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ramius3443

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The voting record isn't really much useful at the moment. You need several dead baddies, who made meaningful votes/were run up to really start using it. That hasn't happened here and hence we can't really use the voting record. And until we get something solid to work with the cases will never be too solid.
I feel like you ought to know better, so I'm frankly suspicious of you too. Because the voting record is pretty much non existent (we have 6 dead people of whom 2 were baddies with pretty much no record), so you trying to use it for a case in the way you have seems really shady.
I don't think I am making a terrible controversial statement here when I say, "Something is better than nothing". Until someone presents a better case, we are dealing with subpar evidence. Someone's voting record is not a matter of debate. It is a matter of public record. The records are incomplete, and do not compare in firmness to an outing or a late game vote count, but are about the only thing we got besides voting off of perceived behavioral shifts and odd argumentation (which MC is certainly open to as well, given his posts are mostly pointless fluff).

Sure, those count for something too, but they are wholly unreliable and completely subjective. Need I explain further than to point out that Jerman and Citizen were voted on the basis of their "strange behavior"? If we continue to lynch on just hunches and don't start looking for more concrete evidence, we are going to lynch the village to death (assuming the wolves don't hunt themselves first).





When did all the below people die? And he did say he found Citizen goodieish so that proves your claim wrong.
Very well, let me make the following correction:
"Every claim he has made so far has either been proven wrong or is still up in the air"

Mind you, his "read" on Citizen was a total equivocation. Blaming him for that though would be hypocritical of me though





Later edit: went through and removed things that made sense to 04:00 me, but not to 10:00 me.
 
Last edited:

JCan

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Claude and Ramius are setting off my wolfdar big time.

Ramius already has votes. That 18:59 vote on Citizen swings my vote towards Claude.

Vote Claude LC
 

ramius3443

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Claude and Ramius are setting off my wolfdar big time.

Ramius already has votes. That 18:59 vote on Citizen swings my vote towards Claude.

Vote Claude LC
And you think MC's behavior should go unexamined? Him voting mainly goodies and posting empty (and often wrong) cases disguised in rp mumbo jumbo doesn't strike you as odd at all? Think of me what you will, though I assure you I am but a humble villager.

I won't speak for Claude's last second vote, thats for him to defend.
 
Last edited:

JCan

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And you think MC's behavior should go unexamined? Him voting mainly goodies and posting empty (and often wrong) cases disguised in rp mumbo jumbo doesn't strike you as odd at all? Think of me what you will, though I assure you I am but a humble villager. As far as I can tell (correct me If i'm wrong), my only sins are lax activity and pushing a case that does have a hole or two, but whose positives in my earnest opinion outweigh the negatives. One is indicative of nothing, the other shouldn't be a sin.

I won't speak for Claude's last second vote, thats for him to defend.
MC's cases could well be a cover for something. I'm just currently getting more of a wolfdar reading from Claude and yourself.
 

Hazbot

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I'd like to remind people that vote count analysis is a notoriously tricky part of Werewolf and while it is a very powerful tool for catching wolves, it's not completely flawless.

In a game where we've lynched only one baddie so far, I'm not sure we should be bringing out vote analysis at all, the true difference between people who voted all goodies and people who didn't is that we don't fully know whom the latter voted for. That a goodie voted only goodies up to this point in the game is not statistically unlikely, and that a case based on that will be fairly weak.
 

esemesas

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Citizen, even in death you manage to possess all the finesse and grace of a whale attempting a pirouette.

Poetry.

Vote ese

He's always running up villagers.

Mate, everyone's running up villagers, we only have two dead baddies, one of which was outed and the other hunted without any significant votes on/by him.
 

Rovsea

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esemesas

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I'm concerned with how Spockyt escaped the noose in the last minutes again. But also, notice how hard it was to build up pressure on EUROO? He got three votes and then would not budge any more. This could just be coincidental or people respecting EUROO a little too much, but it could also mean he is a wolf and his packmates put pressure on other candidates. Jacksonian making a tie seems pretty standart, but then Rovsea added Spocky to that tie and Cliges put him in the lead even, which prompted quite a lot of late vote switching that enabled EUROO to slip by.

Vote EUROO
 

Cliges

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Poetry.



Mate, everyone's running up villagers, we only have two dead baddies, one of which was outed and the other hunted without any significant votes on/by him.

But you always seem in the thick of it.

Your vote tends to fall on the lynchee.
 

Claude LC

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What on Earth are you talking about? How was Rovs a transition to Marshall? THat makes absolutely no sense. He was voting Rovs pre outing. And Rovs's an unknown. And he was far from the only Jerman voter; plenty of people voted Jerman (albeit the next day). And Rovs was a major candidate pre outing.

I think I didn't express myself correctly, what I meant was that he voted Jerman, then he voted Rovsea and finally Marshall. That was what I meant. That he voted Rovsea before voting Marshall, and that his first vote was Jerman. That's all.

Claude and Ramius are setting off my wolfdar big time.

Ramius already has votes. That 18:59 vote on Citizen swings my vote towards Claude.

Vote Claude LC

Busy day, couldn't post earlier. Up to you to believe me.
 

Cliges

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MC's cases could well be a cover for something. I'm just currently getting more of a wolfdar reading from Claude and yourself.

I don't see that. He already said he was going to be Aquinas.
 

madchemist

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I'd also like to dispute the, "Many good suggestion for people who ought to have been lynched" since there was only one person calling for my head yesterday. Said persons' case, despite disguising their rhetoric in meaningless RP dribble, has so little substance as to suggest the name was picked at random for lack of any actual leads.

This may actually be truer than I'd normally be inclined to admit. I have a rather larger list of good candidate lynches than I'd like to at this stage in the game, because so many of the players have been zombieing their way through things as opposed to making any real effort to search for wolves.

That said, I have gone out on a limb and named a substantial number of people I consider to be unlikely wolves. But I can't attempt to read what isn't there. So if you don't want me to lynch you, you'd better work on providing evidence that you're a goodie and that you're interested in trying to figure out the game. Right now, it seems the best you can do is complain that you're being voted and leap to the conclusion that the only reason for that is that I'm a wolf. That is a gross error.

In fact, upon further review, a curious trend emerges: said person has voted for a goodie EVERY SINGLE DAY (said person was voting Jerman before switching to Rosvea minutes before Marshal was outed on day 2). Contrast this to the voting record of your's trully, who has voted for a known goodie only once. And let no man say Citizen did anything to assure us of his innocence. Consider the possibility, raised by Esemas on day 2, that said person is instead using the RP rhetoric to conceal the fact his cases are meaningless (see his day 2 vote for Jerman on the basis of his Trumpness), and that 2/3rds of what he types is just dribble. The remainder has been, unsuprisingly, convincing to precisely no one before Euro just hours ago.

I see. So rather than try to work out the wolves yourself, your sole effort is to discredit my thought process and my words. The cases are there. They're weak at this point because we have exceptionally little info to work with, since only 2 baddies are dead. But look at what's there. Do you agree that, say, Health has done so little that he could easily be a wolf? Do you agree with me that Spockyt is an unlikely wolf because a wolf wouldn't express such silly paranoia about an outing as he did? I have a whole list of reads. Which of them are unsound? And if so, why?

This is how cases are built up - by testing each others' thought processes and conclusions, by having logical arguments about them. I'm indulging in some amusing RP to mock-justify my votes, but there are real thoughts behind the votes which you can reply to. If you choose not to and disdain them instead, you're a wolf or playing directly into their hands. Satisfy me that my arguments are wrong, or point to the ones you agree with and try to convince me that those cases are more likely to hit a wolf. Crying "he's voted a bunch of villagers and now he's voting me" is only going to convince me that I'm right and that you're trying to hide.
 

ramius3443

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Blatant revenge vote. o_O

Vote Ramius
You didnt read too much of my post above it, did you?

Though yeah, I will happily admit i wouldnt be looking at Mc if not for the vote:oops:
 

madchemist

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Man, I really like your posts, they're very.... organised. But I don't know if I can trust them more. Because with two of your posts and two of your votes, two good villagers were lynched. Jeray in day 1 and Jerman in day 3. In Jerays case you were the vote number 3 of the 4 votes against him. And in Jermans case you were the vote 3 of the 5 votes issued against Jerman.
With Jeray the reasons were little to non existent, but it was day 1 so it's "understandable".
For Jerman I think you followed your gut.

Fascinating. So you believe I followed my gut on Jerman, but follow that up by claiming to believe I'm a wolf. Wouldn't those two things be in conflict? If I'm a wolf all I care about is not lynching my packmates. Why would a wolf worry about following his gut? Or do you know I'm not a wolf and you accidentally revealed yourself here?
 

EUROO7

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I'm concerned with how Spockyt escaped the noose in the last minutes again. But also, notice how hard it was to build up pressure on EUROO? He got three votes and then would not budge any more. This could just be coincidental or people respecting EUROO a little too much, but it could also mean he is a wolf and his packmates put pressure on other candidates. Jacksonian making a tie seems pretty standart, but then Rovsea added Spocky to that tie and Cliges put him in the lead even, which prompted quite a lot of late vote switching that enabled EUROO to slip by.

Vote EUROO
Tell us more about how my packmates stopped villagers from voting for me.

Place your vote on a real candidate and end this vendetta you seem to have against me.
 

madchemist

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  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
You didnt read too much of my post above it, did you?

Though yeah, I will happily admit i wouldnt be looking at Mc if not for the vote:oops:

So are you going to look at someone else? It would behoove you to do so, and you've clearly been online to read what I just said.

Failure to do so will be regarded as confirmation of wolfishness on your part.