Unlimited naval range for AI

[Cormac]

Since the AI nations have no naval attrition at sea, I assume they have unlimited range. Does this mean they won't be using the basing rights option in diplomacy? Or is that unrelated?

Also, is there any way to keep the AI powers from doing implausible things with their ships? Shouldn't a game set during the Age of Exploration make realistic ship ranges a priority?

 

[GameGabster]

Since the AI nations have no naval attrition at sea, I assume they have unlimited range. Does this mean they won't be using the basing rights option in diplomacy? Or is that unrelated?

Also, is there any way to keep the AI powers from doing implausible things with their ships? Shouldn't a game set during the Age of Exploration make realistic ship ranges a priority?

Honestly until the dev diary I didn't even know that AI didn't suffer attrition even in EU3. But if they modeled this like EU3, the AI won't go off exploring the world from the beginning. I think there are limits. But I do ask myself if this has an impact on the diplomatic gameplay as well as naval superiority. I wouldn't like an OP AI that can have their ships roaming around and never needing to go back to a base. A.k.a "Ghost Ships".

 

[Cormac]

To be honest, unlimited naval range has been my single bone of contention with Paradox games since the beginning. They're excellent, visionary games, and I appreciate the difficulties involved in coding AI behavior, but the whole range thing seems a little much. HoI had that problem as well, even in later versions, which eventually turned me off of the series.

 

[jockedahl]

I think if they had an AI programmer from the start it wouldn't be there.

He just hasn't had time to fix it yet. I think it will be patched eventually. Maybe to christmas or something.

 

[drake000666]

People have some strange grips, When you think about the advantages a human player have over a AI this is a small thing. We know from the start what most of the world looks like and the best places to colonize along with tons of other stuff, so giving a few advantages to the AI so we don't trick it into destroying its fleet with attrition is a small thing.

 

[BoleslavLev]

It is not only about colonization. I like to play European or Asian power without colonizing and being able to blockade any port all the time or transport units at any place of the map is quite strong then. But that point with the human factor was a good one.

 

[Wizzington]

People have some strange grips, When you think about the advantages a human player have over a AI this is a small thing. We know from the start what most of the world looks like and the best places to colonize along with tons of other stuff, so giving a few advantages to the AI so we don't trick it into destroying its fleet with attrition is a small thing.

The player cheats pretty hard by having a human brain.

 

[Chamboozer]

The player cheats pretty hard by having a human brain.

Yeah, but the AI is incapable of getting annoyed about it. Not having attrition for AI fleets seems okay to me, but they shouldn't be using it to travel impossible distances.

 

[Wizzington]

Yeah, but the AI is incapable of getting annoyed about it. Not having attrition for AI fleets seems okay to me, but they shouldn't be using it to travel impossible distances.

So what you're saying is that I should program the AI with the capability to get annoyed and post about it.

 

[drake000666]

Yeah, but the AI is incapable of getting annoyed about it. Not having attrition for AI fleets seems okay to me, but they shouldn't be using it to travel impossible distances.

I would agree with this if it was not for the fact that a human player knows all the places to get basing rights to do the same thing

 

[Madagar]

So what you're saying is that I should program the AI with the capability to get annoyed and post about it.

You know, I might be even willing to pay for a DLC that makes the AI come on the forums and whine about how human players cheat after it gets beaten

 

[Wizzington]

You know, I might be even willing to pay for a DLC that makes the AI come on the forums and whine about how human players cheat after it gets beaten

I'll do that right after I teach it to reload the autosave if it loses a war.

 

[Assalander]

Well, I suppose the AI won't be able to just send its ships in absurdly far places, right? That it will have a hard capped naval range? I don't see why it would be so important to give Portugal access to Japan from day 1. Unless of course it is incapable to ask for fleet basing rights. I hope Wiz will confirm.

 

[Cormac]

People have some strange grips, When you think about the advantages a human player have over a AI this is a small thing. We know from the start what most of the world looks like and the best places to colonize along with tons of other stuff, so giving a few advantages to the AI so we don't trick it into destroying its fleet with attrition is a small thing.

True enough. AIOs need a little help, to be sure (or a lot!). But do they need *this particular* help? The awesome perils of sea travel, especially long-distance sea travel, were what made the era's discoveries so incredible and its logistics so difficult. Think of how many vessels the Spanish Empire lost to bad weather alone during the sixteenth century. In other words, EUIV is a game that models the Age of Discovery while omitting for AI opponents one of the very elements that literally helped to define the Age of Discovery.

I think that's a valid gripe.

But I'll probably still buy the game.

 

[drake000666]

I'll do that right after I teach it to reload the autosave if it loses a war.

That would be so funny, would see people getting into fist fights with their computers over cheating

 

[Wizzington]

To actually address the topic, as I said in the dev diary thread this is a crutch I'd like to do away with, but won't do so until it doesn't negatively impact gameplay (ie the naval AI is able to fully understand the naval range system and 'acceptable' attrition).

 

[Cormac]

To actually address the topic, as I said in the dev diary thread this is a crutch I'd like to do away with, but won't do so until it doesn't negatively impact gameplay (ie the naval AI is able to fully understand the naval range system and 'acceptable' attrition).

Understood--and thanks for the explanation.

 

[drake000666]

True enough. AIOs need a little help, to be sure (or a lot!). But do they need *this particular* help? The awesome perils of sea travel, especially long-distance sea travel, were what made the era's discoveries so incredible and its logistics so difficult. Think of how many vessels the Spanish Empire lost to bad weather alone during the sixteenth century. In other words, EUIV is a game that models the Age of Discovery while omitting for AI opponents one of the very elements that literally helped to define the Age of Discovery.

I think that's a valid gripe.

Its not when the human player know were to travel and were to get basing rights so that they do not have to worry about it. The only time I lose ships to attrition is when I forget about a fleet parked of someones coast blockading.

 

[mejla]

I'll do that right after I teach it to reload the autosave if it loses a war.

haha that would be epic. the player receives game over window saying Austria has quit/reloaded because she lost the war. click ok to hotjoin austria in the last save.

 

[AlHasanAlbaghdadi]

In Wiz we trust!