VIP - Scandinavia

[unmerged(21942)]

I am currently revamping the Scandanavia area(nothing huge or ahistorical). I am seeing how my changes have affected the Slesvig war and they work great BUT after the first war Denmark is in MASSIVE debt making it impossible to continue fighting even if they win the first war. I think what is happening is that Denmark gets 2-6 divisiond from NOR-SWE and the maintenance cripples them. Anyway, anybody like either of these suggestions?

Hmm...i smell the need for a better ai! Anyway, after my AI files are fitted for Vip 0.2, i'll take on the scandinavia, so get your events straight and working!

 

[tyrel68]

Hmm...i smell the need for a better ai! Anyway, after my AI files are fitted for Vip 0.2, i'll take on the scandinavia, so get your events straight and working!

Cool stuff! Anyway the events are working but I am mainly tuning them at this point. I am adding a defeat event so that just Slesvig is taken and also made the DAN ai reacitve which worked quite well. I also am tinkering with giving some cash along with the troops to offset the maintenance

 

[tyrel68]

Cool stuff! Anyway the events are working but I am mainly tuning them at this point. I am adding a defeat event so that just Slesvig is taken and also made the DAN ai reacitve which worked quite well. I also am tinkering with giving some cash along with the troops to offset the maintenance

The land battles seem to go nicely, Denmark takes advantage of it's forts while the prussians bleed their armies dry. The only catch is that the Prussians eventually funnel enough troops into the capital to take it. The fix for this is to make Denmark properly guard the waters surronding the capital but I cannot figure out how to do that. Everything I do seems to have no effect on the deployment of ships.

 

[Kenshin]

About triggers, I have now read all the forum concerning sweden and scandinavian union and I have a few suggestions and comments.

FIRST
Åland should be part of svealand, the folkomröstning in Åland in 1919 was in favor to belong to sweden but UN gave it to Finland. The population in Åland where (and is) of the opinion that tthey belong to sweden or as a independet country.

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"Under 1919 anord-nades dessutom i frågan en ny folkomröstning på Å.,
hvarvid framgick, att af de på öarna röstberättigadeoch närvarande personerna, utgörande i allt 10,196 män och kvinnor, 9,735 uttalat sig för återförening med Sverige. En samtidigt antagen finsk lag ang. viss jälfstyrelse på Ålandsöarna möttes af befolkningens öppna motstånd." (Nordisk familjebok)
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It should be a stronger connection to form a scandinavian union if sweden joins Denmark in war (scandinavian surge) and sweden joins in crimean war.

But it should also be possible to work towards a union. A few events to choose that would be nice. Like, remember kalmar union or "Look at the germans, aren´t we also one Nation", "Remember the Vikings, the nordic could rule the world again" If all countrys have them, and triggers the direction against scandinavianism rather than swedish, norwergian, finnish or danish nationalism it would be a scandinavia as it happends in germany.

When scandinavia is formed, they should want to libarate Finland, as a part of the union or as a free country, and if they achive that they could go on and demand the liberation of estland (and lettland) since they belong to the nordic romanticism.

And in-game, all countrys should be able to form scandinavia, since its about nationalism, it shouldn´t be that you lose just because you play the country with least prestige and scandinavia is formed. .

As for sweden...
I like to work on a few triggers that have been suggested, and I have not seen anyone do yet.

1853- crimean war- we want finland back

18?? Attack them in the rear, we cheat as in the napolic wars :rofl: remember the siege of copenhagen 1670. <sweden attack denmark>
-prestige
-relation between SWE and DEN, NOR (if exist), GBR FRA

1871- IF sweden have a conservative gov.
a) Join preussian war against the liberals... +1 militance for all liberals
b) Do not join
c) What an oppertunity, attack on preussia, gov fall-> liberal gov, ....

Any comments?
I know its to late for v2.0 but as almast all in this forum is about norway and denmark it would be fun to contribute on behalf of sweden.

 

[tyrel68]

Great ideas! Most of them can be integrated right into existing events and the Finland one is only a slight modification of an event chain that I just created. It is in VIP.2 now. I don't think we should increase the amount of triggers for the union but I am all for making an alternate method of unification.

 

[Sleepyhead]

I think that the Scandinavian events at least +5 prestige. +1 seems to little.

 

[tyrel68]

I think that the Scandinavian events at least +5 prestige. +1 seems to little.

I didn't notice that so i just uploaded a corrected version as per your suggestion

 

[tyrel68]

1)It should be a stronger connection to form a scandinavian union if sweden joins Denmark in war (scandinavian surge) and sweden joins in crimean war.
2)And in-game, all countrys should be able to form scandinavia, since its about nationalism, it shouldn´t be that you lose just because you play the country with least prestige and scandinavia is formed. .
3)18?? Attack them in the rear, we cheat as in the napolic wars remember the siege of copenhagen 1670. <sweden attack denmark>
-prestige
-relation between SWE and DEN, NOR (if exist), GBR FRA
4)1853- crimean war- we want finland back

Need Clarification on these

1) I don't think making it more complicated to make scandanavia is what is needed

2) You do have the choice not to be annexed and if you have less prestige than either of the other two,then why would they follow you

3) Explain this a little more.....this is just an unprovoked attack? Just give me the triggers and consequences

4) I already have an event to recapture Finland if it is satilleted or a free country. I also have a event for Russia where Finland has a chance to become a satillite. Any more and it will be too likely to happen.

I will try to integrate your other changes though and once you clarify these I will try them as well

 

[Sleepyhead]

I didn't notice that so i just uploaded a corrected version as per your suggestion

good

 

[unmerged(26209)]

About the danish colonies:

In the latest VIP, there is two Guinean uncliamed provinces. On of these is Freetown, which I think begins with an English claim on it. The other, conakry, is unclaimed. Maybe Denmark could begin with a trade station in Conakry? That would be an acceptable solution.

And then get an event that makes it possible to sell this trade station to the UK, or maybe someone else?

 

[tyrel68]

Scandanvian 1836 Factories

Here is the current OOB Factory layout

1836 Factory distribution
NOR:clipper_shipyard,lumber_mill
SWE:lumber_mill,steel_factory,ammunition_factory,small_arms_factory,canned_food_factory,paper_mill
DAN:clipper_shipyard,small_arms_factory,canned_food_factory,ammunition_factory,glass_factory,liquor_distillery

Here is some info I managed to find on the three countries

History:

Sweden:
For centuries, Sweden has been a major producer and exporter of various forms of iron ore and sulfide ores.

Today:

Norway: (eliminated modern and RGO goods)
steel,ships

Denmark:
ships

Sweden:
paper, lumber, steel

My main issue is getting Norway propped up and Denmark evened out. both of these countries need alot of tuning to get their economies working. So any opinions on a better factory layout would be appreciated

 

[pimparel]

Here is the current OOB Factory layout

Here is some info I managed to find on the three countries
My main issue is getting Norway propped up and Denmark evened out. both of these countries need alot of tuning to get their economies working. So any opinions on a better factory layout would be appreciated

I don't see much of a problem, there. Just install a higher weight in fabric to the AI, so he can cope with the clippers.

 

[tyrel68]

I don't see much of a problem, there. Just install a higher weight in fabric to the AI, so he can cope with the clippers.

True, that would at least give them a chance but two things:

1) The AI does not want to buy fabric EVEN THOUGH the clipper factory is crying out for it! I tested this myself and I had to force the buying of fabric in order to get the factory going

2) Norway doesn't have an economy where it can afford to spend large amounts importing(This may be fixed with the POP overhaul)

 

[pimparel]

True, that would at least give them a chance but two things:

1) The AI does not want to buy fabric EVEN THOUGH the clipper factory is crying out for it! I tested this myself and I had to force the buying of fabric in order to get the factory going

2) Norway doesn't have an economy where it can afford to spend large amounts importing(This may be fixed with the POP overhaul)

1) if the AI is set to build factory, this won't be a problem, and cotton is aroiund in the WM.

2) not all economys should be good, the POP overhaul, won't solve, it will improve (a little).

 

[pimparel]

And BTW, Norway was well know by it's navy, but it was a Steam Navy, not a Sail Navy. They shouldn't have a clipper_factory!

Or I am wrong?

Their clipper_factory, should be replaced by paper

 

[tyrel68]

And BTW, Norway was well know by it's navy, but it was a Steam Navy, not a Sail Navy. They shouldn't have a clipper_factory!

Or I am wrong?

Their clipper_factory, should be replaced by paper

Hmm....interesting idea. I did read they had a pulp and paper industry. Well, I could work that into the eventual military build up that Norway had in the late 1900's but that is for later. I will try replacing it with a paper mill

 

[tyrel68]

Ok, Since a LOT of changes in Scandanavia happened in the latest VIP patch, any critiques or suggestions would be great

 

[palmus]

Ok.I'll shoot: We've got to do something about Sweden owning Norway. Even in 1836 Norway had their own constitution, parliament, prime minister and an army. I see no reason not to make Norway a Swedish satellite from the start...

Norway and Sweden had the same flag back then, they should be something more then just a satellite.
Norway didn't get their present flag until 1905.

 

[Sleepyhead]

Do you mean the flag with the herring salad in the left corner?
i think it can be found at http://tse.dyndns.org/~sktse/vflags/index.html - Victoria Flag directory. Also when did the scandinavian monetary union occur?

 

[tyrel68]

Norway and Sweden had the same flag back then, they should be something more then just a satellite.
Norway didn't get their present flag until 1905.

We already decided on satillite as being annexed by Sweden also did not work. As for the flag, I agree but they need a differant flag then sweden so if you want you can cobble up a new flag and shield. I can easily make an event which will switch from yours to the current one.