War Exaust & Etc.

[unmerged(4730)]

Personally i think tax collectors should give +2 rr instead of +3
that way they can be countrered eventually and accepted into the social system... Like sweedes do accept the high taxes of today 50-60 percent which were probably less acceptable back then... Or u could give mayors -1 rr just like judges, but I rather have tax collecters add 2 rr instead of 3 to equate the nations of the world. much of rr u get depends on stab and that usually gets beat down by negative stab events during the worse possible time. Also civil war in my opinion should only happen by events or be capped at taking over only half your army.


P.S.
Moscowy became much harder after tc only for census.
U start with 100k army and 100 ducats ... and u dont get 33% of ur taxes anymore so its much much harder. Maybe it should get
more at start like 250. Also boosting its starting provinces in base tax maybe 1-2 across the board would be good to replace the tc revinue.

PPPs thx for unbanin me
had no email to send...

 

[JohnMK]

With the adjustment to tax collectors in the recent patch I don't think it's necessary to boost them any further.

 

[unmerged(4730)]

my main point

is to reduce revolt risk given by tc's, u should be able to have some war exaust before it goes to rr instead of just 1 we and then u get rr hits.

 

[JohnMK]

What makes you think you're so special as to deserve no revolts under those circumstances? If you want an easy game, play at Very Easy.

 

[unmerged(4730)]

well

historicly wars lasted longer then 3 years...
10-20 is more the usuall timespan which is unachiavable with the current war exaust.
and
thats for small wars not even big ones.
they took taxes during the hundred years war but
u cant even do a descent 5 year war before ur war
exaust forces u to peace

 

[Zagys]

I thought tax collectors only added +1 rr.

 

[Medicine Man]

Originally posted by JohnMK
With the adjustment to tax collectors in the recent patch I don't think it's necessary to boost them any further.

Ha ha ha ha ha.

That's one way of looking at it I suppose, but not the only way.

The actual characteristics of the tax collector upgrade have not been changed in any way. Based only on those characteristics, many people chose not to build them at all. The difference with the latest beta is that the tax collectors are now needed in order to take advantage of a feature that has been present since EU1 v1.00.

The bottom line: tax collectors haven't been boosted at all. They still suck as much as ever but only now everyone is forced to use them.

 

[JohnMK]

They're boosted in absolute usefulness. If you measure 'boost' by how much people want to build them now, vs. how much people wanted to build them in the past.

 

[Medicine Man]

Or.

A measure between how much people wanted to build them before vs how much people have no choice now.

 

[unmerged(9563)]

Sure you have a choice. You can live in poverty, or you can live in riches. Like normal, the AI chooses choice A 95% of the time...

 

[JohnMK]

Well actually the AI is pretty good about building tax collectors.

 

[Medicine Man]

Which is why I'm not really worried about the whole thing, although I still think the changes to the taxation system should be a little more conservative.

 

[Castellon]

(Moderator Comment)
Cleared some spam out of this thread.

 

[JohnMK]

Originally posted by Medicine Man
the changes to the taxation system should be a little more conservative.

Well I agree. I tried to make the case two days before the patch was posted (Johan was talking about this in IRC) but I think my concerns fell upon a set mind. He really likes this new system. Maybe we can still push for compromise though.

 

[Arilou]

For the love of Bob! It's SWEDEN not SWEEDEN!
*grumble*

Also, war exhaustion is implemented in a silly way.

 

[JohnMK]

Just my opinion but if I misspelled something I'd sure prefer somebody contact me via private message . . .

 

[unmerged(5161)]

WE is the main cause for massive "gang-bang" wars. Any ideas on how to solve that?

 

[unmerged(4730)]

thoughts

basicly we are forced to use tax collectors now...
i still think we should get census without them maybe
70 percent of census instead of 100 but not getting
census without them is kinda unrealistic.

it really hurts strategy wise , basicly as
russia i never built em to reduce my war exaust
pains... but now i have no choice.

Also kinda unrealistic taxes were collected by
the nobles and then sent to the duke ...
so they had census taxes before tax collectors.
Tax collectors were later imposed in "free western"
societies where free men earned moneys which
could be taxed by the state.
But untill those enlightened times rulers gained
most of their moneys by taxing rich and merchants.
and those in turn taxed the common man themselves
in order to pay em.

I really disagree with no census without tax collectors.
Maybe there should be a large bonus with them
like 5-10 percent tax improvement but it should be a
choice instead of forcing players to go that way or looze.

 

[Wyvern]

I'm not going to argue historicity, but from a game play point of view the change is a good one in my opinion. Before this change there were very few reasons to build TC's, about the only one that made sense was to reduce gold inflation, all others were outweighed by the increase revolt risk at least in MP (SP that wasn't a problem unless you were going on a WC).

Now, as you say, building TC's is effectively mandatory in your same culture core provinces, but it's still a toss up in other provinces like colonies and probably not worth the RR there.

Also consider, everyone now builds TC's, so your +3% RR is not a real disadvantage as everyone suffers equally or suffers a big income disadvantage if they decide to forego it. As for Russia the change is really an advantage to her, as she has so many core provinces and hence can afford more of her provinces to have TC's than most nations without suffering massive WE.

 

[SJG]

I like the new changes. If you have a feudal tax system you should get penalised in terms of income.

As for the +3 RR, it is only a problem because WE is excessive.