze a voteswitch in which MC decides to move votes off of himself and Spock that
isn't suspicious? "I think MC is a horrible, suspicious person, because he wanted to voteswitch off himself"? "MC is definitely a wolf and I'll vote him now because Spock clearly was a villager who MC decided to not vote but rather switch off of for no apparent reason"? Tell me, how was I supposed to realize MC was suspicious without being linked to Spock? I pointed out that MC was suspicious due to his voteswitch and that
Spock could be a villager while MC was a wolf.
Posts a long post where she throws suspicion on a lot of people. Note that she says the reaction to the opposition of avatar was led by MC, while she herself also led it by attacking k-59.
So? I'm a wolf because... I mentioned that DBW followed MC and you without thought before I posted. He followed MC and happy,
not me, because I posted
after DBW posted. It's kind of difficult to understand, I know, this whole temporal thing.
Spends most of the time talking about DBW and k-59 and throws MC in there with jack all to back up her reasoning. I'm really seeing the strong suspicion and evidence she built against MC. /s In reality, looks more like a wolf throwing in a packmate to look less suspicious.
Frankly, this is growing really tiring. You are interpreting every situation through the lense of me already being a wolf. You've already decided I'm a wolf before looking at my posts. It results in absurdly convoluted plots and absurd motives ascribed to me.
You realize that this is on the
same day where I was talking about why I suspected MC a few posts up, right?
Moves to start talking about throwaway voters.
I know, what kind of crazy wolf tries to lynch throwaway voters?
Response to a bunch of posts. MC is still kept in her list of candidates without much reason.
Did you ever hear about "keeping a candidate in mind"? That's what I'm doing.
Also ends up disagreeing with MC about his case on k-59 but ends up agreeing with his vote. Also, this really weird line, "If you are a villager, I would have rather chosen you to lynch than happy or avatar". Was that a little slip there, Aziz? Oh also probably the only time she points out a hole in one of MC's cases. Early in D2 while still agreeing with his vote.
That was me, reasoning from a hypothetical wolf's perspective. If I had been the people who chose avatar and happy (both presumed villagers for this purpose) over madchemist, presumed villager, and if I had been a wolf, then I would have chosen to lynch madchemist because he is, supposedly, a stronger analyzer. I was pointing out that his case sort of implicated him as a wolf because he assumed that the people chosen above him were not wolves but was trying to say the people who chose the people above him were wolves. (It's complicated.) I expect you interpret this as me trying to tie madchemist to villagers, but it's not.
It doesn't make sense as a wolf slip up; I don't really see why I'd say this as a wolf.
Asks about Aedan's opinion of MC
Yeah, because I was
suspicious of him.
Agrees that MC is tied to Spock. Again, this sets up being able to move suspicion off MC when Spockyt turns up villager.
I know, it's obvious because aedan was also a baddie — oh wait. Aedan, confirmed goodie, agreed with me. Again, what exactly did you expect any case on MC to involve?
For reference this was two hours before deadline, four nonvoters (the count on the page above this quote leaves out Wagon as a nonvoter), and with four candidates one vote behind DBW. In other words, plenty of time to propose an alternate candidate besides DBW and push them up as the second candidate. Of course, it just so happens to be that Wagon was one of those four players with one vote less than DBW, so maybe she was trying to protect him from being brought up into the fray.
It's a post directed to Lufwafer, who sounded truly confused. He was obviously struggling with so many choices ("I'm such an idiot" "I don't know what I"m doing") that limiting it to two candidates was my way of helping him not freak out. I'm sure you've read the parenting books about not presenting kids with too many choices ("Do you want a green or a blue or a red or an aquamarine sippie cup?" vs. "Do you want a red or a blue sippie cup?"). Same deal here.
Responds to Luftwafer's analysis, again focusing on Spock and DBW and pushing off the case on herself to make it seem ridiculous.
I know, making cases on myself seem ridiculous is really wolfish, isn't it?
Kind of odd reasoning that has nothing to do with avatar. Points out k-59 again as suspicious.
No. When a votechange doesn't gain momentum, it's a bit suspicious. That's what I meant.
Makes this weird comment.
Acting oblivious? I expect someone who's played as long as Aziz to know this by now.
Yeah, obviously wolfish. *rolls eyes* I'm not the most TIE-happy player (in fact, I usually don't like the TIE for no reason mentality), and I know some people are ardently against making them. I didn't want to act without telling people, because good communication is a must in WW.
Defends DBW.
Aedan makes a case where he reiterates much of what he already said and suddenly she jumps on DBW.
Er, no? He responded to the posts of DBW that I had read over, and brought up new points. It was reasonable enough to agree with aedan; aedan agreed with aedan!
And who do you think I was trying to save, anyway? The villager MC chose to lynch?
Please stop making mountains out of molehills. I prefer to know in advance why people are doing things so I don't waste my time getting suspicious of them.
Another odd comment. Madchemist says he wants to break the tie and prefers the candidate he is voting (obviously) and this is her response.
No, MC was not yet voting Spock. MC was voting Jerman or another candidate.
Seems fine with madchemist's objection to the tie if he'll break it in DBW's favor.
I thought MC had forgotten he didn't have his vote on Jerman.
I don't see how this is supposed to be diabolical.
Basically, wants to tie saying she doesn't want us wasting tomorrow voting up the candidate who survives. Which is silly and a poor reason to use the tie so it just comes off as wanting to waste our free tie.
Yeah, so silly that aedan the goodie thought this too. Really?
Really? This was immediately confirmed by aedan voting DBW, yet again, the following day (though now I know that this wasn't his real intention). This happens in WW games — people still want to lynch the one who escaped the TIE because nothing has changed in the cases. You are so suspicious you can't see anything except your suspicion.
Continues to defend the case on DBW.
Continues to include MC in her list of suspicious people. Also, this is the last time we see her include MC in her list of suspicious people. She poked all of one hole in MC's cases. In other words, I'm not buying the whole story that she was opposed to MC throughout the game and consistently kept up decent pressure on him because she found him suspicious.
No, I've never argued I kept pressure on him. There is little I can say that shows opposition to MC — but then again, little k-59 or Ironhide can say in that regard, either — so I settled for mentioning that I was suspicious of him. This is seriously annoying.
Moves off the case on DBW, although nothing has changed and she had plenty of time to analyze it and realize it was poor before this.
And this makes me a more likely wolf because...? Because...? Because I was too lazy to go back and analyze almost every post of DBW's before Deadline? Excuse me, but — no.
[QUOTE}Also I never saw this part:
"Happy, I wasn't, by the way, one of the people actually countering the votes onto you. You were suspicious because I got suspicious of k-59. You should also be suspicious because avatar was
actually protecting you."
And my response is this, my suspicions on you after D1 never really relied on you countering votes on me (although you did, because you voted Avatar instead of me) and in fact it strengthens my point if we assume you didn't counter votes on me.[/QUOTE]
Are you serious? You placed suspicion on me earlier in attacking me for "protecting you".
My point was that you have, in the past, vehemently defended villagers who were about to be lynched as a wolf in an attempt to make yourself look better. Me being lynched would have been great for you if my suspicions are correct.
See, this is what I mean. You're assuming that I was trying to defend you, when really, I was attacking k-59 for making a pivotal vote that looked like it was saving avatar. You've got this same convoluted case where I'm berating k-59 for voting you while still expecting people to vote you such that you would die. That's... not a good plan.
Also, that last sentence. What? How was avatar actually protecting me? He died without a peep. Unless you mean that he didn't vote snipe me. I guess, Aziz means that DBW was actually protecting me by voting for avatar, but either way, my point wasn't that people in general protected me. It was that Aziz specifically seemed upset that I was gaining traction and went after k-59 when I know she's done this in the past.
I assume you mean this last sentence: The part that I find dubious is the contradiction where he voted avatar despite being suspicious of the people who switched onto avatar. However, it makes sense when you realize it was, due to k-59's vote, a choice between happy, who he says was a worse candidate, and avatar.
I am discounting the contradiction between DBW saying the voters of avatar were suspicious and his action where DBW voted avatar despite this, due to DBW's stated logic concerning who to vote (you or avatar). It has nothing to do with DBW protecting you (though DBW was actually protecting you, as he stated, by the way).
I specifically was suspicious because I saw that avatar was gaining resistance, not that you were gaining traction. In a world without a voteswitch, I would not have been so suspicious.
Your case is also heavily predicated on you being a villager.
Responds to LK's and DBW's cases against each other. Basically does a lot to undermine DBW and his case against LK.
And LK's case against DBW. It was a dumb case, tbh.
Good way of averting pressure from LK. Call out your packmate for bickering with a villager and undermine both of them. You look good, people stop paying attention to your packmate, it's a win-win situation.
Are you literally — I give up. (Rhetorically.) You think the case on LK was good? You think I should have laid down and somehow had foresight that LK was a wolf and that therefore DBW wasn't a wolf? What would it have taken for you to think I was a villager? If I followed the case you would claim I was lynching a packmate on a weak case. If I said nothing you would talk about how I was notably being quiet. There is no situation here in which you don't think I'm a wolf.
Response to DBW saying his vote wasn't a revenge vote since his response to LK came minutes after his with quotes and a decent amount of effort that would have taken a while to finish. Except that's entirely the point. Hard to call something a revenge vote when the person was obviously planning the case before they saw what the other person did. But again, good way of subtly underminign DBW's case and shifting attention away from LK.
The point was that there were other objections that DBW hadn't countered.
Aziz's response from LK turning up wolf. It seems suspicious to me. Seems like a convenient way of saying that you don't know who the wolves are so that was so unexpected. Seems to be trying a little too hard to look villagery.
Jesus Christ. Is there anything I've done this game you
don't think is a wolf tell?
[/QUOTE]Moves off Ironhide and on to RB to make a tie between two people with basically CAWZ cases on them.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, because, you know, TIEs are bad. Especially when it's TIE day. Especially when it's not right before deadline at all.
Aziz is probably my favored candidate for the fourth wolf. She hasn't done as much as she seems to claim against MC and she easily fits in a pack with Wagon (though most of us do). She also fits pretty well with LK and she's generally acted suspicious through the game. So let's lynch Wagon today and her tomorrow and let's win the game.
Or we can just
stop tunnel visioning. You've got this idea that I'm suspicious because I've got this really over-the-top plan about getting goodie cred, and you've had it since D2. There is literally nothing I could have done that you won't interpret as suspicious for no good reason. You don't explain why any of this "suspicious" stuff makes me mroe likely to be a wolf, for example.
Also, I'm holding out that the JL has got some juicy, game-clinching info, but until then I'll continue my silent analysis.
Oh, and by the way, I *was* going to look back through the game and write up a case, but instead I had to respond to this monster of a post.
