We need to bring back expansions... INSTANTLY

[Mauer]

Oh, this takes me back to the University Campus, where lonely guys would distribute hand-typed leaflets (yeah, one was an old guy with a typewriter, it actually happened three years back). These leaflets would usually be full of badly spelled propaganda in the same sense as the OP, sadly fighting reality and their own emotional problems more than any cause.

Thank you Paradox, for allowing me to relive those memories like few other forums would. I wish the OP a speedy recovery from whatever troubles him, except the game, hands off of reality!

Just out of curiosity, may I ask what kind of propaganda it was? or what it purported to be?

 

[jdrou]

I personally do have an issue with the model, because the end result is a complex game that is also changing all the time, so it seems you're constantly trying to catch up with the rules.

The ideal from the user PoV would probably be if patches were strictly bugfixing and the new free features causing major gameplay changes were released as free DLC that you could activate or not. Unfortunately some free features are just not suited for being turned on and off and it would probably create a nightmare for support (and maintaining the code) trying to handle all the possible variations. Also would likely make things even worse for modders since they would also not be able to count on everyone having the same features available even when they are on the same patch version.

 

[Blijert]

Just out of curiosity, may I ask what kind of propaganda it was? or what it purported to be?

Pfeww, something vaguely communist like fight against all government policies and against sexualized society I believe, basically all is wrong today. The coherence and grammar were so bad we thought it was joke until we actually saw the guy. If I ever find a copy again I will be sure to post it

 

[Gurluas]

My only issue is that developement is an expansion feature, when it is a pretty important and core feature.
Other than that, we've gotten pretty much the necessary new features through the patches.

 

[delpiero1234]

My only issue is that developement is an expansion feature, when it is a pretty important and core feature.
Other than that, we've gotten pretty much the necessary new features through the patches.

Not really.
Important features are always DLC locked like Support Independence, Development, National Focus, Moving Main Trade Port, etc.
It's an illusion to believe that the patches are free.

Prior to Common Sense you could build lots of buildings in provinces. Don't own Common Sense? Well too bad. Now you are very limited when it comes to buildings. Why? Because you cannot develop your provinces. since its DLC locked. This is removing a core feature, constructing buildings, from the game and make it pretty much DLC locked. No Common Sense DLC --> no development --> no building spaces --> can't build things.

 

[Quaade]

My only issue is that developement is an expansion feature, when it is a pretty important and core feature.
Other than that, we've gotten pretty much the necessary new features through the patches.

Not really.
Important features are always DLC locked like Support Independence, Development, National Focus, Moving Main Trade Port, etc.
It's an illusion to believe that the patches are free.

Prior to Common Sense you could build lots of buildings in provinces. Don't own Common Sense? Well too bad. Now you are very limited when it comes to buildings. Why? Because you cannot develop your provinces. since its DLC locked. This is removing a core feature, constructing buildings, from the game and make it pretty much DLC locked. No Common Sense DLC --> no development --> no building spaces --> can't build things.

The buildings are much more important now than before where you just spammed them around to use some cash. Before this, there was no way to develop your provinces, so besides overhauling buildings and make them more important than before. How are you stripped of development, since it adds a possibility you couldn't by no way before?

 

[Nobak]

The ideal from the user PoV would probably be if patches were strictly bugfixing and the new free features causing major gameplay changes were released as free DLC that you could activate or not. Unfortunately some free features are just not suited for being turned on and off and it would probably create a nightmare for support (and maintaining the code) trying to handle all the possible variations. Also would likely make things even worse for modders since they would also not be able to count on everyone having the same features available even when they are on the same patch version.

Yeah, I know core feature changes absolutely have to go in free patches. The more I think about it, the more I suspect my issue is not with the business model itself but with the volume and depth of the changes. Which, alotgether, is pretty silly.

I went back and loaded my last save from Art of War in 1.9.2. Let it run for a month. It played fine, it saved, and it stayed ironman. I'm taking back what I said, the issues I used to have with the game's development are no longer relevant.

 

[AurochsAway]

Yeah, I know core feature changes absolutely have to go in free patches. The more I think about it, the more I suspect my issue is not with the business model itself but with the volume and depth of the changes. Which, alotgether, is pretty silly.

I went back and loaded my last save from Art of War in 1.9.2. Let it run for a month. It played fine, it saved, and it stayed ironman. I'm taking back what I said, the issues I used to have with the game's development are no longer relevant.

1.4 and 1.5 can not be played in Ironman, but I believe they can still be played. Everything after that should work in Ironman. If you want to test, you can download Steam Achievements Manager, and delete the royal marriage one or something I suppose! Of course, DLCs won't work before they were released, but I don't think it matters whether they're selected or not, as there's simply no code for them.

 

[Chieron]

The buildings are much more important now than before where you just spammed them around to use some cash. Before this, there was no way to develop your provinces, so besides overhauling buildings and make them more important than before. How are you stripped of development, since it adds a possibility you couldn't by no way before?

Buildings were a meaningful MP sink and you practically developed your provinces with them. Building in bad provinces was not more expensive, but less efficient, which amounts to the same.
Lacking the development feature but getting the new building system, you are somewhat stuck. Except for forts, the building system should have stayed the same for non-DLC owners.
The new building system depends on the development system and its assumptions. As it is a core feature, locking one half is ugly.
Though, the development system itself is somewhat badly balanced, too.

I do like the DLC-model in general, but some locked features break non-updaters, which is a shame. Works much like an expansion, however - people without the DLC are functionally stuck around the previous patchlevel, as if they did not buy the expansion and their version did not get updated any more. Maintaining multiple versions (expansion levels or DLC combinations) will always be messy, though.

 

[Quaade]

Buildings were a meaningful MP sink and you practically developed your provinces with them. Building in bad provinces was not more expensive, but less efficient, which amounts to the same.
Lacking the development feature but getting the new building system, you are somewhat stuck. Except for forts, the building system should have stayed the same for non-DLC owners.
The new building system depends on the development system and its assumptions. As it is a core feature, locking one half is ugly.
Though, the development system itself is somewhat badly balanced, too.

I do like the DLC-model in general, but some locked features break non-updaters, which is a shame. Works much like an expansion, however - people without the DLC are functionally stuck around the previous patchlevel, as if they did not buy the expansion and their version did not get updated any more. Maintaining multiple versions (expansion levels or DLC combinations) will always be messy, though.

And I love how my choices actually matters now, should I develop and get another slot or invest in tech to get ahead. But it doesn't stop there,which province should focus on what, since that what I see the buildings as, focuses for the provinces. The way your choices impact your kingdom, is a great addition yet it still needs a little balancing

 

[rayyuri]

LOL.
If you take a look at The Sims from EA and Hearthstone from Blizzard, you will realize how generous Paradox is.
Especially Hearthstone. Almost zero development cost, yet absurdly high income earned.

 

[Pigeoncount]

I was very tempted to create an account named "Silent Majority" to have come in and say something like "Hey, lay off. This guy has some good points", but decided against it.

 

[Soranya]

I was very tempted to create an account named "Silent Majority" to have come in and say something like "Hey, lay off. This guy has some good points", but decided against it.

I am undecided if this post is meant to be serious or entertaining.

 

[Quaade]

I was very tempted to create an account named "Silent Majority" to have come in and say something like "Hey, lay off. This guy has some good points", but decided against it.

Hope this was a joke, cause it made me laugh

 

[Pigeoncount]

It was meant to entertain.

 

[podcat]

As someone who has worked at paradox for a long time I feel its time someone stepped up and told the dark sad truth.

Yes, its true. back in 2007 before the release of EU3, we spend the last couple of month chopping off all of the expansions. The art programmer complained a bit when we downgraded the map as part of cutting out Divine Wind and some are still not sure if that was a good call, but of course how else would we have been able to squeeze every last dollar out of our customers??

In fact, one of the reasons it took so long to get going on EU4 is that we had to wait for Johan to crash all of the paradox sports cars before we could be allowed to get off the couch and work again. Dont worry though we spent over a year cutting out DLC from EU4 before release so I'm pretty sure we can just lazy around for another couple of years now!

 

[Noel84]

As someone who has worked at paradox for a long time I feel its time someone stepped up and told the dark sad truth.

Yes, its true. back in 2007 before the release of EU3, we spend the last couple of month chopping off all of the expansions. The art programmer complained a bit when we downgraded the map as part of cutting out Divine Wind and some are still not sure if that was a good call, but of course how else would we have been able to squeeze every last dollar out of our customers??

In fact, one of the reasons it took so long to get going on EU4 is that we had to wait for Johan to crash all of the paradox sports cars before we could be allowed to get off the couch and work again. Dont worry though we spent over a year cutting out DLC from EU4 before release so I'm pretty sure we can just lazy around for another couple of years now!

0/10 not enough evil laughs

 

[RELee]

Look here, chumps! Don't go messing around with my sweet deal here! Because PDS now funds their patches with DLC's that have no meaningful content in them, I am able to get free patches on all their games, because as we all know, all v1.0 PDS games are released as "Unplayable!!1!!11!!1!".

Don't take away my free patches. I'm an old man on a limited income. Why I could just barely come up with the $1,000 of disposable income to get my new super-duper, gaming computer as it is.

Please. Don't take away my entitlements.

 

[WSnova]

Damn Paradox expecting to be paid for their work.

Capitalistic greed gone wrong. And you guys are Swedish, I expected more of yourselves young men!

 

[LastSalian]

If only the DLCs worked fine on day 1 or at least week 1. Every new DLC is worse than the previous. This was the last time I buy a DLC on release day, although it was kind of mandatory due to the pay-wall anyway.