Valhalla or victory

[Titan79]

As far as we do know, how does exactly VoV function now? I just can't find where I've read about it the first time but I don't remember the devs giving so many details about it, so maybe it's already a bit more complex than a simple "fight to the death" without any specific penalties. Of course I can be wrong, though

 

[naq29]

I think it should be a kind of special abilities rather than a normal ability. As I said, those events are very rare in history.

 

[naq29]

Another option could be that units using VoV are treated like garrisons which means they are eliminated after being defeated.

How can they be defeated if they still keep fighting with zero org?

 

[Misantropia]

I propose an oposite to the VoV... CoD (cake or death, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNjcuZ-LiSY) wich would mean that units would orderly reatreat as soon as they engage

 

[naq29]

So should there be some options like air and navy missions? For example: setting for the maximum org or strength that the unit continues the battle.

 

[strits1945]

So should there be some options like air and navy missions? For example: setting for the maximum org or strength that the unit continues the battle.

-a little bit off topic
-Hey naq29, are you from VN?

 

[Goldor2005]

as far as we do know, how does exactly vov function now? I just can't find where i've read about it the first time but i don't remember the devs giving so many details about it, so maybe it's already a bit more complex than a simple "fight to the death" without any specific penalties. Of course i can be wrong, though

+1

 

[HarkovAdm]

excuse me but what exactly IS VoV? I've never heard of it before. Is it a cheat code? A proposed unit ability in AoD?

 

[unmerged(17117)]

excuse me but what exactly IS VoV? I've never heard of it before. Is it a cheat code? A proposed unit ability in AoD?

VoV is an ability you can use for a unit or group of units that will force them to keep fighting even after they run out of org.

 

[Talar]

Then you might use it as a battle event in cases of encirclement, depending on doctrines, leader trait ("defense" makes it more likely to occur), etc.

I don't know how VoV works now, but making it a battle event rather than a click-option sounds like it could be a good idea.

 

[hansnery]

Sounds good, but there are already the delay battle event, but i still think the name could be changed.

 

[unmerged(45180)]

Personally I like the idea of VoV; I just think that there should be some expenses associated to it. Many, many times it does not matter if you lose your unit (or 99% of its strenght) if you just manage to keep the territory. If using VoV is 'free' then there is no reason for an exploiting player to use it all the time to keep what he has gained by gamey tactics. Paratroopers fighting to death come to mind, as do troops which have landed and taken strategic targets like Leningrad, and who by fighting to death keep the territory until relieved. I really do not believe that attacking forces (even when momentarily on defence) would fight to the last man.

One solution to VoV would be to allow it's use only on owned core provinces, but even that would not solve the problems that can arise when your border to enemy is 10 provinces wide with 10 divs in each. You concentrate your forces so that there is 1 div in 9 provinces and the rest in the breakthrough province, who advance while the rest 9 fight to the death...:wacko:

 

[superflo]

I think it's better if there is no "Valhalla or victory" anymore. Fights to the last man occurred extremely rarely in history, and they happened only when the unit was encircled.

I don't know what you mean with "extremely rare" but it tended to be the case very often in the Pacific theater, especially towards the end of the war. I think the Allies didn't even took more than 10,000 Japanese prisoners during the whole war.

 

[tedescooo]

I don't know what you mean with "extremely rare" but it tended to be the case very often in the Pacific theater, especially towards the end of the war. I think the Allies didn't even took more than 10,000 Japanese prisoners during the whole war.

A good way to simulate is with the national ideas changing the effects of VoV.

 

[naq29]

I don't know what you mean with "extremely rare" but it tended to be the case very often in the Pacific theater, especially towards the end of the war. I think the Allies didn't even took more than 10,000 Japanese prisoners during the whole war.

There is no way for you to retreat if you are trapped in an island.

 

[Blecky]

I don't know what you mean with "extremely rare" but it tended to be the case very often in the Pacific theater, especially towards the end of the war. I think the Allies didn't even took more than 10,000 Japanese prisoners during the whole war.

I don´t think the war in the Pacific is a good example for VoV. When the US attacked (fairly small) islands there was almost nowhere to retreat to; so it came down to the choice of surrender (totally inacceptable to the Japanese) or death. On Okinawa the Japanese retreated from the coast and delayed the US troops whereever possible (very few Banzai-attacks). But once the Japanese main islands would have been attacked VoV probably had been their choice.

 

[superflo]

I know. There is no difference between dying and surrendering. I wish there was a POW system included in AoD, it would be fitting added to the statistics. They would slowly die and if liberated, would add the manpower to the original nation.

 

[tedescooo]

I know. There is no difference between dying and surrendering. I wish there was a POW system included in AoD, it would be fitting added to the statistics. They would slowly die and if liberated, would add the manpower to the original nation.

POW are against Paradox rules.

 

[von Rosen]

Well, POW camps and treatment of POWs are not to be discussed but an abstracted mechanic for return of POWS after cessation of hostilities could probably be discussed.

 

[naq29]

Well, POW camps and treatment of POWs are not to be discussed but an abstracted mechanic for return of POWS after cessation of hostilities could probably be discussed.

Can we consider "returning" and "not returning" as some kinds of treatment?