USA 1947, liberate Indonesia or Sarawak too?

[Commander666]

I am not concerned about the double dissent hit to also liberate Sarawak - only what will produce the greatest amount of puppet armies: A bigger Indonesia or a smaller Indonesia with a separate Sarawak puppet, please?

The Axis have 1000+ divisions (including 94 ARM just for Germany). The Canadians have 16 divisions, the UK 2 ARM, and the USA a total of 98 divisions (includes 18 ARM). While I now rule the seas, I definitely don't rule the air space over Europe, and - frankly - doubt there is a country in the Euro-Asia land mass I would be brave enough to even step ashore. I am chopping bits off the Axis... but only where they can't come back at me because there is a protective moat. This is going to be tough to win!

 

[stevep]

Not played at that sort of level before so probably a stupid idea but could you hit somewhere, say in west or south Africa, where you should have good supply but hopefully their logistics are seriously overstretched and you can inflict very heavy casualties on them. Still take a hell of a time to wear them down but if the AI is stupid enough to pump in more and more forces rather than just pull back a bit if would help.

Alternatively can you do anything by espionage to subvert some powerful puppets? There must be some pretty large ones, unless Germany is holding large areas as subject populations which would seriously affect their TC.

The other option is nukes. One of the big weaknesses in the game as I understand it is while a nuclear strike will seriously and pretty much permanently trash a province if that's a capital it stays there, with disastrous impacts on supply and support rather than letting you, or the AI, move to an alternative location. Of course, with a Germany of that size and by this date they might well be able to retaliate in kind.

In answer to your original question afraid I have no idea. Gut feeling is that the larger state will have greater manpower and resources and be able to research faster but could be wrong.

 

[Commander666]

could you hit somewhere, say in west or south Africa, where you should have good supply but hopefully their logistics are seriously overstretched and you can inflict very heavy casualties on them.

Yes, I can see me easily sweeping across all of Africa and even reaching Suez. Problem is just dropping off guard units along all the Med shores means I got quite a small army once I enter Iraq. The alternative is to do a masterful airborne landing on empty Gibraltar with immediate extraction to so be able to get my fleet thru - which can then protect the north Africa shore from enemy amphibs. I actually have the airbase at Lanzarote (Canary Islands) and long range TRA to accomplish that. But I keep thinking of 100 panzer divisions working their way around Turkey to eventually crush my meager forces which probably would reach Iraq. But at that point there is 100 Indian divisions to hit me in my flank. I can't even use the Canadians as they now guarding England since I pulled out my USA forces. Germany doing a massive airborne assault is a definite possibility.

Alternatively can you do anything by espionage to subvert some powerful puppets? There must be some pretty large ones, unless Germany is holding large areas as subject populations which would seriously affect their TC.

I wish I knew how. I can easily increase my spies in any country. But I don't know how to get a puppet to fold.

There certainly are some very huge puppets:
India 55 divisions with 1 spy but I remember it was at 100 when I flipped game,
China about 200.
Japan has 216 divisions as per my 7 spies (AND 48 top-of-line INT).
Germany has 544 INF, 94 ARM and 64 INT (as per my 30 spies that will be right on). And they building CVs in sets of 3 but I managing to sink these fast as they appear.

The other option is nukes. One of the big weaknesses in the game as I understand it is while a nuclear strike will seriously and pretty much permanently trash a province if that's a capital it stays there, with disastrous impacts on supply and support rather than letting you, or the AI, move to an alternative location. Of course, with a Germany of that size and by this date they might well be able to retaliate in kind.

I got level 5 nuclear reactor long ago, and have been funding nukes 100% since I got Waste bomb. Now I doing Fission bomb (the 3rd level) and it is at 60%.... but in all that time no nuke yet. But I can't increase reactor size until 1951 Basic Nuclear Power achieved. Now May 1947. I wanted to drop a nuke on Bermuda where there are 34 Axis divisions, but decided nukes are too scarce to use like that. Better let them starve but, in spite of the constant convoy hits (getting sometimes 5) they not out of supplies. Guess Germany, with 755 IC can easily replace the losses.

The Japs have barricaded the Hawaiian Islands and Wake, but I just ignore that. No threat as Japan has very few ships left. However, I getting some occasional indication those supply depots sometimes have no supplies, so maybe I can starve those units eventually.

I been doing serious "delay tech team" on Germany and they have not started any nuke bomb technology yet. I imagine they do have a level 5 reactor. But going by how long it is taking me with 100% funding to get the A-bomb, I guess Germany won't for next few years.

I was worried about them rocketing UK to smithereens, and they have ballistic missile now. So far not a single rocket fired... possibly they lack MP to blow it up like that. .

Earlier I did a major strategic bomber campaign that seriously hurt German MP. I knocked their IC back by 100 IC, but also noticed them starting to fly rather weak air stacks. But I stopped the campaign because it was costing me so much MP. Now I finally able to construct 3 ARM lines.

I just liberated Australia and moved the USA army to Philippines. Thinking of taking the Jap Home Islands as there the enemy can't hit back at me.


If I annexed Japan would his puppets of Manchuria and Nationalist China quit the war? If so, then I could probably annex India before the Wehrmacht could interfere. I really need to worry about China and India protecting each other... make a plan to get those 2 eliminated .

In answer to your original question afraid I have no idea. Gut feeling is that the larger state will have greater manpower and resources and be able to research faster but could be wrong.

I did both. Sarawak already built an INF so now Borneo is guarded and I can get back my unit there. Also it is now usable for free replenishment. Indonesia needs build too many INF to get its main islands all manned so they will then pump supplies/oil to them. In the long run, Indonesia can only be less by the amount of Sarawak... which Sarawak should compensate for. But you might be right.

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

To coup a country you need to

1) Flood it with spies (ideally 20+)
2) Then activate the increase dissent espionage mission (or whatever it is called)
3) Once that has triggered 4-5 times, you should then have a good chance of couping the nation
4) Once 'couped' the nation will become neutral - it will remain a puppet of Germany, but will not ally with them (or yourself)

But it sounds likes nukes are your best option.

 

[stevep]

Mr B

Interesting info. Never really been in a position to try it but might give it a go some time.

What does become neutral but remain a puppet mean please as it sounds a bit contradictory to be honest? Sounds like it will not fight alongside the [in this case] Germans, supply them with troops or allow passage of their forces? In which case what does puppet status involve? Also how easy or not would it be for Germany to regain control or would it have to invade and conquer it again?

Thanks

Steve

 

[stevep]

Yes, I can see me easily sweeping across all of Africa and even reaching Suez. Problem is just dropping off guard units along all the Med shores means I got quite a small army once I enter Iraq. The alternative is to do a masterful airborne landing on empty Gibraltar with immediate extraction to so be able to get my fleet thru - which can then protect the north Africa shore from enemy amphibs. I actually have the airbase at Lanzarote (Canary Islands) and long range TRA to accomplish that. But I keep thinking of 100 panzer divisions working their way around Turkey to eventually crush my meager forces which probably would reach Iraq. But at that point there is 100 Indian divisions to hit me in my flank. I can't even use the Canadians as they now guarding England since I pulled out my USA forces. Germany doing a massive airborne assault is a definite possibility.

Ah I was wondering if the AI would commit itself to fighting near where you landed, despite the huge disadvantages it would face and you could inflict highly disproportionation losses on it? Which would probably take a hell of a long time against this Germany but might at least tie up his manpower and help wear him down.

There certainly are some very huge puppets:
India 55 divisions with 1 spy but I remember it was at 100 when I flipped game,
China about 200.
Japan has 216 divisions as per my 7 spies (AND 48 top-of-line INT).
Germany has 544 INF, 94 ARM and 64 INT (as per my 30 spies that will be right on). And they building CVs in sets of 3 but I managing to sink these fast as they appear.

Some sizeable forces there. Never played the US but know it suffers manpower problems so you really need some big allies/puppets yourself.

I got level 5 nuclear reactor long ago, and have been funding nukes 100% since I got Waste bomb. Now I doing Fission bomb (the 3rd level) and it is at 60%.... but in all that time no nuke yet. But I can't increase reactor size until 1951 Basic Nuclear Power achieved. Now May 1947. I wanted to drop a nuke on Bermuda where there are 34 Axis divisions, but decided nukes are too scarce to use like that. Better let them starve but, in spite of the constant convoy hits (getting sometimes 5) they not out of supplies. Guess Germany, with 755 IC can easily replace the losses.

I could be wrong never having used them but I would be tempted to wait until your pretty sure of taking out Berlin and wherever their reactor is located. As I understand it, since the AI keeps devastated Berlin as the capital this really screws a lot of their activity as the infra is pretty much totally trashed so even in neighbouring provinces supply is crippled.

Sounds like the best option with Bermuda is as you say blockade and use it to consume German resources. If he keeps sending his navy into the mincer that would help keep it manageable.

I been doing serious "delay tech team" on Germany and they have not started any nuke bomb technology yet. I imagine they do have a level 5 reactor. But going by how long it is taking me with 100% funding to get the A-bomb, I guess Germany won't for next few years.

Hopefully not.

I was worried about them rocketing UK to smithereens, and they have ballistic missile now. So far not a single rocket fired... possibly they lack MP to blow it up like that. .

It might be the case with that many forces maintained, Especially if under your tutorage earlier they released a lot of puppets. Does rather surprise me as I would have though Britain would be an important target for them to deny it as both a base and powerful ally.

Earlier I did a major strategic bomber campaign that seriously hurt German MP. I knocked their IC back by 100 IC, but also noticed them starting to fly rather weak air stacks. But I stopped the campaign because it was costing me so much MP. Now I finally able to construct 3 ARM lines.

Again could easily be wrong but wonder if it would have been better continuing and building up your own army a bit more slowly. If you can keep them weak on resources and wear them down. But then that would take a long game without nukes and since their getting research for free as an AI time could be an issue.

I just liberated Australia and moved the USA army to Philippines. Thinking of taking the Jap Home Islands as there the enemy can't hit back at me.

That sounds like a good bet, although I would expect that, unless you can soften them up a lot it will be a tough fight. Could cost a lot but a Japanese puppet could probably provide some useful forces.

Although is the game set up with some rules about Korea counting as part of their core/homeland? Have a feeling that I heard something like that? In which case to get all their key provinces wouldn't you have to occupy parts of Korea and possibly also Taiwan.

If I annexed Japan would his puppets of Manchuria and Nationalist China quit the war?

If so, then I could probably annex India before the Wehrmacht could interfere. I really need to worry about China and India protecting each other... make a plan to get those 2 eliminated .

That's a good question but afraid I have no idea. If their puppets of Japan what happens when Japan goes down? Do they become German puppets, neutral or even puppets of yourself as inheritors of the Japanese empire.

I did both. Sarawak already built an INF so now Borneo is guarded and I can get back my unit there. Also it is now usable for free replenishment. Indonesia needs build too many INF to get its main islands all manned so they will then pump supplies/oil to them. In the long run, Indonesia can only be less by the amount of Sarawak... which Sarawak should compensate for. But you might be right.

What I was thinking was that Sarawak will have a pretty small manpower and IC. As such it will need to meet any construction and development costs from its own limited resources. To provide useful manpower its going to need decent Inf which even with blueprints will need resources to research. Similarly other projects such as agricultural ones to boost population growth. Also their likely to have a small and limited number of research teams. If their included in Indonesia then that can do the research once covering 'both' resource pools and they will probably have better teams.

Steve

 

[Commander666]

It might be the case with that many forces maintained, Especially if under your tutorage earlier they released a lot of puppets.

Checking, I note that Germany has not released any of its 17 puppets. But I now realize the reason Germany has 540 INF is because their puppets have expeditioned many units. For instance, before I flipped game, I know India had ~100 divisions, but count by 9 spies now says India has only 37 INF. If we assume that means only 37 in India itself (the expeditioned ones elsewhere) that makes India a viable "first continental target" as my MECH with H Arm brigade can blockade Karachi from any panzer counterattack and my Armor can easily annex India before the Chinese horde can cross the Himalayas. I do have a couple PARA to shorten taking the mountainous Indian provinces.

Does rather surprise me as I would have though Britain would be an important target for them to deny it as both a base and powerful ally.

I wish I knew if it indeed was my past strategic campaign that created Germany's assumed low MP to result in no ballistic missiles fired.

Again could easily be wrong but wonder if it would have been better continuing and building up your own army a bit more slowly.

Well, at only 4 lines ARM possible, building up my army significantly is a very long endeavor. I have 19 ARM division now, which is still the same 18 as before on the front line because the single one is waiting for 2 buddies to be constructed. I am losing much MP to vitally needed bases and navy. But because I upgraded my ARM in production, I had a spell of no new divisions for a few months and my MP now 128 and climbing +1.07 daily (net after ageing reduction). That means I can construct 2 ARM divisions every month. So 4 lines is correct #.

But the real question is how to best use the huge recent increase in MP stockpile - which doubled last 2 months? Lay down a couple more ARM lines.... or do a new strategic campaign?

On the bright side, I just completed upgrading of all FTR/Improved Turbojet-1947 and FTR/ESC-same attached to my recently upgraded STR-Turbojet 1945. It is August 1947. This is a window of opportunity to hit the enemy industry while I am at my strongest. I have in England 24 STR-4 wings and 32 FTR-5 Next upgrade is the STR-Improved Turbojet 1949. But with the RAF's 29 wings there it has meant many new bases at 1 MP each. Just to do the strategic campaign I must fly out most of the RAF first to give me proper space.

I can again reduce German IC by 100 - which could be critical if the MP losses the Luftwaffe will suffer while defending from my onslaught results in no ballistic missiles being fired for next year. But - for sure - I will also suffer huge MP loss which will upset the rather orderly progression now established to greater ARM lines constructing. The idea would be to again do another strategic campaign once the STR upgrade to next level, and another once the FTR and ESC/FTR upgrade to Supersonic-1951. So, maybe one campaign per year - done for a month to wreck the Luftwaffe, deplete MP and knock back Germany's IC by 100 while giving massive repair bill is the prescription to avoid Britain getting devastated by missiles?

, unless you can soften them up a lot it will be a tough fight. Could cost a lot but a Japanese puppet could probably provide some useful forces.

Unfortunately Japan can not be softened up by strategic attack unless wishing to accept huge MP losses. They have 48 wings of the most modern (and undamaged) rocket interceptors, and an abundance of home bases. No, I think this is a job for Patton to accomplish with out air support. Heck, he's got MacArthur and Bradley and 9 marine divisions (and the whole US army) to help....attacking from several directions.

I strongly believe the next conquest must be Taiwan, then Okinawa, then hit the home islands from north and south. It is vital to rid myself of the important enemy islands before tackling anywhere on the mainland

Although is the game set up with some rules about Korea counting as part of their core/homeland? In which case to get all their key provinces wouldn't you have to occupy parts of Korea and possibly also Taiwan.

True. Worse is they have VCs in China that must be taken to annex Japan. It will take clever strategy to get in there to get those with armor and retreat out when 100 Chinese inf appear. But the Chinese will claim those Jap VCs for themselves - so accomplishing the aim of getting Japan's last VC to be able to annex. That way I can finally get rid of their interceptors.

What I was thinking was that Sarawak will have a pretty small manpower and IC. As such it will need to meet any construction and development costs from its own limited resources.

You right! Liberating Sarawak was a mistake. Much better its 8 IC was added to Indonesia's 17 IC for all the reasons you mention. Only bright spot is I got a separate replenishment island earlier in Sarawak's Borneo island. But in the long run, it only needed Indoesia to produce one extra INF to station on Borneo to so get same result (Borneo as a free replenishment island).

 

[stevep]

Checking, I note that Germany has not released any of its 17 puppets. But I now realize the reason Germany has 540 INF is because their puppets have expeditioned many units. For instance, before I flipped game, I know India had ~100 divisions, but count by 9 spies now says India has only 37 INF. If we assume that means only 37 in India itself (the expeditioned ones elsewhere) that makes India a viable "first continental target" as my MECH with H Arm brigade can blockade Karachi from any panzer counterattack and my Armor can easily annex India before the Chinese horde can cross the Himalayas. I do have a couple PARA to shorten taking the mountainous Indian provinces.

Sounds promising, Depends on where all the VP provinces are and would the intel give any guide as to whether any non-Indian forces backing up those 37 divisions? I suspect the AI wouldn't do that but possibly worth a thought.

If you do liberate India what happens to all those expeditioned units?

Noticed a similar thing in that game I autoed as Tunna Tuv the other week. Germany showed up as having only about 35 Inf when I looked at them in 41 just after they attacked the Soviets. It was only when I checked them on the "National Army Comparison" chart where it showed that the Germany infantry total suddenly said about 87. Presuming the extra ~50 were gifted units from allies. It would also explain how Germany managed to have so many units without running totally out of manpower.

I wish I knew if it indeed was my past strategic campaign that created Germany's assumed low MP to result in no ballistic missiles fired.

Having never got that far I didn't realise that ballistic missiles were such a drain on manpower.

Well, at only 4 lines ARM possible, building up my army significantly is a very long endeavor. I have 19 ARM division now, which is still the same 18 as before on the front line because the single one is waiting for 2 buddies to be constructed. I am losing much MP to vitally needed bases and navy. But because I upgraded my ARM in production, I had a spell of no new divisions for a few months and my MP now 128 and climbing +1.07 daily (net after ageing reduction). That means I can construct 2 ARM divisions every month. So 4 lines is correct #.

But the real question is how to best use the huge recent increase in MP stockpile - which doubled last 2 months? Lay down a couple more ARM lines.... or do a new strategic campaign?

On the bright side, I just completed upgrading of all FTR/Improved Turbojet-1947 and FTR/ESC-same attached to my recently upgraded STR-Turbojet 1945. It is August 1947. This is a window of opportunity to hit the enemy industry while I am at my strongest. I have in England 24 STR-4 wings and 32 FTR-5 Next upgrade is the STR-Improved Turbojet 1949. But with the RAF's 29 wings there it has meant many new bases at 1 MP each. Just to do the strategic campaign I must fly out most of the RAF first to give me proper space.

I can again reduce German IC by 100 - which could be critical if the MP losses the Luftwaffe will suffer while defending from my onslaught results in no ballistic missiles being fired for next year. But - for sure - I will also suffer huge MP loss which will upset the rather orderly progression now established to greater ARM lines constructing. The idea would be to again do another strategic campaign once the STR upgrade to next level, and another once the FTR and ESC/FTR upgrade to Supersonic-1951. So, maybe one campaign per year - done for a month to wreck the Luftwaffe, deplete MP and knock back Germany's IC by 100 while giving massive repair bill is the prescription to avoid Britain getting devastated by missiles?

Interest question and way outside my range of experience. Be very interested to find out how things went. [Although since I'm away from Friday I might have to wait to find out.]

Unfortunately Japan can not be softened up by strategic attack unless wishing to accept huge MP losses. They have 48 wings of the most modern (and undamaged) rocket interceptors, and an abundance of home bases. No, I think this is a job for Patton to accomplish with out air support. Heck, he's got MacArthur and Bradley and 9 marine divisions (and the whole US army) to help....attacking from several directions.

I strongly believe the next conquest must be Taiwan, then Okinawa, then hit the home islands from north and south. It is vital to rid myself of the important enemy islands before tackling anywhere on the mainland

Ouch. It sounds strange the US not having massive air superiority against just about everybody but in this game I can understand it with the Axis being so dominant.

True. Worse is they have VCs in China that must be taken to annex Japan. It will take clever strategy to get in there to get those with armor and retreat out when 100 Chinese inf appear. But the Chinese will claim those Jap VCs for themselves - so accomplishing the aim of getting Japan's last VC to be able to annex. That way I can finally get rid of their interceptors.

That would be difficult but hopefully work. Would you seek to hold onto Korea or be prepared to withdraw from that?

You right! Liberating Sarawak was a mistake. Much better its 8 IC was added to Indonesia's 17 IC for all the reasons you mention. Only bright spot is I got a separate replenishment island earlier in Sarawak's Borneo island. But in the long run, it only needed Indoesia to produce one extra INF to station on Borneo to so get same result (Borneo as a free replenishment island).

I must admit I'm bloody amazed its got 8IC, nearly half what Indonesia has. Someone must have been doing some building there for quite a while,

Anyway, best of luck. If you succeed you can always go back to a suitable point and try and rescue the allied position as Britain.

 

[Commander666]

If you do liberate India what happens to all those expeditioned units?

I suppose they go permanently to who has them expeditioned. This can be checked at time India is annexed. If the German army count does not change, it means the India troops expeditioned to Germany are still in game (and now would be German).

Having never got that far I didn't realise that ballistic missiles were such a drain on manpower.

They cost only 0.1 MP each - but given that 100 might be fired at UK that would blow up 10 MP.

It sounds strange the US not having massive air superiority against just about everybody but in this game I can understand it with the Axis being so dominant.

Well, the UK did not exist except as a few Caribbean islands when I flipped game having played Germany until July 1944. And the USA had nothing left except a couple land divisions at each beach province of continental USA. Its air force was a few remaining wings of STR and FTR tattered to shreds. That was why I flipped game. There was zero challenge to invading the States.

But my Germany that I left had massive Luftwaffe then; and the Japan AI interceptor force was hardly in battle during WW2... and just getting stronger and most modern. So now the USA I am playing might be able to beat the Luftwaffe if I brought my Pacific assets to Britain also, but it would be a horrible meat grinder chewing massively into MP. Of course, such a battle of attrition might be what defeats Germany... but I dread doing it... and will not unless it is my last option.

Instead I hope strategic bombing - done very carefully to out fox the most aggressive and capable Luftwaffe (and not get caught in losing air battles) might work better. I note that the German AI is excellent at separating a bomber stream flying over Ghent to deeper inland targets. So, if going with 8 STR and 8 FTR to bomb Brussels, AND 8 more STR and 8 FTR to bomb (and hold) Ghent, the German AI can achieve only one USA STR stack with just one FTR stack reaching Brussels (that he devastates using 16 INT/FTR) while another 16 German wings hit the 12 STR and 12 FTR hung up at Ghent. Both battles are major wins for the Luftwaffe with 16 fighters devastating 4 USA FTR and 4 STR at Brussels, and 16 more German fighters with base proximity bonus at Ghent hitting against only 12 USA FTR (some over command because of the 12 STR). I'm impressed! Splitting the bomber stream is better than a human could do. And that is in spite of myself having based 1 FTR stack with every STR stack, and then flying 16 total from 2 adjacent bases that gives identical time over Mouth of the Thames. I can't do it any better.... but the AI can still split my bomber stream.

Subsequently, I need satisfy my aims with now only bombing the coast (to guarantee my 16 chosen arrive there together) and going to Paris seems OK. But the super rich IC provinces of the Ruhr the AI Luftwaffe has managed to now keep safe. I did devastate it last year.... but that was a weaker or dumber Luftwaffe then.

Would you seek to hold onto Korea or be prepared to withdraw from that?

Good question. If the Chinese take back Korea the provinces will be Chinese. Problem of reducing Jap VCs solved. But Manchuria would retake Korea first, and I think they would return province flag to Japan. So it needs me to take Korea and hold it against the Chinese while I annex Manchuria, Then I could exit Korea and hit the Chinese elsewhere where there are remaining Jap VCs. Japan also has VCs in Jinan and Qingdao, in Shanghai, in Hong Kong, on Hainan Island, and then inland at Nanning and all the way up to mountainous Kunming. It will be tricky getting Japan's last VC with the Chinese still around.

Anyway, Taiwan and Okinawa fell very easily. Will land on Japan Home islands next. Good luck to the heros! (Patton et al)

Anyway, best of luck. If you succeed you can always go back to a suitable point and try and rescue the allied position as Britain.

Having played Britain instead would have meant I could not MC the USA. How many years might it be until AI USA returned me to London?

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

Mr B

Interesting info. Never really been in a position to try it but might give it a go some time.

What does become neutral but remain a puppet mean please as it sounds a bit contradictory to be honest? Sounds like it will not fight alongside the [in this case] Germans, supply them with troops or allow passage of their forces? In which case what does puppet status involve? Also how easy or not would it be for Germany to regain control or would it have to invade and conquer it again?

Thanks

Steve

Becoming neutral but remaining a puppet means that the target nation will no longer be allied with their master, and will no longer be part of their conflict while remaining a puppet of that nation. Unless the puppet previously gave military access to their master, then indeed the coup would also mean any troops of their master would be forced out of the country. Germany would have to invade and conquer it again, or coup the nation in order to ally with it again.

 

[stevep]

Guys

OK thanks. for the info. Best of luck with Japan Commander.

Steve

 

[Commander666]

Becoming neutral but remaining a puppet means ... ... ...

How could the USA make Japan's puppets of Manchuria and China go neutral? Same question for Germany's puppet of India?

It is Sept 1947 and I have 10 spies in each, can easily increase that, but see no diplomatic choice that might achieve my wish of getting those 3 huge puppets out of the Axis. Coup nation has nil chance, and would that even get them neutral or just change the govt? I was always of the impression that nobody could leave an alliance (become neutral) during a war.


Nationalist China currently has 165 divisions (plus anything that might be expeditioned), Manchukuo 41, and India it reads 58 (but they must have over 100 expeditioned).

Anyway, over 1200 Axis divisions in all is a bit daunting for even a Patton, a MacArthur, a Bradley and a Commander666 combined! The USA only has 13 MOTs, 16 MECH, 22 ARM, 9 INF, 9 MAR, 2 PARA, 1 CAV and 4 HQ to attack with. (The militia we won't mention). We are constructing 3-4 ARM per month.... but still....

And we can't even use our bombers anywhere near land because the Messerschmitts and Zeros are so crazy strong. If I had a nuke, I would never be able to drop it on Berlin. So we need astute political maneuvering to succeed, I think.

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

Couping puppets changes the government and removes them from whatever alliance they were part of. After the coup it is highly unlikely/impossible that they will re-join that alliance unless they share the same/similar ideology (i.e. they are recouped or massively influenced).

 

[Commander666]

Couping puppets changes the government and removes them from whatever alliance they were part of.

So that effectively removes an enemy alliance member from continuing the war with oneself.

That is neat that such a possibility exists. But I have been studying couping several Axis alliance members in the hopes of getting them out of WW2. It seems there are some practical limits.

For example, every Axis nation I only have 10 or a bit more spies in has zero coup chance. The only comparison is Germany where I have 26 spies - and chance of coup is 5%. Worse, earlier I had 32 spies there and, IIRC, it was same coup chance.

A 5% chance is not very good, and getting 20-30 spies in all the major enemy puppets I like to coup is very expensive. But I could also change foreign minister to improve chances of coup.

AS IT TURNED OUT, my USA instead used its huge strategic bomber force to nearly totally destroy Japan, N. China and India. The hordes of Japs in my Wake Island and Hawaiian Islands starved to 95% and so could be amphibed reasonably. The masses of Chinese lost most of their org and successfully attacking even 30 embedded divisions became a Patton legacy. And the poor Indians must have been most thankful when they were annexed to stop being in a country that has the infra in every province destroyed to less than 5%. But having couped them would have been nicer.

 

[Mr_B0narpte]

So that effectively removes an enemy alliance member from continuing the war with oneself.

That is neat that such a possibility exists. But I have been studying couping several Axis alliance members in the hopes of getting them out of WW2. It seems there are some practical limits.

For example, every Axis nation I only have 10 or a bit more spies in has zero coup chance. The only comparison is Germany where I have 26 spies - and chance of coup is 5%. Worse, earlier I had 32 spies there and, IIRC, it was same coup chance.

A 5% chance is not very good, and getting 20-30 spies in all the major enemy puppets I like to coup is very expensive. But I could also change foreign minister to improve chances of coup.

See post #4 above on the best way to coup a nation.

AS IT TURNED OUT, my USA instead used its huge strategic bomber force to nearly totally destroy Japan, N. China and India. The hordes of Japs in my Wake Island and Hawaiian Islands starved to 95% and so could be amphibed reasonably. The masses of Chinese lost most of their org and successfully attacking even 30 embedded divisions became a Patton legacy. And the poor Indians must have been most thankful when they were annexed to stop being in a country that has the infra in every province destroyed to less than 5%. But having couped them would have been nicer.

Good effort! Keep up the advance

 

[Commander666]

See post #4 above on the best way to coup a nation.

Good effort! Keep up the advance

Well, it has been a struggle but we have made great headway. Hitler has no more puppets in Asia... we annexed them ALL. The next Axis puppet we face is Ukraine... and I suppose that is actually in Europe. So we have managed to force our way across the huge continent of Asia and India.

The crux of the war (so far) came when our 28 divisions blockading at Karachi had a sneak attack done to them. We were quite happy to sit there for the next year while our other forces fought across northern Asia. In fact, we never noticed that for months the Nazi forces had been quietly building up in the adjacent provinces of Chah Bahar and Birjand with a reserve at Bandar Abbas. On September 4th, 1948 the enemy launched a massive 2 angle attack. In the panic we never figured out how many divisions it was but suspect about 48. We would soon have been defeated and would have had to retreat right across India back to the mountains of Burma (where we had just recently come from).

Fortunately, we had 2 nukes stockpiled.... and used then to vaporize much of the two enemy front line stacks. Then we attacked and soon engaged their reserve, and pushed thru Persia. That operation probably resulted in about 100 less German divisions.

We hoped for our next rest to be digging in at the mountainous line separating Persia and Iraq and reached it in strength - including a few of our forces taking Baku. Meanwhile our northern forces reached Stalingrad so our two armies were only separated by the Caucasus.

But before we could get well dug in at the mountains of Persia, Hitler managed to launch another very strong attack out of Iraq. It seems another 50 divisions were there just waitin for us to show up! Unfortunately, there were no more nukes.... but our air force did a heroic effort to stop the enemy attack just before we were sure to get retreated. Reducing enemy infra to zero in the region greatly contributed to saving our situation.... plus the timely arrival of 3 fresh ARM divisions that had just crossed the Pacific and literally unloaded into the battle.

This led to us counter-attacking using the still fresh forces up at Baku and the newly arrived ARM. Then - with paratroopers - we managed to surround the German divisions who very weakened by their earlier failed attack - and eliminated the lot including over-running some as we raced for the Suez Canal.

Unfortunately, the Italians in the Middle East were more than we had hoped to be there, and fought very well, so that when we did finally reach Alexandria it was with very weak divisions remaining. And our air force is quite tattered too.

We need 500 IC for reinforcement and it says it needs 67 manpower to reinforce all. But we only got 45 MP. We were keeping our slider set so that the MP reading was green, but now have decided to start reinforcing at triple rate in the hopes of getting this bad situation under control. To try to avoid running out of MP we stopped further construction of the three ARM lines, and most other things too. We are disbanding all we dare - including the useless Heavy Tank brigades as those divisions are much too slow; and will give them SP/ART instead as is the norm on all our divisions.

Meanwhile, the Brits have just landed south of Casablanca and we hope their 7 ARM divisions will be reaching us at Alexandria soon. We have no intention of spending any more MP conquering things until we get our worn out army refitted.

But the Wehrmacht must be in bad shape too. And it has gotten much smaller - only 316 infantry divisions and 43 armored divisions left. But Otto Hahn has achieved 26% on Nuclear Waste Bomb. Needless to say, we are maximizing our tech sabotage efforts.

We hope for a quite winter and wish for the new hydrogen bomb (tech also at 26%).

 

[stevep]

Commander

Well just catching up and that was impressive to put it mildly. I presume you have a huge repair bill for all those provinces you have liberated, especially those the USAAF smashed to crud 1st, but then one thing the US is unlikely to be short of is IC. Sounds like it was a lot easier than you were fearing and strategic bombing is really, really lethal.

I know you were highly concerned about the enemy Interceptor strength , especially for Japan. Did this turn out to be false or did you find a way around it?

Once you have regrouped I suspect that Germany itself probably won't last long, even if their air cover prevents you using the SBs as freely. They must be facing problems having lost so many forces, especially in the nuclear attacks. Although if you don't have the SB available they will probably have a big infrastructure advantage. Plus with so much of their empire/puppets lost I would suspect their probably running down stockpiles of materials or perhaps taking a IC hit already.

Anyway, reading with great interest.

Steve

 

[Commander666]

The dreaded air force of Japan never showed up. Unbelievably, it all stayed in Europe and Western Asia and even Africa (where they did huge damage to the Canadian Air Force when it got too close to Casablanca). I was able to simply amphib Fukuoka with my bombers assisting. Then I worked my way up to Tokyo. As I was about taking Tokyo some JAP INTs finally did arrive.

But with Japan's capital relocated to Vladivostok (and them only having a bit of IC left) the huge and extremely formidable and most modern Japanese air force literally simply slowly starved to death. Why they would not rebase to protect their homeland is, sadly, one of the problems facing AoD once game goes past historical.

The many puppets of USA were not a problem. USA can repair what it conquers extremely fast. Game is at April 1950 now and USA has, I think, ~72 puppets. The advantage is that I managed to get rid of most of the world I controlled so I don't need to deal with the huge amounts of resources that were collecting in depots. Also, I wanted to see how the world - especially Africa - looks with every puppet possible being there.

Vichy France and about a small 12 IC Germany still remain. Italy with 35 spies I could not coup. Instead I got an event that made Italy "more friendly to us" and they dropped out of the Axis. Then the chance to coup nation shot up to 160%.... but there has not been any coup, and the chance to coup now steadily decreases. Now with 38 spies, the chance is only 85% .... but coup doesn't happen in spite of the excellent chances. Instead they DOWed the Axis... which I won't allow because they would finish off the Axis before I have gotten out of this game everything I want... like learning what is maximum production rate of nukes with Level 10 reactor and Hydrogen Bomb achieved. This last tech again doubled bomb production.

I imagine I need to DOW Italy to stop their aggressiveness as I am getting tired of reloading to prevent it, but having them always DOW the Axis same time anyway. I really wanted to experience my first coup. It isn't turning out anything like Mr_BOnarpte said it would. Maybe they will coup easier if we are at war? I also need to change to the minister that gives +20% chance to coup nation. I'm sure that is the problem, but I was too busy reducing dissent from puppeting the world.

EDIT: The Luftwaffe did remain a huge problem. Initially I tried to strategically bomb Berlin, but even with 24 STR, 16 TAC and 40 FTR to rotate thru, I was not making much headway - only mostly swapping out damaged wings for fresh ones while the Luftwaffe just kept adding more wings to make it a horrible war of attrition. Some battles saw up to 30-40 wings attacking each other same time. It got so bad, I committed the proverbial sin, and just nuked Berlin. After that the Luftwaffe was much easier to deal with. In fact, I took Berlin just so they would have a new capital with good infra because I was feeling guilty about how they were so decimated.

 

[stevep]

Commander

Thanks for the information and a very interesting ride. Seems fascinating and hope that one day I will have the time and familiarity to play that far with a few nations. [I do have a long term dream of an updated version of Trekaddict's Against all Odds as that was the AAR that got me into playing but doubt I'll ever have the time and knowledge to do that].

Trust you to break the game with too many puppets/allies.