VIP - Indian Subcontinent

[OHgamer]

I annexed British India through event, and now I'm getting ungodly revolts everywhere. There is plenty of clergymen in India, and so the consciousness and militancy of the Indian pops are all at 0/0, so the Revolts must be due to nationalism. Is there any way to fix this? I was able to field 13 British divisions in 1858, and in 1863 I can only field 2! (I have 61 British divisions though)

We are looking into this but are not sure what form the fix will take in 0.5 because the nationalism action is something within the game engine itself IIRC. Will have to see what 1.04 brings before we can develop a potential solution for this.

 

[unmerged(8032)]

We are looking into this but are not sure what form the fix will take in 0.5 because the nationalism action is something within the game engine itself IIRC. Will have to see what 1.04 brings before we can develop a potential solution for this.

I love this mod, although being a die-hard Anglophile I'm very un-crazy about the whole India issue as it currently exists. However, I've been trying it as a good sport, but the insane endless revolts are making me batty. I did as you suggested, and as soon as I got a diplomat as the UK, I broke my alliance with India. However, a few days later, they force reallied with me. How do I get the integration trigger to happen? I thought that was what you said to do in an earlier post. Thanks!

 

[OHgamer]

I love this mod, although being a die-hard Anglophile I'm very un-crazy about the whole India issue as it currently exists. However, I've been trying it as a good sport, but the insane endless revolts are making me batty. I did as you suggested, and as soon as I got a diplomat as the UK, I broke my alliance with India. However, a few days later, they force reallied with me. How do I get the integration trigger to happen? I thought that was what you said to do in an earlier post. Thanks!

Because of the potential for AI India to not always honor alliances when at war (esp if ENG finds itself in a second war) we created a "fix" to keep IND existing. Basically it takes IIRC 3 breaking of the alliance now to trigger ENG annexation.

 

[Sleepyhead]

When you inherit india you get to chose wheater to directly control the minors or satalite them. If I want the land, I will get huge amount of BB. Can't the annexation of the minors happen over time or have some bb reduction?
Having BB wars in 36 is a bit odd.

 

[OHgamer]

When you inherit india you get to chose wheater to directly control the minors or satalite them. If I want the land, I will get huge amount of BB. Can't the annexation of the minors happen over time or have some bb reduction?
Having BB wars in 36 is a bit odd.

The thing is what do you do in the meantime. If you have inherited British India, the minors become "loose cannons" until the event that has ENG either annex or satellite them. I guess there could be a third "let them be on their own" which would then allow ENG to conquer them at a later date, but given how the British approached the Indian minors, they were not going to let them loose after they had arranged for them to be "under short leash" beforehand. I'll have to think how that would work - some like Hyderabad, Mysore, Oudh or Holkar would likely become rather anti-British if the British showed a sign of "weakness" by not continuing the original system.

 

[Sleepyhead]

I mean why does UK inherit them all at once? I want to inherit them at steps so I won't get BB wars etc. And it's definatly not historical for UK to get them all that early by event.

 

[unmerged(8032)]

Which option in the 1858 event is the historical one. If I choose "Crown Rule Established" nothing happens, British India stays independent. If I chose "Abolish the Indian Bureaucracy" all hell breaks loose but I gain control. I'm just curious which is historical, and if anything else happens if you choose the first one.

Thanks!

 

[tyrel68]

Which option in the 1858 event is the historical one. If I choose "Crown Rule Established" nothing happens, British India stays independent. If I chose "Abolish the Indian Bureaucracy" all hell breaks loose but I gain control. I'm just curious which is historical, and if anything else happens if you choose the first one.

Thanks!

Crown rul was essentially what happened AFAIK. Also option A is always the historical one

 

[unmerged(8032)]

Crown rul was essentially what happened AFAIK. Also option A is always the historical one

Ah! I didn't realize that! Thanks.

So, basically then if you choose the historical one you don't gain total control of India, eh?

 

[OHgamer]

Ah! I didn't realize that! Thanks.

So, basically then if you choose the historical one you don't gain total control of India, eh?

No.

While the British East India Company itself was dissolved after the 1857 Rebellion, the structure of administration of India developed by the BEIC (actually better to say the administration of the Mughals as refined by the BEIC) was pretty much kept in place, to the point that very few of the bureaucrats in office before the rebellion lost their positions afterwards. The British government introduced greater oversight of Indian affairs via the Secretary of State for India in the cabinet and the creation of the viceroy to represent the crown in Calcutta, but day-to-day administration remained in the hand of the British officials in India and did not (and really could not) get placed under direct British administration in the way the English counties were administered.

This is why the direct control option is made the B-option, because it is not what in the end happened in India in wake of the 1857 Rebellion.

 

[OHgamer]

I mean why does UK inherit them all at once? I want to inherit them at steps so I won't get BB wars etc. And it's definatly not historical for UK to get them all that early by event.

Why is it not?

Think about it. Until you, the British player, decided to take full control over India from the BEIC, they have been your dutiful surrogates representing the interests of the Crown in the region, and regulation the relations between Britain and the various native states. Do not think of British India as a separate nation, but as a dominion or satellite (but with greater independence of action in foreign policy, as expressed in the Great Game in Central Asia, which was more directed from Calcutta than London). The native states are "technically" your satellites via their being satellites of British India, so if you impose direct control over India, you should still have the same relationship with the Indian minors as before but handled from Calcutta. the question therefore when the events come up is - do we keep the status quo and keep these states as satellites, or does our interest in India require we annex some/all of them?

 

[unmerged(8032)]

Are there any instances where the UK takeover event won't fire? I'm into 1859 and it still hasn't yet. I'm just wondering if I'm bugged. Thanks!

[Edit: Interestingly enough, I find that the Divident Payment mesage has changed to reflect that the crown has taken over, but the event choice never actually fired. Any ideas?]

 

[OHgamer]

Are there any instances where the UK takeover event won't fire? I'm into 1859 and it still hasn't yet. I'm just wondering if I'm bugged. Thanks!

[Edit: Interestingly enough, I find that the Divident Payment mesage has changed to reflect that the crown has taken over, but the event choice never actually fired. Any ideas?]

Hmm did india have the 'rebellion in meerut" event. If not, then it did not have the 1857 Revolt and therefore no reason to bring up whether closer supervision from London in wake of the revolt is needed. So if you get to I think 1861 and it hasn't happened, it likely won't.

As for the change in event name, I suppose we could create another 300 events for the (non-historical) result that there is no revolt, but methinks it is a slightly minor point.

 

[unmerged(8032)]

Hmm did india have the 'rebellion in meerut" event. If not, then it did not have the 1857 Revolt and therefore no reason to bring up whether closer supervision from London in wake of the revolt is needed. So if you get to I think 1861 and it hasn't happened, it likely won't.

As for the change in event name, I suppose we could create another 300 events for the (non-historical) result that there is no revolt, but methinks it is a slightly minor point.

Yah, sorry, should've mentioned that. The Rebellion event did fire and India stomped it out, but then the "Crown Takeover" event never followed. I'm still in 1859, so if I get 1861 and it hasn't, I'll let you know.

 

[OHgamer]

Yah, sorry, should've mentioned that. The Rebellion event did fire and India stomped it out, but then the "Crown Takeover" event never followed. I'm still in 1859, so if I get 1861 and it hasn't, I'll let you know.

Actually checking it takes more than Meerut - they have to have the spread of rebellion event as well - which means losing control of Delhi to the Meerut revolt. If they crush it before Delhi falls, all the other events for the 1857 Mutiny will not fire, so you will not get the Crown Rule event. Basically if IND nips it in the bud, then all must be OK with its admin, and it doesn't lose control.

 

[unmerged(8032)]

Actually checking it takes more than Meerut - they have to have the spread of rebellion event as well - which means losing control of Delhi to the Meerut revolt. If they crush it before Delhi falls, all the other events for the 1857 Mutiny will not fire, so you will not get the Crown Rule event. Basically if IND nips it in the bud, then all must be OK with its admin, and it doesn't lose control.

Ah, that would explain it then. They squashed it fast.

 

[OHgamer]

Well, I've still got the problem.

I started the game again, and this time British India lost Delhi and the Mughal Empire was restored. BI quashed it and reannexed it and the event for Britain to take over still did not fire and suddenly the narrative for the payments changed as if it had. It's 1858 now.

I'll have to look at the chains. the event does not fire until October 1858 though.

 

[unmerged(8032)]

I'll have to look at the chains. the event does not fire until October 1858 though.

Damn, I deleted it too late. It just fired. In October.

 

[OHgamer]

bump

 

[tyrel68]

I missed a Flag, when I got Mughalistan, I had a Flagchange from Punjabflag to another greenish one (guess thats the Mughal one), but this flag disappeard after the change to Mughalistan.

short review:
Annexed the Free States except Kalat
Fought against the BI Satellites that are relevant to become Mughalistan, one after the other and made them my Satellites....
5 years later I annexed them
Persia dowed -> Satellite
ca. 1853 (already UK, fighting against USA, Eire, no BI anymore, 75% War Exhaustion)

Annexed Kalat, got the Road to Mughal Event. Capital Lahore, UK dowed, Took Dheli, some time later I got the Mughalistan Event (Hyderabad and Mysore refused), could hold a line from Dheli to Berodha, Russia offered an Alliance I accept, so I'm in a normal and colonial war against UK .

Uk accepted peace, at 95% War Exhaustion.
Russia civilizes and satellites me, I dow them... (Bad idea because I found out that I had 100% War Exhaustion)
Russia was occupied with the British and I had to kill off Rebels (the UK too hehe)
After a while 1858 Russia offered a white Peace
I had 2 Bankrupticies too...
1845 and 1859
So now I have 1860 the lowest Prestige -900, but I'm alive and soon kicking...

There are 2 known bugs that the flemish duck found

1) You need to copy and rename the MUG.bmp to MUGUnified.bmp to fix the no flag issue
2) The Mughalistan formed event is slightly bugged so if it doesn't fire then just remove the triggers and fiore manually for now.