Vassal -stab spirals.

[josh127]

What's worse, they don't accept loans no matter what. I have this huge pile of cash I am willing to dole out to my subjects in case they need it, but no, they'll refuse loans even if their debt is so huge it will take them decades of trying to get back on their feet. They just don't accept them and all I can do is grant that cash to them for free.

I have never seen AI accept loans from me, ever, vassal or not.

If you're trying to support your subjects with money, use Give Subsidies. Jack the amount of time up as high as possible (you can always cancel it) and give them whatever you want. Subsidies seem to work better than lump sums (gifts or loans even if you could do them) because they impact the subject's income, and higher income will open more options for budgeting for them. Of course, if you do have intentions of dropping it, be careful because you could get them to buy armies just to delete them again.

 

[Wizzington]

If you're trying to support your subjects with money, use Give Subsidies. Jack the amount of time up as high as possible (you can always cancel it) and give them whatever you want. Subsidies seem to work better than lump sums (gifts or loans even if you could do them) because they impact the subject's income, and higher income will open more options for budgeting for them. Of course, if you do have intentions of dropping it, be careful because you could get them to buy armies just to delete them again.

Use gifts if you want them to build buildings or repay loans.

Use subsidies if you want them to maintain larger armies/fleets/more forts.

Something I occasionally like to do at the end of a blobbing campaign is pick a random minor state, give them 200g/month and watch what they do with it.

 

[gothos]

Use gifts if you want them to build buildings or repay loans.

Use subsidies if you want them to maintain larger armies/fleets/more forts.

Something I occasionally like to do at the end of a blobbing campaign is pick a random minor state, give them 200g/month and watch what they do with it.

Do you think we could have something like anti-scuttage, ie. don't touch their money but still get FL from them and make them join wars while still being possible to integrate?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Do you think we could have something like anti-scuttage, ie. don't touch their money but still get FL from them and make them join wars while still being possible to integrate?

You really can just give them subsidies for that, equal to whatever they're paying you. Also, throwing money at the problem I describe in the OP isn't going to solve it, as I've seen it manifest in client states this patch also where I'm giving them 30-50 ducats/month and they have impressive armies. Since they client states were given humanist and admin efficiency drops coring costs though they're sturdier. Of course, since they have positive tolerance they also refuse to convert anything religiously, ever, but it's better than them breaking.

 

[josh127]

Use gifts if you want them to build buildings or repay loans.

Use subsidies if you want them to maintain larger armies/fleets/more forts.

Something I occasionally like to do at the end of a blobbing campaign is pick a random minor state, give them 200g/month and watch what they do with it.

Good to know on gifts. I didn't think about the repay loans bit, but I do use them that way, don't really think about the buildings (which if for a subject is nice since you'll get them. Of course, you're stuck with what you get, but at that point you probably don't care).

I've done similar late game, it makes for a fun little side show!

 

[Andredie45]

What's worse, they don't accept loans no matter what. I have this huge pile of cash I am willing to dole out to my subjects in case they need it, but no, they'll refuse loans even if their debt is so huge it will take them decades of trying to get back on their feet. They just don't accept them and all I can do is grant that cash to them for free.

I have never seen AI accept loans from me, ever, vassal or not.

Just send a gift?

 

[Will Steel]

Well, as I have already said, gifting and subsidizing are the only options left so these are the ones I am using already.