Well you shouldn't be cheated for this very iconic piece which I bet you know the instant you hear. Sadly this version is without the lyrics at the end.
[video=youtube;dRpzxKsSEZg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRpzxKsSEZg[/video]
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Well you shouldn't be cheated for this very iconic piece which I bet you know the instant you hear. Sadly this version is without the lyrics at the end.
[video=youtube;dRpzxKsSEZg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRpzxKsSEZg[/video]
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All the Scandinavians are Nordic-supremacists. Just look at Skobie and his legendary calmness, lording it over the rest of us...
I'm all ears. I want to see how you try to reinterpret what you said this time around.
Have you been paying any attention, or are you trying to save a packmate right now?
Everyone knows Peer Gynt. Everyone.
Really? Rovsea's statement is something of a different nature entirely than merely poor wording. It combines a statement that implies that I can only be a villager with an accusation of my wolfishness. And when he's called out on that fact, he has tried to change the meaning of that statement multiple times in a manner that is utterly inconsistent with any possible reading of that aforementioned statement. He has dodged the question as much as he can when asked about it here and in IRC. He knows he's been caught, and is trying to squirm out of it any way he can.
We have a wolf here, plainly revealed in the light of day by his own clumsy mistake. We need to be rid of him.
EVERYBODY VOTE ROVSEA THE WOLF
No. I know that many Americans are quite intelligent and well read. How do you read that out of me posting In the Hall of the Mountain King?
Indeed; and most people know everal pieces of Edvard Griegs score for Peer Gynt (which is the original score). Though they may not know what it is called. This one is also from Grieg's score for Peer Gynt and also very well known.
[video=youtube;wCEzh3MwILY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCEzh3MwILY[/video]
Ok, time for that argument against Madchemist I promised.
I'm going to start at the first Day.
There's some discussion between Dr. L and Euro.
'( ), I consider Wagon a much less likely wolf.
There was also a little bit of a scuffle between Nikk and EURO, where Toucan called out Euro on defending the Aziz Lynch. Toucan is a little less suspicious than he was before.
And this ends up turning into an argument between MC and Nikk that spans more posts than I care to quote. Suffice it to say that Toucan's main defense was that he posted that he would be less active. The aggressiveness with which MC followed up on his vote post prompted Toucan to advocate a lynching of MC, as seen below.
I didn't post my rebuttal to MC's defensive post since that post is more or less obsoleted by this one.
k;18318484]Part 1: I think your arguement is "Oh no I got caught doing something bad...um 'I am waaaay too good to play that bad guyz'..."
Part 2: I. Said. I. Would. Be. Quiet. Please at least acknowledge that.
I have 39 posts, all of which are game related. I have pushed targets and been apart of discussion, most of which was today on both you and aziz hanging and the need to have more discussion with Euro[/QUOTE]
Don't worry, MC has the perfect counter to point #1
But in all seriousness, while in hindsight it does seem a little bit less suspicious, the speed and synchronicity with which they both switch to a new candidate seems a litle suspicious to me.
There was some vote switching with Dadar and Leondark. Interesting to note that once again Leondark quietly put in a vote on a bandwagon case, and made a TIE. Dadar eventually remakes the TIE after Leon inadvertently breaks it, MC advises Leon to stay put, and al-Aziz and Arkasas are both lynched as villagers.
Oh wait. Wagon was hunted you say? Forget everything I posted discussing Wagon as a candidate.
*Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm*
So, what I was trying to say was that MC gambled by so strongly urging for a TIE between myself and PC, and also by so strongly urging the TIE between Arkasas and al-Aziz. As a wolf, he knew that in both cases he was killing a villager, and that the vote record would show him as a good candidate.
That was my point. And the Vote Record does show MC as a good candidate, but upon a lengthy examination of this game, the behavioral record, just as important, if not more-so, as voting, shows MC to be a villager who gambled on villagers being wolves twice, and failed, twice. He shouldn't be lynched because of that. I retract my other argumentative posts between the one quoted and this one as well, they are obsolete.
I'm going to start at the first Day.
I'm not going to even check on that, we have a lot more to look through. Not sure if MC is just joking, or what's happening here.
And then of course, we have Panzer Commader doing this. Let's look at some reactions.
Xarkan immediately smells a fish.
And Dadar does not. :laugh: Apparently, he needs to work on his situational awareness skills.
Xarkan seems to get this a looooong time before we killed Panzer on Day 2.
And Xarkan finally gets some support as well.
So, I guess looking all the way back to Day 1 was a good move. Seems like MC is trying to help out his packmate.
See? Euro gets it.
Hmmm.
And shockingly, at this point the votes are still pretty close. Don't worry. Euro will fix that soon.
And yes, all of these posts were consecutive. The EURO is strong in the force. Anyway, we can clearly see MC, as well as several others, switch onto Kai. This is fairly inconclusive, however, since it is almost guaranteed that there are 3 villagers in this bandwagon. (Unless we think all three wolves aside from PC joined in.)
:rofl:
And as we can see, Kai is now in the lead by 2. If PC chose, he could put it out of the snipe range of a single player.
But the Toucan is restless, and decides that he wants a vote swing.
MC backs him up. Why the attempted swing? I can certainly understand it, seeing as Kai was a horrible candidate, in that there literally was no argument against him besides, "He is a wolf". Clarification here would be nice.
And then the swing back. To put it out of snipe range? Technically a TIE could still be made here. Whatever the reason (which I would certainly like to hear), Panzer escapes and Kai, the villager, is lynched.
Another interesting tidbit. In fact, the Kaiwagon reminds me a lot of a game played recently where the Jontiwagon formed with similar speed, and also at the behest of EURO. EURO was a wolf in that game. Just something to keep in mind.
First vote of Day 2. Not altogether unreasonable.
Toucan puts a little more pressure on.
Wait, really? First three votes of the day?
I find the lack of a parrot in any of MC's votes disturbing.
Former self makes a ridiculous post accusing Aedan of being a wolf, and then voting Euro, presumably because of the Kaiwagon.
MC at least spots the bandwagon of death, and also says that there's something up with Aedan. Their are a few posts exchanged between the two, and soon MC is less suspicious, but still cautiously voting Aedan.
Fair enough, although Toucan's continued push for Arky is a tad concerning at this point. Also, he did warn well in advance about recording obligations. In my book, these two posts cancel each other out.
Seriously? A 4th vote? This bandwagon is getting ridiculous.
And once again, EURO is there to blunt a bandwagon, this time attacking a bandwagoner of Arky the villager.
There's some discussion between Dr. L and Euro.
And Dr. L backs off. Is EURO a wolf getting goodie points, or is he just a villager concerned with an early bandwagon? In my book he's neutral. On the one hand, he could be doing this to claim credit later, and he did start the bandwagon on Kai day 1. At the same time, this is a perfectly natural response of a villager to an unreasonable Day2 bandwagon. The two considerations cancel each other out.
Thank you. :angry:
Former self becomes the first person to vote who we now know is a wolf after day 1. Go former self!
But don't worry, Dr. L is still getting suspicion for his poor vote.
And some votes later we are looking at a TIE. Aedan, Dr. L, and Arkasas each have three votes. Personally, only really one of these would have looked suspicious to me at the time (I can't speak for Alxeu's opinion on the subject), and that would be Dr. L. There really isn't that good of a case on Arky or Aedan here, whereas the Dr.L vote seems, frankly, suspicious.
Dr. L becomes the 2nd person to vote PC on day 2. I am now officially less concerned with him being a wolf.
Buuuut, really? All three? Perhaps this is one of the posts that would later get al-Aziz lynched?
I like all three candidates- what do other people think?
MC tries to rally the village. Hmmm, this is a fairly good sign from him, actually.
Fail count, which is mentioned later. (Look at the Arkasas voters, then look at the Panzer voters)
EURO quickly changes his vote, and then reconsiders, landing on PC. This is another good sign from him. I'm now leaning more towards goodie.
An interesting post from Aedan, if for no other reason than it breaks a TIE (although this might not have been known at the time). Other than that, it seems to be a fairly logical viewpoint for a villager to have. Aedan is edging a little more away from baddie for me, now.
And then Aedan remembers that PC made a really stupid post at the beginning of the first day. He switches onto Panzer, actually putting him ahead, although it is still likely that many people see a TIE here. (Because of the failed votecount) I would say that this makes Aedan a less likely wolf, as he actually put PC into the lead on the 2nd Day, and therefore at real risk for the first time that day.
Well, I know that I'm responding to this pretty late, but that's not necessarily true. Although it's hard to know for certain, fairly accurate guesses can often be made after looking at behavioral and voting history, especially if the player is new. Not sure of this post was meant to try and influence PC votes or not, but Leondark is slightly more suspicious in my eyes.
And finally there is some definite momentum onto Panzer.
Errr, or not, I suppose. Again, this could be one of those posts that got al-Aziz lynched.
Just four posts earlier, MC advocates killing Panzer, this vote suggests an alternative. I find this slightly suspicious, but not truly incriminating, as it is possible that a smart villager would want to gather more information and hedge his bets.
And finally, there is some momentum on Panzer.
What, again? In hindsight, these posts can look fishy. I'm not sure about this one, but I'll go with Wagon looking just slightly more suspicious.
No former self! Don't do it! Your bravery will only get you killed! Unfortunately, my death will unfold fairly predictably from here. :sad:
This is actually a good question. In hindsight, it tends to look more suspicious, like Wagon unvoting for the TIE.
Yes, it was a good question, and this is former self's response. Since I consider it semi-gamebreaking to give my opinion from that point, when I was technically playing a different character, I will hold off on analyzing this post.
Of course this does bring MC back into the focus somewhat. At this point, if MC is a wolf, he could be doing two things at once. A.) Telling Packmate Panzer to put up an effort right now, and B.) Trying to persuade the village off of voting PC. Of course, it could also be a logical approach to the unreasonable authority of former self's post. Former self is actually making it a lot harder to analyze Chemist here.
This actually does make sense. It appears that former self knew how bold his post sounded.
And Panzer is put more firmly in the lead.
I agree with this guy, you should totally have waited a day before lynching me.
Why do I get the feeling that I overuse that word, "gambling"? Anyways, it appears that former self knew he was taking a risk.
That hurts, Wagon. :sad:
And here we have the beginning of the end. This post actually makes me slightly, but only slightly, more suspicious of EURO.
And another person wants former self dead.
What did I even do to you people?
Hmmm. Apparently former self found EURO's post suspicious. Or maybe he was just trying to survive?
Well, THAT wasn't suspicious.
And Wagon has to step in. For maintaining the TIE, even though he killed former self
'( ), I consider Wagon a much less likely wolf.As has been pointed out, this post is inconclusive.
And finally a correct count... After deadline! :mellow:
Forgot about this post. This likely influenced the death of al-Aziz, but it also makes MC slightly more suspicious.
An interesting couple of posts, though for the life of me, I can't figure out if there's any deeper meaning.
I decide to quote former self's opinion of MC and al-Aziz, that should he die and be a villager, while Panzer was a wolf, those two would be suspicious. I maintain that this is a rational villager move.
Arky agrees.
Aedan essentially makes what will be MC's defense for the day. However, he is also pushing al-Aziz. Slightly more suspicious now.
Aedan raises a valid concern, one shared by quite a few people yesterday.
Interesting, especially considering later on. I can't seem to get a good read on Toucan this game. He seems to like posing short questions, but I haven't seen him go fully in-depth this game yet. Could just be a playstyle issue, but I have my eye on him still.
That's kind of weak, actually.
This is a long post, but in essence it condemns MC for being on of the biggest supporters of a Former self-Panzer Commader TIE. It also accuses him of being weak on the Panzer lynch in the first place, something that can NOT be supported by in-thread evidence. It is possible that I picked this up from IRC, and I thought I picked it up from Wagon a little too, (which may have been on IRC) but given the lack of in-thread evidence, I am afraid I must drop that claim.
Thank you, thank you! I thought it was a good case too.
BUT, the al-Aziz wagon starts to pick up speed. It is interesting that EURO is the third voter here. Again, this nudges him slightly more towards suspicion for me.
Why? This seems a little excessive.
These were my feelings as well at this point, but at the same time, it seemed like a repeat of Panzer. Why would a villager just sit there and not respond to a Bandwagon. Considering that al-Aziz has very rarely been a wolf (once, twice max), she might indeed have responded like this to a sudden bandwagon. In the end, I think more activity would have saved her, and it is unfortunate that she didn't post that she would be unavailable.
Dadar redeems himself by pushing more towards MC, and evening out the field more.
Slightly more suspicion towards EURO. In hindsight, it looks like he is trying to pressure Dadar into voting a villager, and this pressure makes both him, and MC, whom he is indirectly supporting, more suspicious to me.
Congratulations, Xarkan! You have been vindicated! You get credit for first spotting the PanzerWolf (TM).
There was also a little bit of a scuffle between Nikk and EURO, where Toucan called out Euro on defending the Aziz Lynch. Toucan is a little less suspicious than he was before.
This actually reflects some of my opinions on rereading the thread. I could see a pack with Euro and MC in it. Nothing conclusive yet, however.
And he we Have MadChemist's defense, quoted in full as it is likely his single most important post of the game. He confirms what I said earlier about having a natural reaction to the vehemence with which I wanted Panzer killed alone. Goodie points for MC. He is forthcoming with his playstyle, and the weaknesses in it. Plus goodie points. I can counterargument MC's point about not trying to put PC ahead by saying that by advocating TIEing as a wolf he still gets credit for killing his packmate, but also gets a "free" villager in the exchange, but this is still a solid defense overall.
This seems to be the last really strong point against MadChemist.
And again a fairly solid defense. At this point There is less of a case than I would like on him.
And then MC attacks Toucan. Toucan isn't necessarily a bad lynch though, and even as a villager MC would want to draw attention away from himself.
And Toucan's response is hardly polite.
And this ends up turning into an argument between MC and Nikk that spans more posts than I care to quote. Suffice it to say that Toucan's main defense was that he posted that he would be less active. The aggressiveness with which MC followed up on his vote post prompted Toucan to advocate a lynching of MC, as seen below.
And now EURO switches onto another candidate.
MC follows him, and all of a sudden Wagon is an actual possibility as a target.
And Wagon promptly breaks up the three way TIE, which makes sense considering that there isn't a real case against him.
Umm, anybody else concerned about Leon at this point? He's been making semi-pivotal votes all game long with zero reasoning stated, and zero attention for it.
Ok, even you have to admit that that sounds a little bit arrogant, MC.
I didn't post my rebuttal to MC's defensive post since that post is more or less obsoleted by this one.Mostly I was OK with this TIE because of al-Aziz and MC being in it. Everybody agreed that al-Aziz was a good lynch, especially early in the day, so I asked if lynching one wolf was worth the death of two villagers in IRC, and eventually in-thread as well, since I was fairly certain that there was at least one wolf in the TIE at the time.
MC comes to his senses, perhaps this helps influence the next post, perhaps his defensive post was equally as important, I can't precisely remember. Either way:
This happens, and I revise my list of top suspects so that MC is no longer in it.
And again, EURO and MC vote together. It seems that whenever one of these two move, the other helps out in the crusade against the next target, and they usually have supporters. Just off the top of my head, from Day 2 onwards. EURO was the first voter on former self, MC voted with him, and the bandwagon picked up speed. Next Day, al-Aziz is quickly voted up, especially because of EURO's vote. Then Wagon is quickly run up, first by EURO, then by MC. After a short break, and change of Vote, EURO votes Nikk, and MC follows. Why is it that EURO starts, or is a part of, so many bandwagons? And why is MC so often one of his supporters? It almost makes me think that it would make them too obvious as packmates, but nobody has pointed this out yet.
Nikk's response makes sense, and seems to invalidate MC's argument.
Well, this puts MC back on my radar again.
k;18318484]Part 1: I think your arguement is "Oh no I got caught doing something bad...um 'I am waaaay too good to play that bad guyz'..."
Part 2: I. Said. I. Would. Be. Quiet. Please at least acknowledge that.
I have 39 posts, all of which are game related. I have pushed targets and been apart of discussion, most of which was today on both you and aziz hanging and the need to have more discussion with Euro[/QUOTE]
Don't worry, MC has the perfect counter to point #1
He also addresses the second point, though I think he does a less adequate job of it. Again, MC is starting to fade from my radar.
And just like that, they've kissed and made up! I must say, you two make a great couple. :wub:
But in all seriousness, while in hindsight it does seem a little bit less suspicious, the speed and synchronicity with which they both switch to a new candidate seems a litle suspicious to me.
And then Toucan acknowledges the make-up by switching onto MC's candidate. I know that Arky got away with being run up yesterday, but there was a reason why that happened, he is probably the second worst candidate run up Day 3, in hindsight. (After Wagon)
A nice helpful suggestion by Toucan here. Looking back, I guess there could have been a case on Aedan, but overall I don't think that there's anything indicative of him right now. Moving on.
Wagon earlier made a vote suggesting that Ark may have been busy. That post will later look absolutely dead right, but I still can't blame him for putting his vote on Arky, since he was so quiet. Then again, the case of, "is quiet after being run-up", isn't necessarily that good.
What? I really don't see how Ark was behaving silly.
And so this is where my suspicions start to turn more towards MC again. Upon rereading, while he did have a fairly goodie start, Days 2 and 3 have brought him back into my focus again, although he isn't necessarily #1, I don't have a lot of choices I'd really say were suspicious.
Yes, I'd agree with this in hindsight, I believe that at the time of my posting I was hurrying to catch up, so I may not have gone back and looked at a y of Toucan's post, or any of the stuff that you guys mentioned in your argument.
Ok, I think MC accused me of setting up him as a target with this post. I can understand that, and I probably should have phrased it a little more mildly, but I believe that I've already shown that I am willing to be bold when trying to lynch my best candidate. However, I still find it suspicious that you took a weak case on Ark and got him killed with it. Can you understand my suspicion?
I completely agree with the end part of this sentence. And I haven't forgotten that you were an Arkasas voter, Wagon. :angry:
This was an optimistic tactic, but it looks like al-Aziz wasn't online for any of Day 3. I understand why EURO did it, and he had a good reason, so there isn't any extra suspicion here.
OK. I'll admit that getting back online ten minutes before your possible lynch is semi-incriminating, but at the same time, it appears that Wagon's earlier statement was correct.
There was some vote switching with Dadar and Leondark. Interesting to note that once again Leondark quietly put in a vote on a bandwagon case, and made a TIE. Dadar eventually remakes the TIE after Leon inadvertently breaks it, MC advises Leon to stay put, and al-Aziz and Arkasas are both lynched as villagers.
Oh wait. Wagon was hunted you say? Forget everything I posted discussing Wagon as a candidate.
Ok, this makes an MC-EURO + somebody pack look very unlikely. However, I'm glad to see that somebody else finally is looking at EURO with some suspicion.
Not a horrible candidate, given that it's arepeat of the Arkasas lynch, but with a more solid base. Dr.L was suspicious early both Day 1 and Day 2, but as I have posted somewhere up in that mess, his vote record is actually fairly good. Either way, I would definitely like to see more activity out of him.
Ok, this is MC's response to something that Aedan posted, which I missed. (Bound to happen, I mean, I'm trying not to respond to EVERY post here) Apparently MC has responded exactly as he does as a villager. Ugh. Now I have to rethink my argument. I'm actually leaning more towards EURO and Leondark right now than I am MC or Nikk. Not sure exactly why, maybe it's because they've drawn so little attention despite playing relevant roles throughout the entire game. Nikk is definitely sliding off my radar. MC, you're still on it, but you're at least in third.
Well. Here's me being an idiot. I guess a day of arguing on IRC and on the forums can do that to you. I'm just going to do this. *Facepalm*, then try and clarify what I was saying so that it actually makes sense.
*Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm**Facepalm*
So, what I was trying to say was that MC gambled by so strongly urging for a TIE between myself and PC, and also by so strongly urging the TIE between Arkasas and al-Aziz. As a wolf, he knew that in both cases he was killing a villager, and that the vote record would show him as a good candidate.
That was my point. And the Vote Record does show MC as a good candidate, but upon a lengthy examination of this game, the behavioral record, just as important, if not more-so, as voting, shows MC to be a villager who gambled on villagers being wolves twice, and failed, twice. He shouldn't be lynched because of that. I retract my other argumentative posts between the one quoted and this one as well, they are obsolete.
I really did word it poorly. Combine mixing up villager with leaving out a word or two, and you can see how it turns into a jumbled mess. Anyways, I think that the best suspects today are EURO and Leondark.
Vote Leondark
Vote Leondark
By request.
[video=youtube;jgS5OvsoUMY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgS5OvsoUMY[/video]
[video=youtube;jgS5OvsoUMY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgS5OvsoUMY[/video]
I was making a statement to Rovsea, and not to the others.
Move on.
Moon light sonata third movement performed beautifully by Wilhelm Kempff.
[video=youtube;oqSulR9Fymg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqSulR9Fymg[/video]
[video=youtube;oqSulR9Fymg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqSulR9Fymg[/video]
[video=youtube;2cXDgFwE13g]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cXDgFwE13g&list=PL4B2FA8FAB3328450&index=1[/video]
Y'know, now that I think of it, Euro seems to have instigated a lot of villager deaths this game, either by vote swings or by creating bandwagons. Perhaps it would do us well not to forget him as a potential wolf.
Mr. Toot by Ylvis.
[video=youtube;ASywAfBAVrQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASywAfBAVrQ[/video]
[video=youtube;ASywAfBAVrQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASywAfBAVrQ[/video]
