Viceroy Changed Succession?

[riemannh]

I've searched for a similar problem but not found one. I apologize in advance if I missed it.


This is a mechanics question (how did this happen/is it a glitch) and how should I "fairly" continue playing?

I passed a viceroy kingdom to a vassal duke but soon after died (unexpectedly). My successor 0-year-old was quickly smothered in his crib. The next successor had somehow lost his position in the line of succession in the viceroyalty (which I only noticed when the kingdom was passed to my viceroy’s daughter in a-c primogeniture succession).

I didn’t think this could happen… Shouldn’t I still have gotten the kingdom back? Also, every succession law in my realm had been previously switched to a-c ultimogeniture, but somehow my viceroyalty had been switched to a-c primo. First, I’m wondering if this is a reasonable outcome or some kind of glitch.

Second, I played on until I became an adult and imprisoned/revoked the (formerly) viceroy kingdom, but I’m still pissed about the succession law change (particularly since my regent dropped crown authority from high to low, making a change back a little more difficult). If the above viceroyalty succession crap was a glitch, then should I cheat to reset the succession law? (Obviously, this is an opinion question.) For now, I’ve played on a bit thinking, “I’ll pretend that my viceroy just pocketed the title during the regency and made the kingdom his, regardless of what actually happened.”


As a couple of asides:
- I pushed my **** regent/spymaster off a balcony shortly after the second CA change, which made it a little better. Though I still can’t change a CL until I die, and my current king is a young bad*** stats-wise.
- Part of the reason I want to cheat to “fix” the succession law change is now I have a primo (-5) kingdom under an ultimo (-5) empire which gives me a bit of extra pain in the vassal opinion.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

I've searched for a similar problem but not found one. I apologize in advance if I missed it.


This is a mechanics question (how did this happen/is it a glitch) and how should I "fairly" continue playing?

I passed a viceroy kingdom to a vassal duke but soon after died (unexpectedly). My successor 0-year-old was quickly smothered in his crib. The next successor had somehow lost his position in the line of succession in the viceroyalty (which I only noticed when the kingdom was passed to my viceroy’s daughter in a-c primogeniture succession).

I didn’t think this could happen… Shouldn’t I still have gotten the kingdom back? Also, every succession law in my realm had been previously switched to a-c ultimogeniture, but somehow my viceroyalty had been switched to a-c primo. First, I’m wondering if this is a reasonable outcome or some kind of glitch.

Second, I played on until I became an adult and imprisoned/revoked the (formerly) viceroy kingdom, but I’m still pissed about the succession law change (particularly since my regent dropped crown authority from high to low, making a change back a little more difficult). If the above viceroyalty succession crap was a glitch, then should I cheat to reset the succession law? (Obviously, this is an opinion question.) For now, I’ve played on a bit thinking, “I’ll pretend that my viceroy just pocketed the title during the regency and made the kingdom his, regardless of what actually happened.”


As a couple of asides:
- I pushed my **** regent/spymaster off a balcony shortly after the second CA change, which made it a little better. Though I still can’t change a CL until I die, and my current king is a young bad*** stats-wise.
- Part of the reason I want to cheat to “fix” the succession law change is now I have a primo (-5) kingdom under an ultimo (-5) empire which gives me a bit of extra pain in the vassal opinion.

Was the viceroyalty ever usurped? There's a "history" tab in the title screen, you can check each succession of the title there. It appears that usurpation of viceroyalties cause them to default to a-c primo.

 

[riemannh]

I just checked... it doesn't look like it was ever usurped. The history reads:
Granted
Inherited
[Angrily] Revoked

 

[heliostellar]

I don't think it matters, since it's still a viceroyalty. What is annoying to me is that a viceroy's vassals are able to usurp it, which is ridiculous for an appointed position.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

I just checked... it doesn't look like it was ever usurped. The history reads:
Granted
Inherited
[Angrily] Revoked

Don't know why it happened then. I don't think vassals in a viceroyalty can plot to change succession.

I don't think it matters, since it's still a viceroyalty. What is annoying to me is that a viceroy's vassals are able to usurp it, which is ridiculous for an appointed position.

Viceroyalty is a succession method, so being A-C Primo means that it's no longer a viceroyalty.
And from the observations in my game, the problem appears to be that revoking a theme grants a inheritable strong claim when it really shouldn't be inheritable.

 

[heliostellar]

Viceroyalty is a succession method, so being A-C Primo means that it's no longer a viceroyalty.
And from the observations in my game, the problem appears to be that revoking a theme grants a inheritable strong claim when it really shouldn't be inheritable.

Is this a Conclave or post 2.5 issue? I've never seen that happen before that the AI can convert a viceroyalty into a hereditary title.

 

[SchwarzKatze]

Is this a Conclave or post 2.5 issue? I've never seen that happen before that the AI can convert a viceroyalty into a hereditary title.

I think viceroyalties can be usurped since its inception provided there's a proper claim, but I don't know what's going on in OP's game; I've not seen anything like that either.

 

[heliostellar]

I think viceroyalties can be usurped since its inception provided there's a proper claim, but I don't know what's going on in OP's game; I've not seen anything like that either.

Yes, usurping has always been able to happen, but the changing of a succession law to allow converting it from a viceroyalty to a hereditary title is something I've never seen before.

 

[LumberKing]

Titles are only a viceroyal title if it is granted as such. Since you held it yourself before being murdered thus re-granting it as a viceroyalty, it got passed on as a feudal title.

 

[riemannh]

LumberKing, I don't follow. I held the kingdom (as an emperor) and granted the viceroyalty to a duke. I died, I died again, the duke (viceroy) died and passed the title to his daughter. I didn't hold the title ever after I granted the viceroyalty (until I reclaimed it violently, anyway). I think I'm misunderstanding your explanation.

 

[LumberKing]

LumberKing, I don't follow. I held the kingdom (as an emperor) and granted the viceroyalty to a duke. I died, I died again, the duke (viceroy) died and passed the title to his daughter. I didn't hold the title ever after I granted the viceroyalty (until I reclaimed it violently, anyway). I think I'm misunderstanding your explanation.

Ah, I think I misread your post. In the history section after you granted the title, was there a time when a ruler lost his title after a forced abdication due to losing a tyranny war (revokes his vassal's titles, his vassal refuses)? It could be possible that he lost the title then, but shows up in the history section as being inherited by a new successor. Regardless, it would still be a bug since Viceroyalties should always return to the person who granted the title. Screenshot if possible?

 

[La Es]

At my current game half of given viceroyalties were changed from primo to elective via faction demands/civil wars. Besides, almost every viceroy loses their title in 2-5 years somehow and I amusingly notice that there is another vassal being viceroy. And history tab says nothing useful about it.