Update on next Development Diary timing

Update on next Development Diary timing

  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
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MarkFranz

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Interesting how a game like I:R has managed to squeeze out three DDs already while CK3 will need one and a half month to do the same,
It's simple to undestand the reasons behind it if think about it throughly. I:R flopped so it require either high efforts to redeem it in eyes of players or pull DOW3 road. CK3 on other hand already payoff highly and get pretty popular, so there no need for extra effort, comsumers will buy DLC for it anyway.
 
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IanReSc

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The game was released September 1st. That is barely 5 months are we're already complaining about not getting information on DLC's? Come on!

Personally, the phrasing of the statement makes me wonder. "Firestarter". I smell a witch burning DLC :D
 
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Calahir

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What if there hasn't been a DD recently because the team is busy working on Victoria 3?;)
 
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Xain

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Personally, the phrasing of the statement makes me wonder. "Firestarter". I smell a witch burning DLC :D

Why not dream big then? Firestarter --> Greek fire --> Byzantium/ERE + naval warfare!

Totally unrelated and maybe off-topic, but do we know if flavour packs will include also region or culture-specific gameplay, or is it just clothes and stuff?
 
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Leyrann

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Totally unrelated and maybe off-topic, but do we know if flavour packs will include also region or culture-specific gameplay, or is it just clothes and stuff?

Considering PDX Nicou (if I remember correctly) said that their first reaction to the first flavor pack was "that's not a full expansion?", I think it's safe to say there will be gameplay included, even if you were to take their words with a grain of salt. (which I personally don't, but I know some people are more skeptical than me)
 

Voy

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Considering PDX Nicou (if I remember correctly) said that their first reaction to the first flavor pack was "that's not a full expansion?", I think it's safe to say there will be gameplay included, even if you were to take their words with a grain of salt. (which I personally don't, but I know some people are more skeptical than me)
It's healthy to be sceptical when an employee gushes over their company in public. If they include game mechanics, let's hope they've learned something from CK2 development. Ya don't lockout essential features without consequences to future development.
 
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Oglesby

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Why not dream big then? Firestarter --> Greek fire --> Byzantium/ERE + naval warfare!

Totally unrelated and maybe off-topic, but do we know if flavour packs will include also region or culture-specific gameplay, or is it just clothes and stuff?
I want to say it is the former and not the latter.

This is what they stated about the DLC policy for CK3
Our DLCs will be split between Flavor Packs and Major Expansions.

  • Flavor Packs – SRP $6.99: in-game content focused on a theme or a region.
  • Major Expansions – SRP $29.99: larger, meatier expansions with content and mechanics to expand and enrich your experience.
  • Free Updates: As usual, each Major Expansion will be accompanied by a free update that will provide new features, fixes and changes to improve our players’ experience.

They also talk to the two bonus packs (which are just clothes and stuff)
**Expansion Pass Bonus: Fashion of the Abbasid Court has a SRP of $2.99.
*** Pre-order Bonus: Garments of the Holy Roman Empire has a SRP of $2.99.

All of this was found here.
 

es333

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The game was released September 1st. That is barely 5 months are we're already complaining about not getting information on DLC's? Come on!

Personally, the phrasing of the statement makes me wonder. "Firestarter". I smell a witch burning DLC :D

I preordered the Royal edition and I have less than 20 hours in CK III because I am still waiting for many bugs to be fixed. Some cultures are bare-bones, others are broken (Estonian culture doesn't have longships in either start date nor can they get access to them, bug acknowledged by PDX at 02.09.2020).

I would be very disappointed if a DLC is prioritised over bug fixes.
 
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DreadLindwyrm

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I preordered the Royal edition and I have less than 20 hours in CK III because I am still waiting for many bugs to be fixed. Some cultures are bare-bones, others are broken (Estonian culture doesn't have longships in either start date nor can they get access to them, bug acknowledged by PDX at 02.09.2020).

I would be very disappointed if a DLC is prioritised over bug fixes.
Remember most DLC come with big bug fixes that have been written to work with the new content as well as the old.
 
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druez

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I bought the royal edition, I was just assuming that this was going to be items delivered over the next year. Its about 5 months from release and they haven't even announced what is in a flavor pack or what is in a DLC. I think that is kind of lame.
 
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Leyrann

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I bought the royal edition, I was just assuming that this was going to be items delivered over the next year. Its about 5 months from release and they haven't even announced what is in a flavor pack or what is in a DLC. I think that is kind of lame.

He said, in a reply to the very post that announces when this will be addressed.
 
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SauronGorthaur

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Excited.

Think you guys are an impossible position. If you start talking about DLC/Roadmap shortly after release, you get accused of deliberately leaving out planned content from vanilla to force players to buy it as DLC. But if you spend the time fixing bugs, releasing free updates and looking at players feedback/how players are playing the game before finalising a roadmap, you get complaints about lack of communication. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's almost as if it was possible to strike some balance here. CKIII will be five months old in just four days. By the time we'll get next DD it will be almost half a year old. A month has passed between the Christmas information that developers are going dark and the last week's message to be patient, then one more week between that and the announcement of when DDs will resume that this thread is about. We're not "shortly after the release" anymore by any stretch of the word and the communication is poor not even by standards of other companies that may have different relations with their playerbases, it's poor by the standards of the teams behind other PDS games.
 
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MagisterMundi

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Yup, better to know than to not know. I would really appreciate a bigger dev presence on the forums though; it doesn't seem as worthwhile to discuss gameplay observations and issues here without a signal that the devs are still actively listening and engaging.
Especially since, once upon a time, an active and vigorous dev presence on the forums was what Paradox was specifically known for. I understand companies grow, but I would be lying if I said I didn't miss discussing and debating historical minutiae (and mechanics) with devs in forum threads on a regular basis. It is, in fact, one of the things I miss the most about the Paradox that was.
 
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johnty5

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It's almost as if it was possible to strike some balance here. CKIII will be five months old in just four days. By the time we'll get next DD it will be almost half a year old. A month has passed between the Christmas information that developers are going dark and the last week's message to be patient, then one more week between that and the announcement of when DDs will resume that this thread is about. We're not "shortly after the release" anymore by any stretch of the word and the communication is poor not even by standards of other companies that may have different relations with their playerbases, it's poor by the standards of the teams behind other PDS games.
I'm old enough to remember when people complained that Paradox released too many DLCs. Now, apparently, not announcing a DLC within five months of a new release is some kind of moral failing on the part of Paradox.
 
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I'm old enough to remember when people complained that Paradox released too many DLCs. Now, apparently, not announcing a DLC within five months of a new release is some kind of moral failing on the part of Paradox.
Totally agree, I also remember such conversations. I think that now Paradox gave a specific vision of developing dlcs starting from CK3 release (or Imperator - correct me If Im wrong). They said there will not be so many dlcs like in CK2 but they will be 'meater' (whatever it means).

And now, just making some simple research:
Getting all major dlcs release dates for CK2, average is about 5.4 month per DLC. Also it gives in 9-year period something about 3 dlcs per year.

For me it's clear that if Paradox made such statement like I mentioned, we won't get 15 DLCs in 9-year period but less, we won't get something about 3 dlcs per year but less, we won't get 5.4 month per DLC but more months per DLC. I don't know how much more but if 5.4 was average for CK2 and now it's 5 months after release of CK3 I'll simply wait.

But :)
I'm also curious about flavor packs and first dlc, and I can't wait to know what they will be about. I also love to read dev diaries and before announcement of mid-february dd release I was refreshing forums daily :D I really like reading any post from Paradox employees so I'm also sad about how this contact looks like, I think that more peole would just like to have more Paradox involvement and have any info from them.

But to sum up and clear my point ;) For me these are two different things: DLC release interval and dev diary post (or any paradox post). And as the longer dlc development is totally understandable for me (because it was simply said before by Paradox itself), then forum involvement is some kind of letdown. I'm not feeling "abandoned" or "betrayed" or thinking that they are "lame", but whole situation is for me like waiting for message from someone you like and wait, and wait, and wait..... :)

So, I think I go back to play CK3 ;)
 
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People also should not underestimate the hesitation a lot of developers (or basically everyone who isn't part of marketing, and arguably even those people) will feel to go on the forums because if they don't do everything perfectly, everyone will complain and harass them for not giving more information or even giving unappreciated information - like "it's going to take three more weeks until we get a dev diary", to name something.

These people don't have it as part of their job to go on the forums and interact, and the worse a community behaves, the less likely they are to do it anyway.

And while this community tends to be rather articulate and probably won't turn to actual rants and insults, there is a lot of rather incessant whining about bugs and when the new content will arrive. I can't exactly blame the developers for not wanting to step into the minefield that has been created over time. Of course, not everyone is guilty of that, but perhaps take a moment to contemplate this, and put yourself in their shoes.
 
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SauronGorthaur

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I'm old enough to remember when people complained that Paradox released too many DLCs. Now, apparently, not announcing a DLC within five months of a new release is some kind of moral failing on the part of Paradox.
Again, it's almost as if it was possible to strike some balance there. Especially since Paradox's DLC model is already well-established by this point and five months is indeed a pretty big communication gap for said model. Especially since they announced from the get go that CKIII will continue using the DLC model of flavor packs and larger expansions that they are already using and outright announced three of them via the season pass. Context is a thing and just merrily throwing it away to defend Paradox's honor isn't exactly a convincing argument.

Neither are your false dichotomies. Or you straw-manning my post about their communication (because that's what your own comment that I was replying to was about in the first place and context is still a thing) into some nonsense about specific release dates for a DLC. Or you projecting equally nonsensical nonsense about Paradox's moral failing onto me, when I neither said nor even implied anything of the sort.
 
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Again, it's almost as if it was possible to strike some balance there. Especially since Paradox's DLC model is already well-established by this point and five months is indeed a pretty big communication gap for said model. Especially since they announced from the get go that CKIII will continue using the DLC model of flavor packs and larger expansions that they are already using and outright announced three of them via the season pass. Context is a thing and just merrily throwing it away to defend Paradox's honor isn't exactly a convincing argument.

Neither are your false dichotomies. Or you straw-manning my post about their communication (because that's what your own comment that I was replying to was about in the first place and context is still a thing) into some nonsense about specific release dates for a DLC. Or you projecting equally nonsensical nonsense about Paradox's moral failing onto me, when I neither said nor even implied anything of the sort.
I's not 5 months of missing communication. They only dared not to announce the first DLC within the first 5 months after the release. FYI, the first CK2 DLC was announced 8 months after the release. CK2, the game which was in particular criticized for having too many DLCs.

Moreover, they have been communicating in the meantime... and they are. Just not as frequently as some but very vocal parts of the community want to.

Many people call for the ideal of "communicative dev" - something Snow Crystal used to be in the late CK2 development.
I dare to have a question for the likes of you: When is he supposed to do this talkativness to the community? In his free time or during his work hours?
If it's the former, do you really believe that the money we paid for Royal edition are enough to take devs free time? I don't think so.
If it's the latter, don't you think it would be better if he spends the time working on the game rather than spending it here? And honestly, it does get time consuming, once the forumites get used to the dev being talkative and @ing him in every other their request.... it grows so much that it necessarily either takes his free time, or forces him to neglect the actual work he's paid for. If being a project leader, would you want to have a team member, who spends hours of his work-time doing work he's not assigned to? I would not.

Ideally there should be some space between. But there isn't. And it's not entirely the devs' fault. I am among the users who respect the devs work, despite its downsides, somebody who tends to be appreciative to the devs and who tries to understand them. And the overwhelming negativity of this forum forced me to pull back. I have no desire to read how people are disrespectfull to other people's work. I have no intention to waste my time reading about frustration of disrespectfull bunch of whinners, who think that having no dev diary for 2 months is an outrage. Can you imagine how demotivating it can be for the devs? I can. And I have no doubt they are totally demotivated by this sort of behaviour. Even those who became devs through this forum. This said, these words quoted below are more true than you can imagine:
People also should not underestimate the hesitation a lot of developers (or basically everyone who isn't part of marketing, and arguably even those people) will feel to go on the forums because if they don't do everything perfectly, everyone will complain and harass them for not giving more information or even giving unappreciated information - like "it's going to take three more weeks until we get a dev diary", to name something.

These people don't have it as part of their job to go on the forums and interact, and the worse a community behaves, the less likely they are to do it anyway.

And while this community tends to be rather articulate and probably won't turn to actual rants and insults, there is a lot of rather incessant whining about bugs and when the new content will arrive. I can't exactly blame the developers for not wanting to step into the minefield that has been created over time. Of course, not everyone is guilty of that, but perhaps take a moment to contemplate this, and put yourself in their shoes.
 
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Something that might be worth considering is that work may well have been slowed by the international plague.

It's disruptive to work patterns, if you're working from home it means you can't just stick your head across the aisle in the office and have an informal "I've had an idea" chat, or "can you just look at this sketch..." conversation.

They may also be working on several "flavour packs" at the same time, and not know yet which one will be the first - and thus be unable to communicate that.
They may also be unable to state exactly what features are coming with the main expansion because specific features are in flux.

Sure, I'd hoped for a general theme for the big pack, but it'll get there.
 
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