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Thure

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a new patch coming up! Just in time for the game to be broken for the easter holidays! Huzzah!

I think paradox learned the lesson after the Christmas debacle. They already said that they don't want to rush a patch anymore. So this are just bugfix who couldn't break much. And I'm sure Paradox try to test it better. They even search new betas right now.
 

Jorlem

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We shouldn't discourage them from releasing free patches that promise to fix the issues that bother us the most.
They really do need to nail these next few patches, though. Elsewhere on the internet, I've seen people saying that they did not plan on buying Cities Skylines because of Paradox's issues with long lasting and unfixed bugs, and patches that break the games. Other people did jump on those saying this, pointing out that Skylines wasn't made by Paradox, just published by them, but there are sure to be others thinking the same things. (Also, it is rather sad that that is the defense that was used.)
 

shulima

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[...]
4. Various nerfs (distance, number of lovers, loving spouses, risk, etc) to the "Seduce" action from "Way of Life".

By Thor, THANK YOU. My Caliph is cycling through unfaithful wives faster than the realm can produce them. Seriously, MTTH of any wife getting pregnant with a bastard is about three times shorter than her getting pregnant with my own child, and they rarely last past two years without getting seduced.
 

Thure

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They really do need to nail these next few patches, though. Elsewhere on the internet, I've seen people saying that they did not plan on buying Cities Skylines because of Paradox's issues with long lasting and unfixed bugs, and patches that break the games. Other people did jump on those saying this, pointing out that Skylines wasn't made by Paradox, just published by them, but there are sure to be others thinking the same things. (Also, it is rather sad that that is the defense that was used.)

The people should be happy that Paradox still release free patches and expansions for a game released in 2012. Three years ago.
 

CoSMoS

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Can you adopt the changes from the Bugfix mod (steam workshop)?

It specifically has
Misc: Replaced non-breaking spaces with regular kind, fixing prison accomodations

Wait, so it's actually a bug that we are no longer spammed constantly about prisoners wanting better accomodation?? For the love of god, please don't ever "fix" this then!
 

Jorlem

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The people should be happy that Paradox still release free patches and expansions for a game released in 2012. Three years ago.
All I'm saying is that the attitude exists, and is something that Paradox should be aware of, and needs to combat. I don't agree with it, and most others where I saw it brought up did not either, but that doesn't stop it from existing.
 

BjornB

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All I'm saying is that the attitude exists, and is something that Paradox should be aware of, and needs to combat. I don't agree with it, and most others where I saw it brought up did not either, but that doesn't stop it from existing.

We are aware of this attitude from some people. To be perfectly honest, we used to have an even worse reputation before :) We are doing our best to improve, but sometimes things just go wrong. CK2 is a really hard game to develop for now as the complexity increase with every expansion and we will keep on smashing bugs to the best of our abilities.

I want to thank the absolute majority in this thread for staying mannered and constructive. It's so much easier for us to gather feedback and engage you guys in meaningful discussions when things are kept civil.
 

War_lord

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The people should be happy that Paradox still release free patches and expansions for a game released in 2012. Three years ago.

That they make shit tonnes of money off...

Props to companies that continue to support games long after the profit in doing so is gone, that's not the case here. CK II is still in a cycle of profit.

I don't agree with the Paradox bashers. Bug catching for something as complex as CK II + expansions can't be easy and Paradox's general QA is far better then it used to be. But I don't agree with those that act like Paradox is a Charity act that should be beyond the reproach of mere mortals either.
 

NewbieOne

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It seems as if this patch was announced due to the amount of backlash Johan Lerström got for saying "the game is stable, we don't need to patch it at this point".
So it really is the contrary.

Well, if something like that really was said, then this is far less than the backlash that was actually deserved for saying something like that. (Problem being not even the merit of that kind of claim per se but the cognitive dissonance/disconnect between those who develop the game at this stage and those who actually play it. Obviously quite some flak would be deserved for deciding to ignore bugs and flaws that don't interfere with physical stability but prevent correct operation of the game in terms of its functions, its purpose etc.)

We are aware of this attitude from some people. To be perfectly honest, we used to have an even worse reputation before :) We are doing our best to improve, but sometimes things just go wrong. CK2 is a really hard game to develop for now as the complexity increase with every expansion and we will keep on smashing bugs to the best of our abilities.

And that's on okay thing to say. When you put it that way, I can begin to see the small size of your company and the indie-sort-of initial background and everything else that contributes to the big picture.

Now when the PR stuff tries to weave a fairy tale that doesn't exist or someone makes a smug/inconsiderate remark about satisfaction with the state of the game, that produces the opposite result, or when players themselves get attacked for having an 'entitled' attitude or supposedly being unable to ever be satisfied with anything.

The people should be happy that Paradox still release free patches and expansions for a game released in 2012. Three years ago.

Not necessarily. Without DLCs, it would have been possible to debug and stabilize CK2 and move on many months age; it's the DLC's — which are paid-for products, normaly work for a living and product for money exchange — what delays fixes and produces the need for more. And while DLCs do to some extent pay for bug fixes, they also pay for the time spent making more DLCs. Therefore the DLC programme shouldn't be represented as some kind charity/beneficence/fundraising for bug fixes. And while it's the noble thing to do to keep fixing a game post-release (despite the 'AS IS' disclaimer in every EULA these days), fixing bugs in one's own software is more of a matter of being responsible for your own product than of charity as some forum members try to present it.

This is not to criticize DLCs but to mark the difference between a fair mutual deal (sale & purchase), and charity (i.e. gift).

Continued purchasing (to support a vendor you like) is equally a title to gratitude as continued selling (to provide nice things for your customers). It's basically a balance with equal scales. Can't present it like a one-way charity.

We shouldn't discourage them from releasing free patches that promise to fix the issues that bother us the most.

Yeah, when dedicated fixing effort starts taking place, we should encourage and not discourage it. (But for obvious reasons I wouldn't criticize Duke for being a little discouraged himself.)

If i create an Ironman game now (which will be a long running one) will it be outdated when the update comes??
in other words, should I wait for the patch before starting this long running game??

You should probably wait for the patch and even the tech upgrade. This is because while it's possible that you will escape all major mess in your game, it's far from guaranteed, and what passes for a 'minor' bug can still wreck your game in a major way. For example an antipope could drive Catholic moral authority into the ground in your game and make Catholic realms in Europe's heartland keep infighting when the Umayyads and Abbassids and the rest of them keep nibbling on the fringes. In a non-ironman game you could use the titleowner cheat to set the antipope's liege as the owner of the antipope's bishopric, thus instantly ending the antipapacy, and you could also console-kill any female antipopes etc. In ironman, you can't. The importance of this depends on who (where, how large etc.) you play as. As HRE you probably won't suffer much, but as a smaller Catholic realm you could end up being on the losing side with the other Catholic guys if things were to go badly.

Viability of ironman games — where you can't edit saves or use console — is a good gauge of where the game really is at.
 
Last edited:

Me_

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We are aware of this attitude from some people. To be perfectly honest, we used to have an even worse reputation before :) We are doing our best to improve, but sometimes things just go wrong. CK2 is a really hard game to develop for now as the complexity increase with every expansion and we will keep on smashing bugs to the best of our abilities.
That's why I think that it would be better to start working on CK3. I mean CK2 is awesome, but it's becoming too tangled.
 

Thure

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Even though it's the only game I know that costs $160.00...

Only if you buy every expansion... And it's often on sale. You could buy the base game for 10.00 and you still would get every patch... Noone is forcing you to buy all expansions. I hate the old ways were you are forced to buy all expansions to get new patches... like EU3. If you buy the basegame of EU3 for 40.00 you would have to buy every expansion. And EU3 expansions were more expansive than a single CK2 expansion and give the same or less content.

And you should look for the Train Simulator... CK2 is nothing against a game that would cost over 2000 Dollar with all DLCs

http://store.steampowered.com/app/24010/

The Sims 3 with all expansions is over 400 Dollar. Or rocksmith 600 Dollar.
 

Rationalsanity

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Only if you buy every expansion... And it's often on sale. You could buy the base game for 10.00 and you still would get every patch... Noone is forcing you to buy all expansions. I hate the old ways were you are forced to buy all expansions to get new patches... like EU3. If you buy the basegame of EU3 for 40.00 you would have to buy every expansion. And EU3 expansions were more expansive than a single CK2 expansion and give the same or less content.

And you should look for the Train Simulator... CK2 is nothing against a game that would cost over 2000 Dollar with all DLCs

http://store.steampowered.com/app/24010/

"It's not Train Simulator" is not a valid defense for anything.

But the issue here is that new content doesn't override the need to patch old bugs, and we shouldn't be grateful when this happens because the game's overall quality suffers, despite the new content being good.
 

Thure

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"It's not Train Simulator" is not a valid defense for anything.

But the issue here is that new content doesn't override the need to patch old bugs, and we shouldn't be grateful when this happens because the game's overall quality suffers, despite the new content being good.

The current version of CK2 is more stable then anything in the past. I would never play a old version if I could have the current patch. really. The quality don't suffers. Or better... it's matter of opinion.

And the Train Simulator wasn't a defense... It was an exemple that the statement was false. There are more expansive games. Much more expansive games. Sims, Rocksmith, Train Simulator.
 

Voy

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We are aware of this attitude from some people. To be perfectly honest, we used to have an even worse reputation before :) We are doing our best to improve, but sometimes things just go wrong. CK2 is a really hard game to develop for now as the complexity increase with every expansion and we will keep on smashing bugs to the best of our abilities.

I want to thank the absolute majority in this thread for staying mannered and constructive. It's so much easier for us to gather feedback and engage you guys in meaningful discussions when things are kept civil.

You're doing great.
 
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