Wake Up!

[unmerged(149949)]

I must post again for what i can read in this thread, people are already talking about an expansion....

WHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTT TTTTTTTHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEE.......

What are some people thinking! I know that it might not be out for a while and i can understand it being out in a year and a half but so soon to be talking about one... what sort of madman buys an expansion pack just so it will make the game you bought, like the one you thought you were buying.

Madness.

But on a lighter note, Happy Christmas everyone.

 

[TheLoneGunman]

I must post again for what i can read in this thread, people are already talking about an expansion....

WHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTT TTTTTTTHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEE.......

What are some people thinking! I know that it might not be out for a while and i can understand it being out in a year and a half but so soon to be talking about one... what sort of madman buys an expansion pack just so it will make the game you bought, like the one you thought you were buying.

Madness.

And King said that the game will be patched first to make sure all of the already implemented elements are working properly before an expansion comes out.

 

[blue emu]

Good riddance you useless piece of shit.

This post is completely unacceptable... regardless of how you might feel about the "whiner" vs "fanboy" debate.

 

[unmerged(51418)]

This post is completely unacceptable... regardless of how you might feel about the "whiner" vs "fanboy" debate.

EMU!!!
You alive? I'e even PMed you, but got no answer.
I thought you were dead...

 

[King]

And King said that the game will be patched first to make sure all of the already implemented elements are working properly before an expansion comes out.

Plus no one actually forces you to buy expansions.

 

[Ciryandor]

OP's long-winded rant filled with irony (bought HoI 3, wasn't satisfied, yet registered the game AND haven't patched it at all?)

You from Creative Assembly by any chance? A publicist of theirs, mayhap?

For those who don't get the reference.

 

[Tyson_48]

And King said that the game will be patched first to make sure all of the already implemented elements are working properly before an expansion comes out.

That's what i said a few pages before...Paradox usually do what they can to fix and improve their games.
Because of that, i don't see the point of the whining.
Yes HoI3v1.0 was (for me) disappointing but i am quite sure PI will fix it through patches and improve it with expansions.

That is what i call customer support!
As i siad, PI games could sometimes be a piece of crap at v1.0 but at v1.x (or v2.x) you have a better games than you have imagined...
Other companies release games full of crap and just fix a few bugs.
I played many games in my life, but no game ever gave me fun for so many hours and after so many years like Paradox-games.

So what are we whining about here?
Was HoI2 better at v1.0 or even EU3?
Compare EU3v1.0 to IN3.2 or HTTT!
Two different games!

 

[blue emu]

EMU!!!
You alive?

Barely. My cat made a clever attempt to assassinate me, but only succeeded in putting me in the hospital. I'm around the Forum occasionally.

 

[Tyson_48]

Barely. My cat made a clever attempt to assassinate me, but only succeeded in putting me in the hospital. I'm around the Forum occasionally.

That's why i have a dog
If you trust a cat, you are as good as dead...

 

[unmerged(184591)]

The Great Leader, Fredrik II, promised an expansion for HoI3 as long ago as about the 3rd developer diary. So one expansion is pretty much a given. Although first there needs to be a patch, to make sure you are actually paying for an expansion.

A comment, and please don't take this as an attack.

HoI was releaseed, and went through six patches. Support was great, and we worked with all the problems because of Paradox's history of support and updates shown with Europa and Vicky. Somewhere along this time Paradox obtained business partners and appeared to alter their business model.

HOI2 was released as a great new version of HOI, and had several patches. Then, to the dismay of the "fan base", the "Doomsday expansion" was released. It wasn't much more than the next patch. Patches for the "original HOI2" ceased, forcing you to purchase "Doomsday" if you wanted any game improviements. After two "Doomsday" patches the "Armageddon Expansion" turned out to be a repeat of the doomsday scenario. one final patch was released. Essentially the same game but you were forced to purchase the game three times to stay updated.

With HOI3 we now have a new model. Most sales appear to be online, and you have to pay for sprite packs and sound packs. No hardcopy manual. One would hope the cycle would change. It may be a good marketing model, but it disallusions long time PI product users / supporters.

I shelled out for HOI2 three times and would rather see an "Expansion" for HOI3 that IS an expansion rather than an update called one. I support Paradox both financially and commentwise, but can see where all these comments come from. As paradox's support changes so must my view of Paradox Interactive.

Also please look into "copy protection" for your products. The game seems to have appeared on pirate sites virtually the same day that you relased it. This fact also disallusions those whom purchase your products.

 

[zeekater]

Armageddon was sold at 5€, and it did include new stuff like the scenarios, brigades for ships and other small items. All new things, nothing for a patch.
Doomsday costed more, but added more items.

You can't expect to get new items for free in a patch, patches only serve to fix existing features.

Also, some of the sprite packs for HoI3 have been made by fans, who took the opportunity to get something for their hard work.

Also please look into "copy protection" for your products. The game seems to have appeared on pirate sites virtually the same day that you relased it. This fact also disallusions those whom purchase your products.

Like copy protection ever stopped anyone

I don't feel disallusioned, I don't mind paying for a good game
So they can continue to make good games!

 

[Greybriar]

....Also please look into "copy protection" for your products. The game seems to have appeared on pirate sites virtually the same day that you relased it. This fact also disallusions those whom purchase your products.

And who sent you, StarForce?

 

[Henri]

Or to say in Mr. Murphy's words: "Work expands to fill the time allocated to its completion."

That is Parkinson's law; Murphy's law is that that bad things will always happen at the worst possible time in the worst possible way (known in French as the principle of emmerdement maximum....).

Henri

 

[Hellcat]

Some of you folks really need to wake up in my opinion!

Oh man, thanks for waking me up. It's almost time to go to work!

 

[unmerged(12747)]

I don't get people who say this game doesn't work. It works pretty damn well the way it's now. Have you actually played HoI3 recently or just repeat the FUD some other dude wrote in another thread?

I've spent more hours this year with HoI3 than with any other game, maybe except for EU3 which I played a lot in the first half of 2009. And I had quite a choice here since my little bro gets all the big titles for console-heads that are out there. I could be playing freaking Call of Duty now, but I prefer to move those little rectangles around attacking other rectangles instead. There must be something great in HoI3 for me to choose it over all those big games...

RIGHT ON BROTHER! Exactly wanted to say but you already said it. I can play HoI3 for hours on end, lose sleep and still keep playing yet there are people here who say its broken or don't work.

 

[sbr]

Three things:

1. I played the heck out of HOI2, and pre-ordered this game. I haven't had many problems, but to be honest the game doesn't hold my attention for some reason. I have started a bunch of games, all as Germany, but have never invaded France, I just can't seem to finish Poland.
   
2. I want to thank King for his contributions here. I am very on the fence in regards to whether I agree with Paradox's current development style. What King has done and said in this thread has pushed me more towards their side than I had been previously.
   
3. I wanted to post here to subscribe to the thread.

Carry on.

 

[Lor Dric]

Good riddance you useless piece of shit.

A shame jeez. During the Holidays no less. You upset blue emu. Bad!! Bad!!
Thanks King for all the info. Might buy into HoI3 after a couple more patches.

 

[King]

A comment, and please don't take this as an attack.

HoI was releaseed, and went through six patches. Support was great, and we worked with all the problems because of Paradox's history of support and updates shown with Europa and Vicky. Somewhere along this time Paradox obtained business partners and appeared to alter their business model.

HOI2 was released as a great new version of HOI, and had several patches. Then, to the dismay of the "fan base", the "Doomsday expansion" was released. It wasn't much more than the next patch. Patches for the "original HOI2" ceased, forcing you to purchase "Doomsday" if you wanted any game improviements. After two "Doomsday" patches the "Armageddon Expansion" turned out to be a repeat of the doomsday scenario. one final patch was released. Essentially the same game but you were forced to purchase the game three times to stay updated.

With HOI3 we now have a new model. Most sales appear to be online, and you have to pay for sprite packs and sound packs. No hardcopy manual. One would hope the cycle would change. It may be a good marketing model, but it disallusions long time PI product users / supporters.

I shelled out for HOI2 three times and would rather see an "Expansion" for HOI3 that IS an expansion rather than an update called one. I support Paradox both financially and commentwise, but can see where all these comments come from. As paradox's support changes so must my view of Paradox Interactive.

Also please look into "copy protection" for your products. The game seems to have appeared on pirate sites virtually the same day that you relased it. This fact also disallusions those whom purchase your products.

All the HoI 1 patchs were pretty much done by a single programmer working part time. The HoI3 1.01 patch had the full development team working on it. The 1.04 patch has 3 programmers working full time on it, for a week already. So although the number of patches our games get has dropped, the amount of time we actually devote to patching is up. Also rather than going through a number of small patches we are aiming for the big one, fix everything we can and the aim is you won't need another patch (want one perhaps, but that is a different question). With 1.03 we thought we had it, I think it went thourgh 9 interations as a public Beta to fix the things (see the tech support forum), you as a community wanted. Not quite there yet, so we aim for 1.04, once we have an RC we will probably again throw it out to public beta to see if we are there.

I agree whole heartedly with you expansion comment. An expansion should be an expansion. Look at the game, go back to features that were cut from the original design, look at areas which can be improved, but not fixing bugs. Although I'll be honest if once we are patched and the expansion goes into development if we find a CTD we will fix for the expansion, it is silly to ship a product with a known CTD in the name of ideological purity.

The sad fact is that games will always be pirated and no matter how good the copy protection is, it will always be broken. What good copy protection gives you is a few days (at best) of pirate free sales, and in return you incovinence your paying customers for ever. So we do not go down that route, why punish you for something you haven't done? We prefer to go down the game resgistration route. Tell us you are paying customer so we know. When you post ideas and suggestion we know this is something that the group of people who buy our games want. Get access to the tech support forum without being jammed up by people who haven't paid. Post your bugs in the bug reporting forum, we want to know what annoys those who buy our games, not those who pirate our games.

 

[SwordOfJustice]

Thanks for a very informative update, King. I like what I read; good work!

Cheers,
Sword

 

[Federkiel]

All the HoI 1 patchs were pretty much done by a single programmer working part time. The HoI3 1.01 patch had the full development team working on it. The 1.04 patch has 3 programmers working full time on it, for a week already. So although the number of patches our games get has dropped, the amount of time we actually devote to patching is up. Also rather than going through a number of small patches we are aiming for the big one, fix everything we can and the aim is you won't need another patch (want one perhaps, but that is a different question). With 1.03 we thought we had it, I think it went thourgh 9 interations as a public Beta to fix the things (see the tech support forum), you as a community wanted. Not quite there yet, so we aim for 1.04, once we have an RC we will probably again throw it out to public beta to see if we are there.

I agree whole heartedly with you expansion comment. An expansion should be an expansion. Look at the game, go back to features that were cut from the original design, look at areas which can be improved, but not fixing bugs. Although I'll be honest if once we are patched and the expansion goes into development if we find a CTD we will fix for the expansion, it is silly to ship a product with a known CTD in the name of ideological purity.

The sad fact is that games will always be pirated and no matter how good the copy protection is, it will always be broken. What good copy protection gives you is a few days (at best) of pirate free sales, and in return you incovinence your paying customers for ever. So we do not go down that route, why punish you for something you haven't done? We prefer to go down the game resgistration route. Tell us you are paying customer so we know. When you post ideas and suggestion we know this is something that the group of people who buy our games want. Get access to the tech support forum without being jammed up by people who haven't paid. Post your bugs in the bug reporting forum, we want to know what annoys those who buy our games, not those who pirate our games.

Thank you King for your patience to continuously answering the upcoming questions. You filled the part of 'development feedback' some of us customers have been missing for quite some time.

As you have noticed and taken response to, many of us feel the urge that the game requires some improvement. Your insistence has convinced me that you - from the developer's side - feel that urge, too.

Therefore you got me 'heads up again' and my patience to keep up testing and reporting as well as waiting for further patches has improved.

I'd like to point out that all of what i have been 'complaining' on is intended to be of constructive use. Just like you i would not take the time to 'playtest', read and write so much if i did not have interest in having the game improved for the better. I admit to keep on repeating some matters that do not seem to be noticed by devs' side but in the meantime the number of main issues remains limited (i.e. can be done without overthrowing the whole basics). Much of it is tweaking and smaller changes which of course still require to be tested to check on changes' impact on a larger scale/long term.

Please keep up your dedication to the baby we all hope for to get perfected as far as possible.

This being said, i wish all of you at PI happy holidays and a good hand when the crucial stage of the patching process comes.