War, war never changes...

[unmerged(194646)]

You do know that Robot Nation gets every tech team upgraded several times as the game goes along, don't you? Plus gets roughly six additional tech teams? Plus Mainframe can divide into two AIs and therefore two tech teams? Right? And you want *more*?

hehehe That's the nasty option when you play Robot Nation. You can choose to be a humane AI or an inhumane AI. The above is a tech team and leader you get if you choose the evil path.

Damn, Sword, that was a spoiler if I ever saw one! :rofl: I've just started a Robots game... next thing I know you'll be saying when do they get Ready for War...

They will become a mid game power. I will give them events triggered by techs where they get the missing resources they need.

I think it's possible as things are now, I'm planning to pull it off in this game.

 

[serutan]

Sorry mate, I did not mean to imply any put down with my comments, I was trying to be funny. Yeah, Robots get some good events already the mod. You can see what they get by opening their event file. Their tech teams really expand, from memory.

Sorry, even with the smilies I wasn't sure how to take it. Didn't mean to sound snippy.

OK, so give a concrete suggestion about Dr Strangelove and you might find it in the next release! hehehe You know what? I've never even seen that movie. I know its a classic and I've seen snippets from it. Happy to put one or two more references to it in the mod.

As I said, I would have liked a pic of Dr. Strangelove to be the avatar for the Oppenheimer Trust FUSA team, rather than the real Oppenheimer as is
now the case.

In 0.3 one FUSA tech team (IIRC US Dept. of Defense) had as it avatar the War Room from Dr. Strangelove (changed to DoD emblem in 1.01) I liked the
Strangelove War Room.

Also, the Walter Matthau scientist character from Fail Safe would IMHO
be a good avatar for Kelly Johnson.

As you can see, I am into the warped views on nuclear war that Strangelove, and to a lesser extent Fail Safe had.

It's the tie in with the Vaults that really make the Strangelove references work for me - If you have not seen the last 20 minutes or so of the movie, please do so; you will understand what I mean.

 

[Viden]

Sorry, even with the smilies I wasn't sure how to take it. Didn't mean to sound snippy.



As I said, I would have liked a pic of Dr. Strangelove to be the avatar for the Oppenheimer Trust FUSA team, rather than the real Oppenheimer as is
now the case.

In 0.3 one FUSA tech team (IIRC US Dept. of Defense) had as it avatar the War Room from Dr. Strangelove (changed to DoD emblem in 1.01) I liked the
Strangelove War Room.

Also, the Walter Matthau scientist character from Fail Safe would IMHO
be a good avatar for Kelly Johnson.

As you can see, I am into the warped views on nuclear war that Strangelove, and to a lesser extent Fail Safe had.

It's the tie in with the Vaults that really make the Strangelove references work for me - If you have not seen the last 20 minutes or so of the movie, please do so; you will understand what I mean.

I find that Strangelove fits better with the Enclave. You know, all that talk about genetical purity from a recicled nazi German and all of that.

 

[bombshellboi]

Come on, everyone. No one has to feel upset about any discussion in this thread. I always welcome feedback and suggestions.

You don't come across as rude to me, don't worry.

I looked through the Fallout Bible searching on the words "Enclave" then "government" and posted all that I found. I can't find any reference to them moving east. Maybe there was something in FO2? I'd love it if you could find the actual reference.

Yeah I'm open to including content from FO3. I already have. The mod is a mish mash of FO1, FO2, FOT, FO3, Van Buren and the demented imagination of myself and other "Fallout Tragics" who have contributed to the mod.

Hey bombshellboi, if I needed you to find some graphics or do some small tasks for the mod, would you be interested?

If so, and given your feedback about FO3 ideas, the first thing I would want from you is to review the Junkers who live in Pittsburgh and make a proposal on how we could link the current setup to FO3. Your brief is to restrict yourself to a small amount of content that can be practically achieved without many hours of work. So only a few events and other content. And I would want you to assist with that. I can do coding that you don't feel confident to do. Or I could give you links to teach how to write events and teach you on that. Anyway, I would want you to find pictures for your ideas.

Interested?

Cheers,
Sword

Thanks man. That was totally my point. The mod is already a mishmash of pre-f3 stuff given that it was begun before F3 came out. Thats why I think it might be a good idea to include F3 also?

When I made the post about the Enclave I was sure that one of the epilogue slides in F2 was the remnants of the Enclave escaping out east. I was fairly certain of it. But now that you have had a wee reccy at the Bible I am now not so sure.
Luckily I am currently doing another Fallout 2 playthru so I should be able to say for certain within the next while when I complete the game. Again.

As to the situation in The Pitt I would really need to reinstall my F3 GOTY and go play The Pitt DLC to be able give you and specifics. My memory isnt the best and I wouldnt want to start making anything more than general hopeful suggestions without doing a new playthru.
Once I have done with my F2 playthru I can certainly get into doing a reccy thru F3 The Pitt DLC if you would want me to.

I do like the Fallout universe so I wouldnt mind contributing any way I can.

 

[SwordOfJustice]

@JRHINDO
Regarding attrition. Yes, it should be nasty. I did increase it a while ago. One reason why I'm holding back from increasing it more is that I see some problems with the AI handling wastelands mechanisms. I've seen it let troops get cut off and also put big stacks sitting in a Wastelands province. Those stacks will wither and die.

I have high hopes that Darkest Hour expansion will correct many remnant issues in the HOI2 code.

I really need to update the Wastelands mechanism and I've already committed to that for version 1.1. As I've mentioned elsewhere, the Marauders will generate in phases with an event to explain what is happening to generate these rebel units.

@Neoman
I love those ideas for Spiders. I'll note them in my ideas file tonight for possible future inclusion. Would you like to write some events for Spiders? I can guide you. It's easy with a little tutoring. First step is to plan a simple event structure.

@Serutan @Viden
Anyone have any ideas for Dr Strangelove? I think he could be part of the ruling Enclave Board and one of the Illuminati, couldn't he? That would mean he's an Enclave minister.

@bean1 @Neoman
The dissent events are a little harsh. Players were telling me they were conquering the whole map easily as Spiders! Anyway, some time ago I reduced the effect of the dissent events for expansion. Test it for me in 1.1.

@bean1
Yes, this is in line with plans for FUSA. Great minds think alike. The exact ideas you're proposing have been suggested a number of times. Let me do some other work for 1.1 first; then I can see if I can squeeze in a little content for FUSA as part of making strategic gameplay better. FUSA needs some opposition after Dark Cathedral rebellion to make their game more interesting and to slow them down. All part of their Manifest Destiny event chain.

@JRHINDO
WHOO HOO! Thanks.

@Ivan88
Wow, I'd love to hear how your game goes. Man, I really need to do that stuff for Robot Nation. They will be one of the most interesting nations to play if I add the planned content.

@serutan
OK those are great ideas on the Enclave. I'll see what I can do...

@Viden
Indeed.

@bombshellboi
It could be true. It's been years since I played the original two FO games. I recently started FO1 again but I must spend time on modding!

It doesn't have to be very specific for the Pitt. Just some vague foreshadowing of the future in FO3 timeline; a loose tie in, if you like. See if you can find some general ideas. Even just 2-3 events and one character would be enough. Maybe a wiki site could help instead of reinstalling the game?



Thanks everyone! The thread's been really alive lately.

I did some work last few days. I finished the event pool for scavenging the Glow. It's worth doing if your nation can.

I am chopping through the rest of the map update which means updating AI files to match the changed province IDs. It's a big job actually. Every Ai file has so many provinces with a rating as to how important that province is.

Trouble is, I'm unsure if its worth the effort and it makes maintaining those AI files more time consuming.

I'm going to change how I code the AI files. I will experiment with just giving the AI some high values for main provinces, like nation capitals, and maybe some key provinces I reckon are choke points. I will then rely on the natural game AI to guide the military conduct of any war without trying to specify a rating for every nearby province.


Ciao,
Sword

 

[serutan]

@Serutan @Viden
Anyone have any ideas for Dr Strangelove? I think he could be part of the ruling Enclave Board and one of the Illuminati, couldn't he? That would mean he's an Enclave minister.

While I had proposed this for FUSA, I have no argument with doing most
of the Strangelove stuff with Enclave - in some ways it *would* be more
appropriate. Also, the Fail Safe character (Prof. Groeteschele) would definitely be a better fit in the Enclave on further reflection.

Couple more suggestions :

How about changing Mainframe's avatar to HAL?

And using Robbie the Robot and the robot from Lost In Space for Robot tech team avatars?

 

[Neoman]

@Neoman
I love those ideas for Spiders. I'll note them in my ideas file tonight for possible future inclusion. Would you like to write some events for Spiders? I can guide you. It's easy with a little tutoring. First step is to plan a simple event structure.

Sure I'll take a go at it, I've always wanted to learn how to do events in HOI2

 

[bombshellboi]

@bombshellboi
It could be true. It's been years since I played the original two FO games. I recently started FO1 again but I must spend time on modding!

It doesn't have to be very specific for the Pitt. Just some vague foreshadowing of the future in FO3 timeline; a loose tie in, if you like. See if you can find some general ideas. Even just 2-3 events and one character would be enough. Maybe a wiki site could help instead of reinstalling the game?



Thanks everyone! The thread's been really alive lately.

I did some work last few days. I finished the event pool for scavenging the Glow. It's worth doing if your nation can.

I am chopping through the rest of the map update which means updating AI files to match the changed province IDs. It's a big job actually. Every Ai file has so many provinces with a rating as to how important that province is.

Trouble is, I'm unsure if its worth the effort and it makes maintaining those AI files more time consuming.

I'm going to change how I code the AI files. I will experiment with just giving the AI some high values for main provinces, like nation capitals, and maybe some key provinces I reckon are choke points. I will then rely on the natural game AI to guide the military conduct of any war without trying to specify a rating for every nearby province.


Ciao,
Sword

Well the reason I am against the former USA state is because if the President and Executive had a chance to flee to the Poseidon Oil rig off California prior to the nuclear conflagration dont you think the Senate and Congress would have had similar warnining and managed to escape to strategic fall back positions at NORAD?

Additionally the East coast and in particular New England, and the Capital Wasteland would have been heaviest hit by nukes during the war. Thus it would have been the slowest region to recover.
A Former USA state would have made more sense in colorado frankly.

My idea is instead to have what is currently the "former USA" become instead a collection of small one province/two province minor powers that can be united to form a "New United States" power. Perhaps in conjuction with the opening of the vaults releasing fragments of the former power apparatus?
Like for example Rivet City becoming the dominant power in the Capital Wasteland possibly due to its proximity to and involvement project purity, which I recommend changing from its premise of being a water purification plant (Hello Bethesda? Meet science.) to being a plant which enables Vault 87s GECK to work; we can say that the GECK was damaged by either the high levels of radiation in the vault or the mutants who once inhabited it. Rivet City would have the option if it managed to absorb/defeat its neighbours to unite into the "New United States" or perhaps to form a coalition against a greater power such as the mutant army, or even the Brotherhood of Steel, or the Enclave.

 

[JRHINDO]

Well the reason I am against the former USA state is because if the President and Executive had a chance to flee to the Poseidon Oil rig off California prior to the nuclear conflagration dont you think the Senate and Congress would have had similar warnining and managed to escape to strategic fall back positions at NORAD?

Oh well maybe the enclave cabal was aware of the attack and fled before the nukes striked. They surely didnt care for the senate and congress and left them to die, but most of the guys could have had the time to run to the dc presidential fallout shelter.

Ya know I am not too much for input of F3 story parts, but it would actually be an interesting idea to have the capital wasteland as FUSA at start and require some roleplay from the player to bring it back to glory. Sure would require a bit of reshape of the mod's story, but could be even nicer. (If you cave to slavery, the "Lincolnist" free slaves revolts. Use PMCs, the Black Talon. Try to use the local Brotherhood of steel to get close to the Easter Brotherhood and maybe absorb them. Go on quests to secure data and artifacts of old USA. Awesome potential! )

 

[bombshellboi]

Im also getting an error at the game start.

I get an alert saying the Scenario file is corrupted/has errors. I have to select ignore to get past it. It does the same when loading a save.

Any ideas why?

 

[serutan]

I get the same thing. I ignore it, and it doesn't seem to have any ill effects.

 

[Lyrecryer]

Im also getting an error at the game start.

I get an alert saying the Scenario file is corrupted/has errors. I have to select ignore to get past it. It does the same when loading a save.

Any ideas why?

Do not worry. that is not going to go away until the mod-leader gets rid of the barbarians faraway lands.


after many attempts to find out why it was happening on my scenarios i found out that that only pops up when there is an missing province that wasn't claimed by anyone OR that the province is not in the scenario per-say (Like it's not on the allowed area, Faraway lands is in Spain and that makes the error as you can't go to Spain.

 

[Vaximillian]

I'm going to try Fallout. Shame I've never played it before.

 

[bean1]

if you do play fallout 1 you should give FO2 a try also. It is a great game.

Dozens of endings, great voice acting and interesting characters, infinite(almost) good or evil karma choices, many towns/cities and wasteland to venture through. And a great US president to boot(Vote Dick Richardson for president!)

 

[bombshellboi]

Do not worry. that is not going to go away until the mod-leader gets rid of the barbarians faraway lands.


after many attempts to find out why it was happening on my scenarios i found out that that only pops up when there is an missing province that wasn't claimed by anyone OR that the province is not in the scenario per-say (Like it's not on the allowed area, Faraway lands is in Spain and that makes the error as you can't go to Spain.

Basically a new map is what is required?

 

[messenger]

Basically a new map is what is required?

Not sure about that but Sword is definitely in the process of setting up a new map for the next version, evidence should be a couple of pages back.

 

[JRHINDO]

I think barabarians is just for testing purposes. It is in spain so he dont angry have neighbours and can spy everyone's progress.

 

[Lyrecryer]

Basically a new map is what is required?

no. he just need to put the Barbarians somewhere else, or remove it entirely as well as far away lands.

 

[SwordOfJustice]

Yeah, the error doesn't seem to hurt the game at all but I will check on what is causing it. It is either what I did with commintern alliance or the barbarian and far away land off map nations.

Cheers,
Sword

 

[vota dc]

Well, no offense taken. It's just discussion and ideas.

The mod has been an evolution. It came to me as an early build. FUSA was already there as the USA. It was meant to be the first nation a new player would play and was the only one presented on the scenario load screen (of course you could right click and choose one of the others). I renamed it as FUSA based on a great computer card game called ChronX.

Rather than rebuild what was handed to me, I and some other wonderful people have taken the mod to a playable version as it is now.

I like the concept of a remnant of the pre-War government desperately hanging on. I don't believe it's against the spirit of Fallout.

As to conflict with so called "canon" and saying that the Enclave and the Brotherhood are all that could be left of the pre-war USA, oh you're so wrong!

Enclave are the secret power brokers, the President and government executive. The Brotherhood of Steel was started from a small group of US Army deserters.

What ever happened to the Senate and Congress? Never mentioned as far as I know in the canon. So why couldn't they have survived?

It's been years since I refered to the Fallout Bible anyway. I could check if I felt like it. That would be the best source of this "canon" anyway.

But I'm not going to check!
A). Because I don't care.
B). Because I don't treat Fallout canon as a sacred cow anyway. Hell, the original makers of Fallout 1 and 2 weren't stuck up about anything, they just made some games they thought were fun.
C). Because I just don't have time to go back and rewrite major content already in the mod. I'm pushing just to finish this project, and right now I want to get 1.1 done.

Another problem is that three majors = The Good, the Bad and the Ugly = win.
So who else than FUSA can be the other major? Mutants? They were a major...plus non mutants can't ally with them. However FUSA should be not only a country, but an ideal and a faction. I mean there could be some chances that the old Senate want to join the old government (they lived in wasteland, they are scared by mutants etc) and there is already the chance that FUSA are wiped from the map before the end game alliances. In that case it would be cool to have someone else that wants the good old USA back instead the bad USA (Enclave) back without the lead of a pre-war government like the FUSA.