Right now, if I am the King of Abyssnia, and the Sultan of Egypt attacks me in a holy war for Semien, I'll get a bonus modifier from all my vassals: +40 opinion for defending against infidels. Should I win, the Duke of Semien will still be safe as my vassal. But should I lose, he will be roaming the streets as a homeless beggar. This is not a matter of him becoming another man's vassal; no, he will be stripped off everything. As a player, I can offer to join my liege's war. But the AI isn't doing this, ever. And to a degree the current system is good. Most of my vassals wouldn't care about the Duke of Semien. It's not their territory, so they don't really care all that much. But the Duke of Semien at least, shouldn't he join in on the defensive war, as it's his territory that's in danger?
This would slightly change the concept of warfare. If you attack the liege's vassal's territory, you may now face another army [Vassal] as well, making it 1v2 fight. Unless the Vassal also calls in his allies, dragging even more people into the war. As such, fighting the Liege for his Vassal's territory becomes much harder. Attacking the liege's territory, however, becomes the much safer bet, since his Vassals wouldn't really care. They would be happy if their liege gets weakened. Kind of like the current system.
In turn this opens up for building a realm with border "Marquises" surrounding you. No one can fight you for your Capital territories without first declaring war on your vassals, to open up direct contact. This further strengthens your early defense, since you will have more people on your side. Giving the Marquises an extremely important job, and a greater interaction between you and your vassals.
Imo, something more should be added to the "Border Marquis". It's an extremely important position after all. But that's for another topic and not what I wanted to address here. Feel free to comment about it as well though if you have any ideas.
As for my current suggestion, this doesn't necessarily have to be enforced as a base game mechanic that everybody must have enabled at all times. Just adding an option to toggle it on / off would be nice. Or some kind of law, obligating the Vassals to defend their own / each other's territories [check below].
Default: Vassals aren't joining their liege's battles.
Defensive only: Vassals are now more prone to join their liege's war in defense of their own territories . Can't join in if currently in a war of their own.
Always: All Vassals are now more inclined to join in on their liege's defensive wars, unless they have a low opinion of either the liege or the one currently under attack. Also doesn't join in against holy wars of their own religion. If their liege is Miaphysite, they themselves are Sunni, and the attacker is also Sunni, they won't defend against a Sunni liberation. Instead, this could open up a possibility to [betray] and join the attacker in war for independence. Can't join in if currently in a war of their own.
Edit:
1. Note the Vassals joining in is limited to the times where they stand to lose something. If it's a dejure-war where they will just become another man's vassal, they won't really care.
2. Another possible option would be to create a "hostile" modifier when sieging a Vassal's territory. If you think about it; your Vassal who has nothing to do with the war at all, loses his forts, is looted of taxes, his silk road provinces might take damage and efficiency cut in half, and his territory has generally been rampaged through by hostile forces who know what they did. The vassal is obviously not happy about their presence. As such this isn't something he should just watch the attacker do. In this scenario it doesn't matter if it's an offensive or a defensive war. If you as the liege attacked someone else, and they retaliated by attacking your vassal instead of you, then even in such offensive wars, your vassal should respond appropriately. The attacker [enemy] could have attacked someone else for warscore, so why his [the Vassal's] territory? This mechanic would make Vassals-under-attack offer to join their liege no matter the type of war. If it's an offensive war though [Liege attacked someone, but that someone attacked the Vassal in turn, not the liege], the Vassal will get an opinion modifier against their liege [dragged me into this conflict, -20 for 2 years]. In this kind of warfare, you'd have to be way more careful who you attempt to siege down. And this goes both ways. You'd have to look at the owner of each county / duchy [strengthening the role of Dukes] that you decide to attack and then plan ahead. Marching through a county won't trigger war though, only if you siege down 1 layer of fort or more. As the game might accidentally start to siege like 10% before you move them away. To further strengthen the role of Border Marquises, they could be made exempt from opinion penalties. As a border county, they know they will be dragged into warfare, and is thus used to it. The ones annoyed by being dragged into the conflict are those safely within the realm, who aren't normally used being a target of war. But remember: Only in offensive wars. No opinion penalties at all in defensive ones. This could also be coded as an option in the game to be toggled on / off.
This would slightly change the concept of warfare. If you attack the liege's vassal's territory, you may now face another army [Vassal] as well, making it 1v2 fight. Unless the Vassal also calls in his allies, dragging even more people into the war. As such, fighting the Liege for his Vassal's territory becomes much harder. Attacking the liege's territory, however, becomes the much safer bet, since his Vassals wouldn't really care. They would be happy if their liege gets weakened. Kind of like the current system.
In turn this opens up for building a realm with border "Marquises" surrounding you. No one can fight you for your Capital territories without first declaring war on your vassals, to open up direct contact. This further strengthens your early defense, since you will have more people on your side. Giving the Marquises an extremely important job, and a greater interaction between you and your vassals.
Imo, something more should be added to the "Border Marquis". It's an extremely important position after all. But that's for another topic and not what I wanted to address here. Feel free to comment about it as well though if you have any ideas.
As for my current suggestion, this doesn't necessarily have to be enforced as a base game mechanic that everybody must have enabled at all times. Just adding an option to toggle it on / off would be nice. Or some kind of law, obligating the Vassals to defend their own / each other's territories [check below].
Default: Vassals aren't joining their liege's battles.
Defensive only: Vassals are now more prone to join their liege's war in defense of their own territories . Can't join in if currently in a war of their own.
Always: All Vassals are now more inclined to join in on their liege's defensive wars, unless they have a low opinion of either the liege or the one currently under attack. Also doesn't join in against holy wars of their own religion. If their liege is Miaphysite, they themselves are Sunni, and the attacker is also Sunni, they won't defend against a Sunni liberation. Instead, this could open up a possibility to [betray] and join the attacker in war for independence. Can't join in if currently in a war of their own.
Edit:
1. Note the Vassals joining in is limited to the times where they stand to lose something. If it's a dejure-war where they will just become another man's vassal, they won't really care.
2. Another possible option would be to create a "hostile" modifier when sieging a Vassal's territory. If you think about it; your Vassal who has nothing to do with the war at all, loses his forts, is looted of taxes, his silk road provinces might take damage and efficiency cut in half, and his territory has generally been rampaged through by hostile forces who know what they did. The vassal is obviously not happy about their presence. As such this isn't something he should just watch the attacker do. In this scenario it doesn't matter if it's an offensive or a defensive war. If you as the liege attacked someone else, and they retaliated by attacking your vassal instead of you, then even in such offensive wars, your vassal should respond appropriately. The attacker [enemy] could have attacked someone else for warscore, so why his [the Vassal's] territory? This mechanic would make Vassals-under-attack offer to join their liege no matter the type of war. If it's an offensive war though [Liege attacked someone, but that someone attacked the Vassal in turn, not the liege], the Vassal will get an opinion modifier against their liege [dragged me into this conflict, -20 for 2 years]. In this kind of warfare, you'd have to be way more careful who you attempt to siege down. And this goes both ways. You'd have to look at the owner of each county / duchy [strengthening the role of Dukes] that you decide to attack and then plan ahead. Marching through a county won't trigger war though, only if you siege down 1 layer of fort or more. As the game might accidentally start to siege like 10% before you move them away. To further strengthen the role of Border Marquises, they could be made exempt from opinion penalties. As a border county, they know they will be dragged into warfare, and is thus used to it. The ones annoyed by being dragged into the conflict are those safely within the realm, who aren't normally used being a target of war. But remember: Only in offensive wars. No opinion penalties at all in defensive ones. This could also be coded as an option in the game to be toggled on / off.
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