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Finally! I've spent the last 4 hours reworking the weapons overview file from scratch. I imported all weapons data from the latest BT build into the file (well, thanks to my AWESOME nonexistent excel skills, this required some hand editing)
I scrapped the loadout calculator from my last version, as it was still beta back then. We now have a mechlab.
File is still ugly as hell, but given the amount of information included, I couldn't really figure out a way to make it better.

What this file does:
-Give basic info about every given weapon in BT (range, dmg, heat, heat dmg, stab dmg, crit chance, recoil, accuracy modifier, ...)
-Calculate ammo tonnage needed and - more importantly - HS or DHS needed under various biomes
-Calculate effective tonnage and dmg per ton for every weapon
-Compare Weapons via some kinda "Weapon Index". This is a rather complex one, I had to decide how to deal with range, stab dmg and heat dmg.
I decided to use the squareroot of the range window (because twice the range is not as useful as twice the dmg IMO), full heat dmg (because well, it really does only concern flamers) and 50% of stab dmg. Stab damage is useful, but not in every situation, so I felt I had to adjust.
The Weapon Index exists in 2 variants, one considering range, one not considering it. It compares every weapon to the medium laser as the most basic weapon I could think of. So the ML is set to a value of 1, bigger is better.
For all these calculations I needed a given amount of ammo. In my experience 12 salvos is about all you need for even longer contracts, so I used this, even if it meant using partial tons. Because nobody who hasn't lost his mind would mount a single MG, AC2 or SRM2 on a Mech. Maybe an LRM5, but I wanted to look at the "ideal" situation for each weapon. This also led to the flamer needing 2 tons of ammo (so, 2 additional flamers), which is kinda odd, but well, flamers are hard to compare afterall, who cares?

I didn't consider accuracy bonus, recoil, clustering, indirect fire capability, ppc debuff (too hard :D )

Why the hell did I do all that and spend my morning with excel?
I like modding BT, especially weapon balancing, which I feel is a bit off in vanilla. So I primarily did this for myself, because all the basic values (rows 7-27) can be changed and calculations will consider these changes. So this is my personal balancing tool.

This is also the reason why I won't spend much time on making it look good or be super user-friendly, but I think it's easy enough to work with, so here it is!


Edit: Oops, forgot something. Added version of weapon index that does not consider heat- or stabdmg.




Older post/edits behind spoiler tag for readability.

Edit: Thinking about it, I added detailed range/heat calculations. Couldn't explain to myself why I consider AC10s shortrange vs LLs long with both having exactly the same range.
Edit 10.04.2018:

I added a new feature:
The loadout calculator can now differentiate between range brackets. Many designs are not meant for alphastriking, so I guessed you might like some easy way to calculate how efficient your loadouts are depending on range.
For now I decided to use two different range brackets: "Short range" and "medium to long range"
As for practical reasons I considered AC10s to be short range weapons although they can be fired at medium to, whereas LLs are considered long to medium range even without minimum range requirements.

Also fixed a rather serious bug in the loadout calculator which caused LRM20s not to be working correctly
Edit 3:

All dmg/heat/tonnage/stab data from pre-release included. Should be correct now. New prices not added, missed alot of them, didn't care too much actually.


Edit 2:
New version, littlebit cleaner layout.
Most important: There is a new feature to the loadout calculator!
You can now enter weapons and heatsinks to quickly calculate heat efficiency of your loadout. Yes, I know, you can do it other ways, but this is quick, comfortable and - unlike the rest of this ugly excel file - easy to understand. I even added basic explanations to it.


Problems remain the same as in last version, adds at least a single ton of ammo for every weapon (which is not really a problem for the heat calc), still missing data on flamer, MG and SRM4


Edit 1: Hid old one with spoiler tag.

I made a new version of this excel file. It's ugly as hell and most likely confusing, too. BUT:
-It contains all the data I got from the streams. Weapons without proper data are marked in red, unused ones from beta are grey.
-Contains overall tonnage for weapons including necessary HS and ammo (12+ salvos) for different biome types (120% and 65% HS efficiency, although in my math it's more like 66.67% because I was lazy and thought maybe HBS was, too)
-Reworked weapon index to compare all weapons to a ML at 100% HS efficiency
-Still having 2 different approaches to calculate usefulness (called weapon index) depending on weapons range: dmg/ton*(max range - min range) and dmg/ton*sqr(max range - min range). I believe the sqr-version to be better, but didn't want to scrap the other one.
-Scrapped the rounded HS numbers. We are all capable of deciding if we want to round up or down in certain cases.
-Added a loadout calculator (Wheeeeeeee!) Just enter the amount of weapons you want on your Mech into the yellow box, spits out overall weight, HS required, ammo required (12+ salvos), alpha dmg, dmg per ton and overall weapon index.

Known problems:
-Adds at least one ton of ammo for each weapon in calculator, so not good for calculating loadouts with multiple weapons sharing a single ton of ammo. There is a workaround, you can change the tons of ammo value in row 30 for that. But then it messes up calculations with single weapons of this type. I'll think of something to fix this, eventually.
-SRM4s heat is interpolated by SRM2 and 6.
-Layout plainly sucks. I'm not good at making things easy to understand, I suck at excel, and this is some complex file. I tried changing the layout, but then it messed up my calculations.


Edit: I updated the file with the data provided by Amechwarrior's post beta mod pack, should be correct now. Sorry for the inconvenience, I f****d up :D


So, months ago I found a nice excel sheet showing stats for all weapons - even unused ones - from beta v2 on the old forums. I don't remember who made it, if you know, please tell me. Whoever it was: Thanks for this awesome job! I used this as reference whenever I needed to look something up.

First of all: THIS IS TO 99% NOT MY WORK (can't say this loud enough) AND IT'S BETA DATA (will update when game releases)
But I made some changes to the "weapon base stats" page of the file:
-deleted data I found unnecessary for better viewability and added some color
-added "effective heat" considering 150% global heat modifier
-added "effective damage" for SRM and LRM launchers, because it was shown as 4 every time
-calculated heatsinks needed to stay absolutely heat neutral in normal environment (allowed for 0,5HS, because well... you mount more than 1 weapon, other half might be used/given by another one)
-calculated heatsinks needed to stay absolutely heat neutral arctic environment (or generate about 20% overheat under normal circumstances, which I consider to be a good way to design a mech.
-rounded last results because 2.083 HS e.g. is pretty much unpractical. Causes some results for smaller weapons to be the same as "neutral under normal circumstances" :(
-added "ammotons needed for 12 salvos" (that's what I normaly want for my designs, at least for skirmish in beta, we'll see about it in the final game)
-calculated overall weight (weapon + ammo + HS) for both normal and 120% HS efficiency
-calculated damage per ton for both situations

I wanted to take range into account, but didn't come up with an elegant solution.
So I added 2 variants:
1: dmg/ton*(maxrange - minrange)
2: dmg/ton*sqr(maxrange - minrange)
both for 100% and 120% HS efficiency again

Finally I tried to compare weapons, so I used the ML's values for dmg/ton and dmg/ton*sqr(max range - min range) as index. So anything bigger than 1 is better, anything lower is worse.

If someone else has more ideas what to do with this data: Give it to me! :D
[/spoiler ]
 

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Rabid

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Funny, I made my own spreadsheet using some similar metrics (heatsinks required to dissipate heat and then an adjusted mass figure taking the mass of extra heatsinks into account as well). I guess it's a fairly natural statistic to look at when the only limits you have are range, heat, and how many guns you can squeeze on your mech.

Your figures are definitely outdated (AC5s, AC10s and SRMs are all nerfed) based on the latest streams etc but obviously we don't know the real numbers for another 4-5 weeks...
 

44th MAC|Bonsai

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Ah yes, I noticed SRMs got nerved, but as I didn't know any of the other changes they made to it, I didn't have complete data (and also forgot to change dmg numbers...) Missed on the ACs though, can you tell me how exactly?


Played around a little on comparing weapons, using MLs as index (1) for dmg/ton and dmg/ton*sqr(maxrange-minrange). In both cases SRM6s were superior to every other weapon at hand (both 1.2), so I think the nerv is kinda ok for the SRM6, pushes it to 0.96. The SRM2 is rendered pretty much useless at 0.67 for a short range weapon. But it actually never was a good choice unless you have a SRM4 or 6 to share ammo with. (No, not another SRM2, a single SRM4 is a lot better)

Edit: Changing heat for SRM2/4/6 from 6/9/12 to something like 4/8/12 would actually solve this problem and make every launcher equally usefull.
 

Rabid

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Yeah I was thinking the same thing about SRMs and given that they have very high stability damage and are still both weight and heat efficient relative to other options they still certainly have a niche.

AC/5 damage got dropped to 45, AC/10 damage to 60. There may have also been changes to heat generation based on the most recent stream video (they showed an AC/5 generating 10 heat IIRC)
 

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Ooooh shit, totally missed that there was beta v1 data in there! Thanks! Ofc I knew these numbers, they were in v2. Sheet I was working with must have been older than I expected, didn't check all the numbers.

Edit: Actually at least the ACs are right in my "effective damage" numbers, just missed the numbers in the original files. So all the calculations based on this are correct.

Edit2: Oooops, nope. I was wrong about that
 
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Amechwarrior

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Ah yes, I noticed SRMs got nerved, but as I didn't know any of the other changes they made to it, I didn't have complete data (and also forgot to change dmg numbers...) Missed on the ACs though, can you tell me how exactly?


Played around a little on comparing weapons, using MLs as index (1) for dmg/ton and dmg/ton*sqr(maxrange-minrange). In both cases SRM6s were superior to every other weapon at hand (both 1.2), so I think the nerv is kinda ok for the SRM6, pushes it to 0.96. The SRM2 is rendered pretty much useless at 0.67 for a short range weapon. But it actually never was a good choice unless you have a SRM4 or 6 to share ammo with. (No, not another SRM2, a single SRM4 is a lot better)

Edit: Changing heat for SRM2/4/6 from 6/9/12 to something like 4/8/12 would actually solve this problem and make every launcher equally usefull.
Check my weapons files in the Post-Beta Mod Pack, So far the recent stream has had the same combat stats as the miner mission I used to adjust the values we could see. There a quite a number of weapons we haven't seen yet in detail, but what we do know is in there. I'm willing to bet combat stats have been locked down for a bit to allow simgame tuning we have seen so many comments about the devs adjusting in the past month. The other big change, is that LRMs are now 2 Stab/missile from 1.5, it really helps them normalize with the new 8Dmg/3Stab SRMs yet keeps both useful in their range brackets.
 

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Funny, I made my own spreadsheet using some similar metrics (heatsinks required to dissipate heat and then an adjusted mass figure taking the mass of extra heatsinks into account as well). I guess it's a fairly natural statistic to look at when the only limits you have are range, heat, and how many guns you can squeeze on your mech.

Your figures are definitely outdated (AC5s, AC10s and SRMs are all nerfed) based on the latest streams etc but obviously we don't know the real numbers for another 4-5 weeks...
Bite your tongue. The game is releasing on April 1, in 7 days. It says so right here:
release.jpg
:p:p:p:p:p
 

Amechwarrior

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I have your mod pack installed. It's great! And yes, I beginn to remember values have changed, must have changed them back awhile ago when I was overwriting /data because I broke something :D
If you have the .zip, just check the weapons folder inside it. Those are the ones we've seen and had stats change, keep in mind heat is base in weapons files and the combatgameconstants multiplies that by 1.5 for what you see in game. Some weapons like the PPC were shown in the miner vid, but received no changes we could see.
 

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I made a new version of this excel file. It's ugly as hell and most likely confusing, too. BUT:
-It contains all the data I got from the streams. Weapons without proper data are marked in red, unused ones from beta are grey.
-Contains overall tonnage for weapons including necessary HS and ammo (12+ salvos) for different biome types (120% and 65% HS efficiency, although in my math it's more like 66.67% because I was lazy and thought maybe HBS was, too)
-Reworked weapon index to compare all weapons to a ML at 100% HS efficiency
-Still having 2 different approaches to calculate usefulness (called weapon index) depending on weapons range: dmg/ton*(max range - min range) and dmg/ton*sqr(max range - min range). I believe the sqr-version to be better, but didn't want to scrap the other one.
-Scrapped the rounded HS numbers. We are all capable of deciding if we want to round up or down in certain cases.
-Added a loadout calculator (Wheeeeeeee!) Just enter the amount of weapons you want on your Mech into the yellow box, spits out overall weight, HS required, ammo required (12+ salvos), alpha dmg, dmg per ton and overall weapon index.

Known problems:
-Adds at least one ton of ammo for each weapon in calculator, so not good for calculating loadouts with multiple weapons sharing a single ton of ammo. There is a workaround, you can change the tons of ammo value in row 30 for that. But then it messes up calculations with single weapons of this type. I'll think of something to fix this, eventually.
-SRM4s heat is interpolated by SRM2 and 6.
-Layout plainly sucks. I'm not good at making things easy to understand, I suck at excel, and this is some complex file. I tried changing the layout, but then it messed up my calculations.
 

44th MAC|Bonsai

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New version, littlebit cleaner layout.
Most important: There is a new feature to the loadout calculator!
You can now enter weapons and heatsinks to quickly calculate heat efficiency of your loadout. Yes, I know, you can do it other ways, but this is quick, comfortable and - unlike the rest of this ugly excel file - easy to understand. I even added basic explanations to it.


Problems remain the same as in last version, adds at least a single ton of ammo for every weapon (which is not really a problem for the heat calc), still missing data on flamer, MG and SRM4
 

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Exel sheet with updates to skill levels with enhancements gained and XP required based on streams by Cohh and Bombadil... Thanks guys!
 

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44th MAC|Bonsai

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New version uploaded.

I added a new feature:
The loadout calculator can now differentiate between range brackets. Many designs are not meant for alphastriking, so I guessed you might like some easy way to calculate how efficient your loadouts are depending on range.
For now I decided to use two different range brackets: "Short range" and "medium to long range"
As for practical reasons I considered AC10s to be short range weapons although they can be fired at medium to, whereas LLs are considered long to medium range even without minimum range requirements.

Also fixed a rather serious bug in the loadout calculator which caused LRM20s not to be working correctly


Older post/edits behind spoiler tag for readability.