UPDATED 14/06/18 - *** Rules for User Made Mods and Edits of PDS games ***

[ngppgn]

MEIOU & Taxes is allowed to have a Facebook page. Other EU IV mods are not allowed to have one.

IIRC @Castellon answered to me that mods are allowed to have social media,webpages, etc, as long as those don't behave like a forum (i.e. discussions with the unregistered users, distributions of downloads, etc).

Edit: here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?posts/18246744/

 

[loup99]

I've heard of mods who have not been allowed to create a Facebook page.
Rules should apply to all mods.

IIRC @Castellon answered to me that mods are allowed to have social media,webpages, etc, as long as those don't behave like a forum (i.e. discussions with the unregistered users, distributions of downloads, etc).

I cant help but feeling that this is exactly the same scenario as with GitHub: some people had an unclear no, others had a yes and some did not ask due to the rules not covering it (which in my opinion is quiet natural to do)

 

[delpiero1234]

IIRC @Castellon answered to me that mods are allowed to have social media,webpages, etc, as long as those don't behave like a forum (i.e. discussions with the unregistered users, distributions of downloads, etc).

Edit: here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?posts/18246744/

Facebook page allows discussion with users which is why I know of a mod which have not be allowed to make a Facebook page.

I cant help but feeling that this is exactly the same scenario as with GitHub: some people had an unclear no, others had a yes and some did not ask due to the rules not covering it (which in my opinion is quiet natural to do)

Why do you think I bring all these issues up? I think we need clarifaciton on all these fronts

 

[Wagonlitz]

Would be incredibly unfair and awkward when you think on it. For instance: what about retired people? Should they work two years extra if the upper limit is extended with two years? Same with forum rules and old posts. Should the moderation sanction users for old posts once new rules are instated?

The difference is that those things are old. In the case of still living mods they get new versions all the time, so it is rather like a car. You produce some car model and one year regulations change. You don't have to change all the cars produced previous years, but if you want to produce new versions of those car model you need to start following the new regulations. But of course that could easily lead to modders just abandoning mods, which would be really detrimental. So it is a really fine balance act.

 

[Korbah]

Facebook page allows discussion with users which is why I know of a mod which have not be allowed to make a Facebook page.


Why do you think I bring all these issues up? I think we need clarifaciton on all these fronts

ngppgn gave you clarification.

IIRC @Castellon answered to me that mods are allowed to have social media,webpages, etc, as long as those don't behave like a forum (i.e. discussions with the unregistered users, distributions of downloads, etc).

Edit: here: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?posts/18246744/

Elder Kings' website & bugtracker were vetted by Castellon before they were made public. The moddb downloads are grandfathered, although honestly we'd love to use Steam workshop, just need the upper limit of modifications to be increased to a gigabyte (the limitation isn't set by Valve/Steam but by the publisher who controls the workshop) so the mod actually fits. I did try distributing it via the forums but the upload wouldn't take.
As for the SVN we use; it isn't github, it's a private server which requires details we've released only in our CK2 subforum (if those details have been distributed elsewhere, that is equivalent to someone distributing CK2 itself elsewhere but unfortunately we don't have the capability to wage legal wars against russian pirates, though I did ask a PDS dev if there was anything they could do about it and the answer was no); as far as I can tell that meets the regulations on distribution.

In every single jurisdiction I've lived in, and on every single forum I've ever visited rules have never been retroactively applied.

 

[delpiero1234]

Elder King is not the only mod which is very large in size, yet you get an extra option of reaching a wider audience by uploading to ModBB. By uploading to ModBB you reach more people. It's a fact.
Other mods have to choose: Do I upload to ModBB or do I use Paradox Forum + SteamWorkshop + Direct Download links like Mega.co.nz. If size is the reason why you use ModBB then simply consider switching to Mega.nz/Mediafire for your distribution which is what other mods have to use too.

So only because your mod has been around for long, you get to use a bug tracker? this is quite a disadvantage for other mods. Rules should apply to all mod. All and new. Fair game for everyone.

 

[Korbah]

So only because your mod has been around for long, you get to use a bug tracker? this is quite a disadvantage for other mods. Rules should apply to all mod. All and new. Fair game for everyone.

The website and bugtracker are additions that were vetted recently, I suggest you try asking the Moderators or Administrators of the subforum your mod is in if you can use the bugtracker you've setup.

As for believing Moddb gives us greater exposure. The downloads on moddb pale in comparison to the referrals to our SVN repository via the subforum here at Paradox Interactive. Since the latest release went out on moddb, we've had around 5k downloads there while in the same time period the SVN repository has been accessed by 12k unique users. Your arguments of exposure are based on belief rather than evidence, our evidence says to the contrary.
In addition, Mega has a limitation on the bandwidth of 10GB per month last time I checked, a limit that we've exceeded by quite a bit (over 1TB, which would require a premium account at Mega). Mediafire has similar limitations (albeit they claim it is a soft limitation, "fair usage" of their service); if your download rates that highly within a short space of time it can be disabled.

As said however, once the forum is working with uploads or Steam workshop has it's size limitation increased, we'd be more than willing to switch over to them. Further, Elder Kings had a grandfathered forum which we removed when the new rules were brought in, and have made moves to bring us closer to the rules than other large grandfathered modifications are willing to do. Thank you for this opportunity however to give more exposure to Elder Kings.

 

[AhoyDeerrr]

@AhoyDeerrr , would you please clarify which rules MEIOU and Taxes we get to ignore ?

MEIOU for EUIII hasn't gone on ModDB because i understood back then that it wasn't authorised (although not enforced and some other EUIII mods used it). AGoT has an external forum, which was already forbidden during EUIII days (though, again, not enforced).

Rule number 1, MEIOU and Taxes has a publicly accessible forum.

 

[gigau]

Rule number 1, MEIOU and Taxes has a publicly accessible forum.

There is no publicly accessible forum... there is a team forum which is authorised for team discussion.

 

[delpiero1234]

There is no publicly accessible forum... there is a team forum which is authorised for team discussion.

Facebook is a type of open accesiable forum. It allows public discussion.

 

[gigau]

Facebook is a type of open accesiable forum. It allows public discussion.

Facebook is not a forum, it's a social media, and :

Social media, yes I think it would not be fair to not allow you to use that

 

[AhoyDeerrr]

There is no publicly accessible forum... there is a team forum which is authorised for team discussion.

Strange, I looked the MEIOU forum like 30 mins ago and I could see boards as well as topics and post, but now I can not...

 

[Sun_Wu]

Strange, I looked the MEIOU forum like 30 mins ago and I could see boards as well as topics and post, but now I can not...

How many forums could you see?

 

[AKronblad]

Could we end this discussion before deteriorating too much, please?

Why pick at @gigau and team for having a facebook page that has been on his signature for a long time?
And at @Korbah for his and his team's setup, all approved by Paradox?

I can't really see how it makes anyone worse off that they are having this, while other modders don't. If rules were different before and things were allowed then, but not anymore, then so be it. We cannot punish other modders and blame them for acting upon then prevailing rules.

Please direct your energy elsewhere, e.g., Paradox who has set up the rules, and not at fellow modders.

 

[Vonboe]

Could we end this discussion before deteriorating too much, please?

Why pick at @gigau and team for having a facebook page that has been on his signature for a long time?
And at @Korbah for his and his team's setup, all approved by Paradox?

I can't really see how it makes anyone worse off that they are having this, while other modders don't. If rules were different before and things were allowed then, but not anymore, then so be it. We cannot punish other modders and blame them for acting upon then prevailing rules.

Please direct your energy elsewhere, e.g., Paradox who has set up the rules, and not at fellow modders.

I believe they are trying to advocate for everyone should get those privileges, not that modders who already have these should lose them.

 

[AKronblad]

I believe they are trying to advocate for everyone should get those privileges, not that modders who already have these should lose them.

I understand that and I agree with them on that, but I believe M&T got some undeserved bad beating above.

 

[loup99]

I believe they are trying to advocate for everyone should get those privileges, not that modders who already have these should lose them.

No, but it effectively is that as we all know these improvements to these rules won't be removed. There were issues with the old rules that allowed old mods to have external forums, or moddb downloads. It would be very weird for the administration to change that. With the present set of rules Paradox can avoid that. What they are arguing is for the rules to be applied retroactively.

 

[Vonboe]

No, but it effectively is that as we all know these improvements to these rules won't be removed. There were issues with the old rules that allowed old mods to have external forums, or moddb downloads. It would be very weird for the administration to change that. With the present set of rules Paradox can avoid that. What they are arguing is for the rules to be applied retroactively.

Hmm if that's the case, I think a proper explanation from Paradox would satisfy those who finds it "unfair", but unfortunately Castellon haven't posted in this thread for over 3 months now, despite the many questions.

 

[Wagonlitz]

Why pick at @gigau and team for having a facebook page that has been on his signature for a long time?

Just because you have used something for a long time doesn't make it ok; the reason their facebook page isn't problematic is due to it having been cleared. Not because they have had it for a long time.

 

[AKronblad]

Just because you have used something for a long time doesn't make it ok; the reason their facebook page isn't problematic is due to it having been cleared. Not because they have had it for a long time.

The point I'm trying to make is that it has been no secret about the Facebook page, since it's been on the signature for a long time. So why is it suddenly a problem now? And why expose individual modders and team who are adhering to the rules (even if those rules are more generous than the current ones)?