We’re Putting the Band Back Together (possible on historical???)

[UnwaryHarry]

Hello.

Have very much tried searching for this but there is nothing conclusive as far as I can find. I wanna do the achievement:
We’re Putting the Band Back Together (As Turkey, be in a faction with Germany and Austria-Hungary.)
With historical focuses turned ON.

Why? Frankly it seems like a good challenge. Also there is something unsatisfying about switching over to non-historical focuses just for one achievement. Is this achievement on historical mode even possible though?

The crux, as I understand it, is to get Austria-Hungary to form. As Turkey you have a focus called "Press the Austro-Hungarian Claim" (see bottom of post). This gives Hungary, Austria and Czechoslovakia the following: idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment days = 1095. Given the name I would more or less assume this idea is a copy of what happens when (Imperial) Germany's Rekindle Imperial Sentiment Focus finishes. Somehow it helps in forming Austria Hungary. That is what you would assume at least. One thing I want to ask about is this very thing though. Basically I don't see how idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment days = 1095 fits into the picture when it comes to forming Austria-Hungary. If anyone can explain I'd be very grateful.

If you dig a bit further and check the formable_nations_decisions file you find quite detailed instructions about forming Austria-Hungary (see below). Like certain nations having states and stuff but nothing about idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment as far as I can see or having non-aligned support. Anyway despite these irregularities I still presume this is the instructions for the forming of Austria-Hungary(?) and not some old file or something. If so I also wonder about the very last thing:
ai_will_do = {
factor = 200
modifier = {
factor = 0
is_historical_focus_on = yes

I don't quite get this. Does it by any chance translate to AI is extremely likely to do this but with historical focuses the AI won't do this? If not that then what?

Regards.
/ Harry


C:\SteamLibrary\steamapps\common\Hearts of Iron IV\common\national_focus (file name: turkey)
focus = {
id = TUR_press_the_austro_hungarian_claim
icon = GFX_focus_proclaim_the_restauration_of_Austria_Hungary
available = {
NOT = {
HUN = { has_completed_focus = HUN_proclaim_the_restoration_of_austria_hungary }
}
}
mutually_exclusive = { focus = TUR_join_the_central_powers }
prerequisite = { focus = TUR_reclaim_macedonia }
x = 1
y = 1
relative_position_id = TUR_reclaim_macedonia
cost = 10
ai_will_do = {
base = 10
}

search_filters = { FOCUS_FILTER_ANNEXATION }
completion_reward = {
add_state_claim = 106
add_state_claim = 105
add_state_claim = 108
add_state_claim = 107
add_state_core = 104
create_wargoal = {
type = take_state_focus
target = YUG
}
add_state_claim = 46
add_state_claim = 79
add_state_claim = 77
create_wargoal = {
type = take_state_focus
target = ROM
}
if = {
limit = {
AUS = { exists = yes }
}
AUS = {
add_timed_idea = { idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment days = 1095 }
}
}
if = {
limit = {
HUN = { exists = yes }
}
HUN = {
add_timed_idea = { idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment days = 1095 }
}
}
if = {
limit = {
CZE = { exists = yes }
}
CZE = {
add_timed_idea = { idea = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment days = 1095 }
}
}
custom_effect_tooltip = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment_tt
set_rule = { can_create_factions = yes }
}
}

D:\SteamLibrary\steamapps\common\Hearts of Iron IV\common\decisions (file name: formable_nation_decisions)
form_austria_hungary_category = {

form_austria_hungary = {

icon = generic_form_nation

allowed = {
OR = {
original_tag = AUS
original_tag = CZE
original_tag = CRO
}
has_dlc = "Waking the Tiger"
}

available = {
is_subject = no
controls_state = 102
controls_state = 103
controls_state = 104
controls_state = 109
controls_state = 45
controls_state = 83
controls_state = 76
controls_state = 84
controls_state = 764
controls_state = 82
# Austria
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = form_country_austria_required_states_tt
controls_state = 153
controls_state = 152
controls_state = 4
}
# Czechoslovakia
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = form_country_czechoslovakia_required_states_tt
controls_state = 69
controls_state = 9
controls_state = 75
controls_state = 74
controls_state = 72
controls_state = 70
controls_state = 664
controls_state = 71
controls_state = 73
}
# Hungary
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = form_country_hungary_required_states_tt
controls_state = 155
controls_state = 43
controls_state = 154
}
}

visible = {
OR = {
original_tag = AUS
original_tag = CZE
original_tag = CRO
}
NOT = { has_global_flag = form_austria_hungary_flag }
}

complete_effect = {
set_cosmetic_tag = HUN_EMPIRE
if = {
limit = {
NOT = { tag = AUS }
}
AUS = { set_cosmetic_tag = AUS_NOT_WHITE }
}
102 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
103 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
104 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
109 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
45 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
83 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
76 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
84 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
39 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
163 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
736 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
764 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
82 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
# Austria
custom_effect_tooltip = form_country_austria_coring_states_tt
hidden_effect = {
153 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
152 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
4 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
}
# Czechoslovakia
custom_effect_tooltip = form_country_czechoslovakia_coring_states_tt
hidden_effect = {
69 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
9 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
75 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
74 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
72 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
70 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
664 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
71 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
73 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
}
# Hungary
custom_effect_tooltip = form_country_hungary_coring_states_tt
hidden_effect = {
155 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
43 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
154 = { add_core_of = ROOT }
}
hidden_effect = {
news_event = { id = wtt_news.56 hours = 6 }
set_global_flag = form_austria_hungary_flag
}
}

ai_will_do = {
factor = 200
modifier = {
factor = 0
is_historical_focus_on = yes
}
}
}

 

[jacekgk]

I think, that's impossible to get this achievement on historical by this way. Before You get "Press the Austro-Hungarian Claim" Austria will be eaten by German Reich via Anschluss. Maybe some combo with spies and some wars, but it still can be problematic, because non-align Hungary does not count as Austria Hungary.
But it is nice idea, I will check this

 

[Dryhad]

It can't be done on historical, but maybe not for the reason you think. I mean, yes, Germany will have absorbed Austria and Czechoslovakia long before you get to this point in the focus tree which is a problem, but not necessarily a fatal one. The fatal flaw is that the national spirit you've noticed doesn't actually do what it's supposed to. It's piggy-backing off the similar focus in the German tree, but the decision associated with it specifically requires the German focus. So, the intention is that Austria, Hungary, and Czechoslovakia will drift to Non-Aligned until they decide to form Austria-Hungary, but they are not able to form Austria-Hungary because nobody bothered to change the check on the German focus to account for the fact that this national spirit is now also added by a Turkish focus.

There are other ways to form Austria-Hungary but the AI will never take them on historical so there is no way to get this achievement on historical mode.

 

[eastcoastceojam]

I agree with the others who've posted here that this achievement doesn't seem possible with historical focuses enabled.

However, you can get this achievement if you set every nation to historical, except for Hungary. Then, if you're willing to save scum like you've never save scummed before, you can eventually get everything to fall into place to grab this achievement. I did just that in the below post. I wouldn't call the experience "fun", but it did net me the achievement.

Turkey's "Putting the Band Back Together" achievement is a painful slog

I finally was able to get the "We're Putting the Band Back Together" achievement, and what a painful and frustrating slog it was. The requirements are simple enough- play as Turkey, and be in a faction with Germany and Austria-Hungary. But...

forum.paradoxplaza.com

 

[UnwaryHarry]

Hi and thanks for the replies.

@ Jacekgk. Yes Germany gobbling up everything on historical is an issue. The really challenging part would be to try to beat them. Surely if you force Germany to free AUS/CZE the reformed nations will still be able to do Austria-Hungary stuff.
Anyway. I would probably try making sure the Germans don't cap France, knock out Italy and then knock out Germany. Hard but possible me thinks. If it's even a thing you probably wouldn't do the Austro-Hungarian claims focus until after beating the Axis and freeing the needed territory though.That sucks a bit gameplay-wise guess.

@ Dryhad Is that in any of the stuff i linked or are you drawing this conclusion based of some sort of additional file I've missed and not posted in the thread.

@eastcoatceojam Wow. I did not know you could turn off historical for certain nations. Cool. Guess that's very, very close to an actual historical game. May actually try this.

Wouldn't another idea (?) be to make Turkey big and in control of the HUN/AUS/CZE territories, start the Press the Austro-Hungarian Claims focus and the release yourself as Hungary just to do the decision to form HUN_EMP (a.k.a. Austria Hungary). To try and sideline the ai basically. Or is this flawed?

Regards.
/ Harry

 

[Goodfontana]

I'm sorry to say this achievement is not possible on historical. Not just because Germany will Anschluss Austria or anything like that, but because of the simple fact that the moment Hungary goes for the focus "Economic Intervention" instead of "Balanced Budget" it's all over. There's no way to make the AI form a country with the tag of AH from that point forward. The focus of pressing the Austro-Hungarian claims doesn't do anything because it is lazy coded, meaning they just copied the national spirit Germany gives them when they do that via the Kaiser route without noticing that for it to work it has to be Germany who does it.

I did extensive testing of this achievement back in the day when it was released, here's a link to the post I made: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...er-the-story-of-sh-tshow-achievement.1437601/

In my opinion, the most "efficient" (if such a word is possible to use here) way of getting this achievement is to play non-historical, and keep restarting until you see Hungary goes for "Balanced Budget" as their first focus. Then you want to rush the fascist route for Turkey, make sure you have 30 divisions in the field (mostly fodder) and make sure 8 are decent divisions, but not too big. 7/2 are a good bet, while making sure you produce CAS.

The idea being you want to get to the focus for volunteers in the Spanish War since it will give you the option to increase the max number of volunteers you can send. You will use this to send as many volunteers you can to Hungary when they, inevitably, declare war on Austria (in over 200 test runs, Austria didn't peacefully accept the referendum once, and Hungary always lost the war against them and then got Anschlussed). Make sure Hungary wins that war. Beware you will have massive supply issues, which is why you don't want to send heavy divisions. CAS will make the difference here.

After this, there are 2 things that can happen: the one that will make this easy is that AH will join the Axis. If they do that, inmediately ask Germany to join Axis (which they will accept, since you became fascist yourself) and you will get achievement unlocked.

In case this doesn't happen, I strongly advice to keep rushing down to the Mediterranean Entente to get Italy in your faction and use them as a jumping point to invade AH (assuming nobody comes to their aid), and puppet them (even if you puppet them in only 1 region is enough). After this, kick everyone from your faction, dismantle it, and join Axis.

If Germany went for either Kaiser or Democratic, you will need to defeat and puppet them too. You won't need to dismantle your faction though. However at this point you'll have to deal with whatever reality non-historical madness throws at you such as the Soviet Union rushing you (as it happened to me).

It is impossible to make a step by step guide on non-historical, but I hope these tips help you.

 

[Dryhad]

@ Dryhad Is that in any of the stuff i linked or are you drawing this conclusion based of some sort of additional file I've missed and not posted in the thread.

I alluded briefly to the formation decision you posted to acknowledge that the AI will never take this decision if historical mode is on, but most of what I said refers to a decision in the file GER.txt called GER_reform_austro_hungarian_empire. This decision is activated by a focus in the German tree, and while the Turkish tree is attempting to use the same route, only the German tree will activate it.

 

[UnwaryHarry]

Hi.

@ Dryhad Is that in any of the stuff i linked or are you drawing this conclusion based of some sort of additional file I've missed and not posted in the thread.

I alluded briefly to the formation decision you posted to acknowledge that the AI will never take this decision if historical mode is on, but most of what I said refers to a decision in the file GER.txt called GER_reform_austro_hungarian_empire. This decision is activated by a focus in the German tree, and while the Turkish tree is attempting to use the same route, only the German tree will activate it.

Ok. Thanks for clarifying that. Let me post that as well so we have everything in the thread for convenience.
D:\SteamLibrary\steamapps\common\Hearts of Iron IV\common\decisions (file name: GER)

GER_austro_hungarian_empire = {

GER_reform_austro_hungarian_empire = {

allowed = {
OR = {
original_tag = AUS
original_tag = HUN
original_tag = CZE
}
}

available = {
AUS = {
OR = {
has_government = neutrality
neutrality > 0.4
}
}
HUN = {
OR = {
has_government = neutrality
neutrality > 0.4
}
}
CZE = {
OR = {
has_government = neutrality
neutrality > 0.4
}
}
}

visible = {
GER = {
has_completed_focus = GER_rekindle_imperial_sentiment
has_government = neutrality
}
AUS = {
exists = yes
}
HUN = {
exists = yes
}
CZE = {
exists = yes
}
NOT = { has_global_flag = GER_reformed_austro_hungarian_empire }
}

cost = 0
fire_only_once = yes

ai_will_do = {
factor = 200
modifier = {
factor = 0
tag = HUN
}
modifier = {
factor = 0
tag = CZE
}
}

complete_effect = {
custom_effect_tooltip = GER_reform_austro_hungarian_empire_tt
hidden_effect = { set_global_flag = GER_reformed_austro_hungarian_empire }
if = {
limit = {
tag = AUS
}
HUN = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 1 } }
CZE = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 3 } }
}
if = {
limit = {
tag = HUN
}
AUS = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 1 } }
CZE = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 3 } }
}
if = {
limit = {
tag = CZE
}
HUN = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 1 } }
AUS = { country_event = { id = wtt_germany.68 hours = 3 } }
}
}
}
}

 

[UnwaryHarry]

Hi.

So.

- Turkey, through what looks like oversight, lacks something to actually trigger the formation of Austria-Hungary. Can support (non-aligned)German decision by raising non-aligned in various countries though. Yay...
- German decision. No good because Germany needs to go non-aligned to get decision and they don't on historical. Setting them to go for non-aligned in settings makes you unable to get achievements.
- Hungary Focus (either "Demand a Referendum" or "Take Austria By Force"). Here it is somehow possible to turn off historical for specifically Hungary and still get achievements. They need to get Balanced Budget (which they don't pick on historical) and then most likely Take Austria By Force as Referendum rarely works as I understood it. Then for them to actually conquer Austria you need to help ai Hungary a lot. Doable though.

All in all. No known way to do We're Putting the Band Back Together on historical (even if Hungary thing comes close).

Two more questions: What about the Austria-Hungary section in the formable_nation_decisions file from earlier? Is it not gonna work because even if you release into those nations you lack original_tag AUS/CZE/CRO (+ that it looks like ai is set not to do it on its own) or what is the problem there?
Is there some really easy fix you could suggest to Paradox? Like totally ideally a few lines of code somewhere and nothing more complicated. To get the achievement doable on historical I mean.

Regards.
/ Harry

 

[Dryhad]

- Hungary Focus (either "Demand a Referendum" or "Take Austria By Force"). Here it is somehow possible to turn off historical for specifically Hungary and still get achievements. They need to get Balanced Budget (which they don't pick on historical) and then most likely Take Austria By Force as Referendum rarely works as I understood it. Then for them to actually conquer Austria you need to help ai Hungary a lot. Doable though.

The referendum is more likely to work than not, although the Hungarian AI has some weird priorities around taking the wargoal if it fails. Regardless, so long as the AI goes down the Habsburg Prince route, even if it messes up actually acquiring Austria, you can simply ally Hungary and feed it Austria in a peace deal even if Austria has already been Anchlussed. The AI will then be able to form Austria-Hungary by focus.

Two more questions: What about the Austria-Hungary section in the formable_nation_decisions file from earlier? Is it not gonna work because even if you release into those nations you lack original_tag AUS/CZE/CRO (+ that it looks like ai is set not to do it on its own) or what is the problem there?

The only problem with this (other than it being incredibly fiddly and dependent on a non-puppet AI Croatia or whoever) is the AI will not form a formable nation with historical mode turned on. So long as that option isn't checked, though, you can feed the required states to one of these tags and have them form Austria-Hungary this way as an alternative.

Is there some really easy fix you could suggest to Paradox? Like totally ideally a few lines of code somewhere and nothing more complicated. To get the achievement doable on historical I mean.

Yes, rescript Press the Austro-Hungarian claim so that it has its own means of forming Austria-Hungary, ideally one that takes into account the high likelihood that neither Austria nor Czechoslovakia will exist by the time Turkey gets to this point in its tree. In general, rely less on pre-existing or generic events and decisions for Turkey, as there are many points in the tree where such usage has resulted in sometimes awkward interactions which could have been avoided with tailor-made equivalents.

 

[UnwaryHarry]

Hello.

What about the Austria-Hungary section in the formable_nation_decisions file from earlier? Is it not gonna work because even if you release into those nations you lack original_tag AUS/CZE/CRO (+ that it looks like ai is set not to do it on its own) or what is the problem there?

I actually tested this now (historical focuses on but obviously not Ironman) and it seemed to work. I took over Austria as Turkey released myself as Austria, took over YUG/ROM/CZE/HUN and yea decision to form Austria Hungary was there. If it's supposed to be there idk. Maybe the game got confused somehow with all the instant capitulations, lots of loading in and out different nations to delete troops and stuff. Anyway the implication if this really does work is that trying to get the achievement on historical mode could well be possible.

I'll do a retest myself late this evening (maybe with czechs). If you wanna test I recommend spiking world tension via loading into Germany early and justifying on USA, instant_wargoal cheat and occupationpaint AUS (and later others)
P.S. I also started the Turkish focus "Press the Austro-Hungarian Claim" before switching over for the microscopic chance it would make some kind of difference if it completed but it wasn't even complete when I formed AH. Turkey were Ottoman. Guess that really shouldn't make any difference either though.

 

[Dryhad]

Hello.



I actually tested this now (historical focuses on but obviously not Ironman) and it seemed to work. I took over Austria as Turkey released myself as Austria, took over YUG/ROM/CZE/HUN and yea decision to form Austria Hungary was there. If it's supposed to be there idk. Maybe the game got confused somehow with all the instant capitulations, lots of loading in and out different nations to delete troops and stuff. Anyway the implication if this really does work is that trying to get the achievement on historical mode could well be possible.

I'll do a retest myself late this evening (maybe with czechs). If you wanna test I recommend spiking world tension via loading into Germany early and justifying on USA, instant_wargoal cheat and occupationpaint AUS (and later others)
P.S. I also started the Turkish focus "Press the Austro-Hungarian Claim" before switching over for the microscopic chance it would make some kind of difference if it completed but it wasn't even complete when I formed AH. Turkey were Ottoman. Guess that really shouldn't make any difference either though.

Yes, the decision exists. I didn't say it didn't exist. What I said, repeatedly, is that the AI will not take it. So long as historical mode is turned on, the AI will not take any of the generic formable nation decisions (this does not apply to, for instance, GER_reform_austro_hungarian_empire which we discussed earlier, but it does apply to forming Austria-Hungary by conquest). It is right there at the end of your first post:

        ai_will_do = {
            factor = 200
            modifier = {
                factor = 0
                is_historical_focus_on = yes
            }
        }

The decision is still there. There is never anything stopping a human player from taking the decision. What is stopping it from being taken is that the AI simply choses not to, because it has been scripted not to.