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Watkabaoi 2.04 was released at the beginning of the year, and was designed to work with FTG 1.1 but still had many bugs. Then, you have to make a clean install of the game, patch to FTG 1.2, then install WATKABAOI 2.04 and, least, include the fix made by Andrei Gijgoriev on August 15th. Just go back two pages back on this thread, you'll find it. Then, it should work nice. In case you meet any problem, I upload it on another place as well:

http://www.filefront.com/17670544/WATKABAOI_Fix4_Ultimate.rar

I'm going to have a try with the game to see whether I reproduce your specific problem or not.
 
thank you for your work keeping this alive.
i played a hundred years as byz last night in the 1337 game. not a single ctd. i did pretty ok, beating the ottos and gaining like 10 provinces (did not want to get bb high as my army was, well i lost more battles than i won - with mostly superior odds). my census was like 20 gold each year, so i was able to afford 1k cav each january which was kind of fun, living on the edge of existence. ai-milking was the way to get money here.

i invested all of my spare income into infra only army-upkeep had to be paid by monthly income and not by saved up census. still in 1440 i had half way to go until infra 2. with inflation at 3% in the end, due to corruption events.

having a census next to nothing is fun and thrilling for a while. you have to keep a close eye on your money and your army (the loss of my whole army due to plague was almost a killingblow) but after a hundred years of no income and knowing for the next hundred years this will not change is -for me- frustrating. loaded up as a latintech country and saw that it was far away from infra 2 as well, so it is not a problem of the techclass. i would like to be able to promote tc at least at level 2 again. could someone tell me where i can change this?

if you tend to keep this the way it is, reaching tc in the middle of the 1500s, i would suggest giving at least each capital a tc from the start to have at least a bit of census. just my 2 cents - do not know if any others are having issues here. maybe i have to play more aggressive to have more income.

i could just edit those tc into my savegame but thats kind of lame.
 
Therion said:
Has anyone noticed there's a problem with religions? Religions aren't affected by the tolerance towards their respective subgroup. For instance, a Catholic country always get +1RR in anglican provinces no matter where the protestant tolerance slider is situated. Despite that, everything seems fine in this mod's religions.txt so this might be a feature bug.
Click to expand...

i guess anglican then does not count for the protestant slider. anglican then counts as the same as for example pagan for which you don´t have a slider as european.
should be editable, just do not know where.
 
Originally Posted by Basileios II
Well, I´m playing Byzantium right now and with full research the expected date of infra 3 is around 1565. My armies are beaten by just looking at them, I already went bankrupt in a war against the OE and the whole situation is rather bleak.

Maybe cool-toxic added some nasty penalties for the Romans to decline historically....

Edit: I also get random crashes once in a while...


BurningEGO said:
I also dislike the fact that you are only able to build tax collectors VERY LATE in the game. My census are... Nothing.

Its 1370, and i will reach infra 2 only by 1430...
Click to expand...

at least i am not alone in the dark :)
please consider working/tweaking/fixing this tc-problem. the hyw-scenario lacks much of playability this way as you do not have many possibilities without money. a loan is the end to your economy. a war against a big alliance the end to your nation without ways to raise some funds.
 
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Yes, I fully agree that income is far too low, after fifty or one hundred years, there's no money left. The point is that the mod as just been translated for FTG, but no real adjustment has been implemented before Cool Toxic left it like that and worked on something else (his Crusader Kings like project). I suppose we should check and experiment with province population/type of goods produced/goods base value/province base tax value.
 
oh, i see. cool-toxic posted in april the last time in here.
well then i should delete my first entry-line 4 posts above, and rather thank andrei gijgorev to fix it and make it at least playable.

it is said that 80% of a work are done easily and fast and the last 20% take up the most time and effort. seems this promising mod is left with unabalanced gameplay at those 80% then. i hope for the new project that it won´t be abondened unfinished as well, but i guess it is easier if more persons are working on a project.

before all those many provinces are being checked i´d suggest just to cut/adjust the costs for the technologies. this would be far easier and with better technology obtained income will increase as well. i will work through the database were to find this stuff and try it out.
 
Personally I really like the way its setup now, though Ive only played 2 majors... England and the Ottoman Empire (a number of times each). Both have been really quite fun, I gain lots of money from sync looting and peace settlements (milking them for a few years where possible). Current OE game... full support limit of 84,000 horse and 3000 ducats in the bank (1369) and one of the top monthly incomes.
 
sounds nicer then my experience, but maybe that is just byz :D
mmh, but the ottos should be in the same techgroup, at least in vanilla that was ... will check.

when did you reach infrastruture 3 and the possibility to buy those taxcollectors in your games?
 
The Ottomans start off in the Muslim tech group, only switching when they capture Constantinople. My current game Im still only infra 1, infra 2 is projected for 1400. Id guess infra 3 wil be about 1430 - 1450.
 
Simone said:
before all those many provinces are being checked i´d suggest just to cut/adjust the costs for the technologies. this would be far easier and with better technology obtained income will increase as well. i will work through the database were to find this stuff and try it out.
Click to expand...

You can always have a try with the files infra.txt and trade.txt contained in FTG/Mods/Watkabaoi/db/technologies directory. You could reduce the delay between two levels and add some levels to match the timeframe.
 
that is what i did yesterday. infra 3 is meant to be reached by 1450 in the given set up in infra.txt.

in two tries with this given setup i was nevertheless never able to reach even infra 2 by this time. 1460 was my best try were i just ran through (with the help of the console-orders) investing fully in infra and never spending census money thus no upkeep had to be paid from monthly income neither.

in a next step i reduced the years for infra 2 and 3 in the infra.txt and managed thus to reach infra 3 by 1400 with byz. increased the effency a bit as well, so more taxincome was generated. i will run a game until the end next and check how the ai is handling this.

problem might be that some countries could become too strong this way.
as strategic fail wrote he reaches infra 2 a whooping 60 years earlier than byz - the relations don´t seem to fit here

nevertheless if he will reach infra 2 in 1400 he is delayed in relation to the settings in infra.text by 30% (muslim techclass maybe?) as well. so i doubt he would reach infra 3 by the set date of 1450.

though this is still better than what i have experienced i think that 150 years of no tax-income is still not good. sync-looting is a good way, but you should not be forced to rely on that. it is easy as a mayor only. maybe besides adjusting the costs for infra the provinces of some powers will have to be adjusted too - as you have already said. shifting the ability to promote tax collectors back to infra 2 could be a way as well.
 
As I said above, my feeling is that complementary solution in the long run would be to tweak by about 10% following values:
- goods base value
- province base tax value
- province base population
And about goods value, that's quick and easy to play with.
 
Well I just hit infra 3 in 1420 after hitting infra 2 in 1399. Seems all to be in line... Ottomans are Orthodox tech group btw (after taking Constantinople). I have a number of very rich provinces by this time...Astrakhan, Alexandria, Kaffa and a couple of precious metals provinces. Also ALOT of vassals, the major ones being Egypt, Golden Horde and the Timurid Empire... Current monthly income is 83.85 ducats.

Infra 4 was projected to be in 1424 (after 3), but Ive minted to promote tax collecters, its currently projected for 1426 (in 1423)...but still minting to get up to 5%.
 
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I think a large part of it is the overall income levels, as Drjosef said.

Another piece is that in vanilla, Genoa and Venice start with higher tech and generally maintain it for at least a hundred years; that gives Latin countries a nice neighbor bonus. But I checked it out in WATKABAOI and even with myself being the only country with infra 1, I still got a +6 neighbor bonus compared to +7 in vanilla. I didn't play far enough in either to see what happens a few years later.

I would be careful about adjusting things too much to benefit the early game, since such a long period has to be covered. You might find that everyone starts maxing out tech a hundred years before the end of the game.
 
This mod is Cool Toxic's one, and considering his statements, I would say the mod is put aside temporarily. Just that we have no idea what could ever mean "temporarily". But as Cool Toxic never said he gave up his mod, as for me, I would feel ill at ease at changing things deeply and propose a new version without his explicit agreement.
On the other side, I'm really pissed off with that problem of money, I consider Ottomans or Chinese to be exceptions, very powerful and wealthy countries. Also, something that must be taken into account is that some players are very skillful and will have a somewhat gamey behaviour, so that they won't be affected by this money problem. But if you want some historical gameplay and you play average with an average country, you're going to find it difficult, especially if you consider Portugal, which needs good money support at the beginning for widespread colonization.
 
Drjosef said:
This mod is Cool Toxic's one, and considering his statements, I would say the mod is put aside temporarily. Just that we have no idea what could ever mean "temporarily". But as Cool Toxic never said he gave up his mod, as for me, I would feel ill at ease at changing things deeply and propose a new version without his explicit agreement.
Click to expand...

I understand where you are coming from, so I'd suggest that people should feel free to put together mini-mods as adjuncts to this mod. There's been a tradition of that in EU2. After all, it is a shame for progress to come to a stand still simply because the original creator is absent.
 
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