Weird, I got king title I shouldn't have

[Olaus Petrus]

I started as Prince of Alania and created Kingdom of Khazaria. Then I created Rus, Finland and Lithuania. But I got title for Persia out of nowhere. I have no idea when my kings got the title, because I don't remember message that I have inherited such title. I'm 100% certain that I haven't created it, because my kingdom only has one Persian province and Seljuks rule most of Persia.

I don't know at which point I got the title, but it's in all of my saves. I don't know from where I have got it, but it shouldn't even be in the game yet because it's creatable and AFAIK no one has created it, because no Christian hasn't controlled enough Persia to do that. Any suggestions of what has happened?

 

[unmerged(75409)]

Maybe you inherited it? The Seljuks might have created it and then lost it to you somehow...

 

[Olaus Petrus]

Maybe you inherited it? The Seljuks might have created it and then lost it to you somehow...

I thought that, I just don't know from whom I could have inherited it. My ruling family's members are all in my own realm, so only other option is Bagratuni family. But they were wiped out by the Muslims and not the other way around.

 

[unmerged(75409)]

Well you could have inherited it from a Seljuk. The family tends to spam sons by the dozen, and when they come under pressure the lands of firstborn sons are often overrun by the Byzantines or by you. Did you or the AI force-vassalize any Turkish beys? You do hold a lot of previously Muslim land. Did you perhaps marry into their families once they converted?

 

[Olaus Petrus]

Well you could have inherited it from a Seljuk. The family tends to spam sons by the dozen, and when they come under pressure the lands of firstborn sons are often overrun by the Byzantines or by you. Did you or the AI force-vassalize any Turkish beys? You do hold a lot of previously Muslim land. Did you perhaps marry into their families once they converted?

I'm not related to Seljuks.

Successor of the first Prince of Alania was his firstborn son (who don't have mother). He married Mariam Bagratuni of Georgia.* Their son created Kingdom of Khazaria (and he is first to have kingdom of Persia title, although I don't still know where it came from). Current king is descendant of him and Piast princess, while younger princes are descendants of him and Árpád princess. Current king is married with Yngling princess and current heir is married to the daughter of the Duke of Bavaria. Cadet branches of my house are mostly married to major Byzantine, Bohemian and German families, like Komnenos, Přemyslid and Staden etc.

I have house rule that I marry my male family members only to daughters, sisters, granddaughters and mothers of the ruling kings and dukes.

*Exiled members of Bagratuni family seem to be courtiers in the Byzantine Empire.

Only Muslim vassals I have were those I vassalized when I conquered the Bolgars and Transoxania, but they later converted.

 

[unmerged(75409)]

Hm. Well maybe it is a fluke... a glitch in the matrix... maybe a messanger from your own future (from 1312 game-time?) travelled back through time to your savegame from 1080 and gave you the crown.

 

[Heinus Horatius]

Maybe someone gave you the title. I once started out as the count of daupine and then suddenly became duke of provence. It turned out that the duke of dauphine (my friend) had captured the title of provence, and he gave it to me. Maybe something like that happenend.

 

[Puritan]

Maybe someone gave you the title. I once started out as the count of daupine and then suddenly became duke of provence. It turned out that the duke of dauphine (my friend) had captured the title of provence, and he gave it to me. Maybe something like that happenend.

Wow, really? A friend indeed...

Occasionally a muslim title, like the "King of Egypt" will fall to christians because of force vassilization (vassal son converts to christianity, father dies and passes titles onto son, someone usurps and takes the title...).

But if he inherited it, there should be a popup with 'we have inherited X of Y', unless he's disabled popups.

Maybe it's some kind of bug tied to the Khazaria title?

 

[Nick B II]

This title could not have been granted to Olaus by anyone else. You can only receive titles from your liege, and Kings of Khazaria don't have lieges.

Inheritance is a strong possibility. That wouldn't be impossible to trace if Olaus has saves from from about every ten years. Go to the title section, find PERS, look at the starting date; go to the save before that date, repeat, etc. I can usually account for every holder of a title that way if I'm in a really anal mood. And I haven't let 20 years go by without a manual save.

It would be pretty weird for PERS to be created, and pass through a cadet branch of the Bagriotinis to Khazaria without a player noticing. But it is definitely possible.

My last working theory is that Olaus has one of two weird-ass mods in his files. First LITH could be "Lithuania, Persia" in world_names.csv. Second the province.csv file could only have one province attached to PERS.

Nick

 

[Olaus Petrus]

This title could not have been granted to Olaus by anyone else. You can only receive titles from your liege, and Kings of Khazaria don't have lieges.

Inheritance is a strong possibility. That wouldn't be impossible to trace if Olaus has saves from from about every ten years. Go to the title section, find PERS, look at the starting date; go to the save before that date, repeat, etc. I can usually account for every holder of a title that way if I'm in a really anal mood. And I haven't let 20 years go by without a manual save.

It would be pretty weird for PERS to be created, and pass through a cadet branch of the Bagriotinis to Khazaria without a player noticing. But it is definitely possible.

My last working theory is that Olaus has one of two weird-ass mods in his files. First LITH could be "Lithuania, Persia" in world_names.csv. Second the province.csv file could only have one province attached to PERS.

Nick

Close examination of my oldest save does show that I got title in 1108, which was 8 years after I created Khazaria (which uses BOLG tag) and year after I created Rus. I might have missed the inheritance, because Russian vassals involved me to Lithuanian affairs and I had to save them from the Pagans. But I still don't know where I got it.

In any case to problem solved itself and now I have earned the title. Seljuks started a war against my vassal, so I took the liberty of release them from the burden of their Persian possessions and at the same go I liberated Constantinople. I was nice and allowed them to keep Mesopotamia.

I hope that Mongols will be strong, because I need challenge. So far game has been amusing, but I have tendency to become unstoppable during the first hundred years, which could mean boring later game. Or maybe I will switch to gavelkind succession laws.

(I don't use mods, before DV I used to play Pagan mod now and then. But I heard that it doesn't work well with the DV.)

 

[Nick B II]

It must have been inherited in 1108. The problem is figuring out who it was inherited from...

Do you have any save-files from back when you were Alania you could check?

I can see two other alternatives. First you could check you see whether you inherited any other titles when you inherited PERS.

Second you could search for relatives of Mariam Bagrutani who died in 1108. Especially the ones with both prestige and piety.

Nick