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Situation:Well I was sitting playing HoI as the Soviet union, it is 1946 and I'm helping my chineese comrates to clear out the japanese. To do this and secure as much VP's as posible for the Coministern I do a great pincer manuover, firstly to shut the japanese froces in and to keep the allies from getting the provinces.
Problem: Suddenly I get a "Enemy in Sigth" message saying that province has fallen (without any figthing) to nationalist china, whom I'M NOT AT WAR WITH. At first it seemd to me that they had troop movements through initiated befor I captured the province so I loaded the autosave and replayed that monht and then i happens in another province. Is this an AI cheat or just a bug? Any way, how do I solve the problem?
 
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It's not a bug and the only thing that you can do is to also DoW Nationalist China. It is, after all, their province. The Japanese took it and controlled it, but Nationalist China still owns it. Control versus owning is a very big distinction.

You have inadvertently liberated that province for Nationalist China. The same type of thing can occur in Western Europe when the Soviet Union overruns Germany. In order to annex Germany, you have to take all the Victory Point provinces that they control including Amsterdam, Antwerp, Paris, etc. While the SU is doing that, however, those countries or their allies can march in and reclaim their province. The only way for the SU to avoid that is to DoW the Allies.
 

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Still I think that you should have some claim on the province for its winning and defence untill the owner takes it back, like that you have military access to that province even though you don't have military access through the rest the owners teritory, or that you may send supplies through it so that your units that is dependent on the province to get their supplies so they doesn't get out of supplies.
 

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In game terms a neutral is a neutral. He doesn't care what the problems between Japan and the SU are. He owns the province. Germany or Japan just control the province.

That's about the only way that the game can handle three sided instead of two sided situations: something's got to give. The game can only simulate so much. And you have a solution: DoW the neutral before you start fighting in provinces that they own.

Military access is too often abused in the game already and I would not want to add any more to it. I personally would like to see military access abolished entirely except for historic events such as Portugal giving the Allies naval base access in the Azores. Even that was more limited than what the game gives: military access to all provinces that a country has, something that a neutral country never granted in WW2. Who after all wants an army marching thru their territory enroute to fight a third country? And why wouldn't the third country demand that this stop immediately or that there will be severe consequences.

Less military access, not more.
 

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john heidle said:
military access to all provinces that a country has, something that a neutral country never granted in WW2.
Egypt was independent and neutral but was reluctantly forced to allow military access by the British. Persia and Iraq were similar. The problem in the game is that it is too easy to get access to countries that would have resisted it more effectively, such as Switzerland.

Andrew
 

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Colonel Warden said:
Egypt was independent and neutral but was reluctantly forced to allow military access by the British. Persia and Iraq were similar. The problem in the game is that it is too easy to get access to countries that would have resisted it more effectively, such as Switzerland.

Andrew

Or Germany getting Military Access through Turkey, to attack the Middle East; it is trivial. Or harrassing the SU from neutral Finland; the AI ignores the German units in Finland until they cross the border into the SU.

The AI doesn't know how to handle defending against Military Access. Hopefully there will be major changes in Military Access in HOI2, but I doubt it.
 

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john heidle said:
military access to all provinces that a country has, something that a neutral country never granted in WW2. Who after all wants an army marching thru their territory enroute to fight a third country?

I'm 100% sure that sweden granted germany military access and they where neutral.
 

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Are you sure?

Sweden had a trade arrangement with Germany but I don't think that German troops crossed over say from Norway to Finland. Anyways nothing militarily significant happened as far as I know: Germany could not keep Finland safe from the Red Army.

Re Iraq and Iran and Egypt: Egypt was more or less a puppet of the UK due to the Suez Canal and Iraq was basically a puppet too. Persia/Iran was pressured by both the Allies and the Soviets to grant access. I don't know how much that access was actually used. That pressure on Persia seemed to be more of a ' we might need this later ' thing if convoys elsewhere were failing.

The problem is that what happened historically in WW2 does not match what the game engine permits: using neutral territory to attack another country which is what you often see advocated in the general forum. And military access is granted way too much and way too easily. The game engine can't simulate this very well. No matter how military access is understood historically, what the game permits is overkill to an extreme degree. Something that was historically very limited and didn't result in large military operations can be used as a major way to fight wars and that is what I object to.

Military access in the game is basically an exploit of the game engine. It would be better to not have it in the game at all than have it as it currently stands as most often players just use it as an exploit to get around having to do things conventionally.
 

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Sweden allowed german troops to move to and from Norway and in one case to Finland.

Source: L L Snyder, The War. A Concise History 1939-1945.
 

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German transit through Sweden.

Hi :cool: During ww2 Sweden allowed over 2.000.000 german soldiers and 100.000 vagonloads of warmaterial to pass through Sweden on the way to and from Norway and Finland. Only 15.000 of these soldiers were carrying weapons ( the transit of the Engelbrecht division in June 1941 from Norway to Finland.)The remaining soldiers were on leave. This was agreed upon since the german foreign minister Ribbentrop had threatened that a refusal would be considered an "immediate act of unkindness". :eek:
Source: 1900-talet, Vår tids historia ,band 13 , "Midsommarkrisen och transiteringarna" (20th century, The history of our time, volume 13, "The midsummercrisis and the transits"
 

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I have to say I agree with Bavern. Other than planes getting stuck in my certain terretories or over the ocean, this province loss is the only bug I've experienced in 1.06c. I actually came to this forum to report it only to see this post.

While John's explaination makes sense, if it is intended instead of being a bug (which I still think it is because a) they only do it for a few of their provinces, not all of them and b) I don't think human players are able to use this tactic), I can't agree with it being allowed in the game. Simply put, Stalin would never have let Allied troops come in and reclaim lost territory so easily. Playing as the USSR, I've had both the UK and the Netherlands take land from me. At first I thought the units had already been moving into the province, but tested that idea and found it wasn't the case. Then I figured I perhaps needed to garrison the province, but had no luck. Honestly, would the Netherlands have even thought about risking war with the USSR to reclaim a lost province? Would they send one division into a province overrun with vastly superior Russias? I don't think any country would have risked conflict that way, especially the smaller ones against a country as amazingly strong as the USSR can become in the game.

I personally hope this will be fixed if it wasn't intended by the designers. Thanks!