United ANZAC?

[P3D]

Just wondering...

Are there enough justification to merge Australia and New Zealand into one country - ANZAC?

It would be a stronger country than AST and NZL together, more fun to play due to higher IC, and I think it would also beneficial to the AI.

Comments?

 

[Sir Humphrey]

No there is not. As a seperate modification maybe, but I would be utterly against the idea. There is no historical or even plausable precent to warrant this. Just my thoughts.

 

[DazzaLCFC]

I agree. Bad idea.

 

[McNaughton]

Gamewize, I understand the request, but, I think that historically it cannot be justified. Maybe, for a difficulty mod for CORE, things like this could happen to increase the potential of the AI, but, player-based it would not really be accurate.

 

[MateDow]

I don't like the idea. It isn't historically correct which is a hallmark of CORE. If we do that, why not make a unified South or Central America? They would be a world power and it would be fun to play. We don't do it because it isn't historical. MDow

 

[Sir Humphrey]

If the ANZAC thing you want better explained in game terms, think expeditionary forces.

 

[Carroarmato-P40]

Historically there was a people's refferendum to unite Australia and NZ into a Pan Tasman republic of the great commonwealth of GB. It passed in both senates however it was blocked by the Govenor General, who represents the Royal family, without his tick, no law or reffarendum can be passed.

An event for AUS, NZ and then 'seek blessing from govenor general', if he rejects 'make plea to King George VIth'

maybe....

 

[baylox]

Historically there was a people's refferendum to unite Australia and NZ into a Pan Tasman republic of the great commonwealth of GB. It passed in both senates however it was blocked by the Govenor General, who represents the Royal family, without his tick, no law or reffarendum can be passed.

An event for AUS, NZ and then 'seek blessing from govenor general', if he rejects 'make plea to King George VIth'

maybe....

When did this happen historically?

 

[JRaup]

Historically there was a people's refferendum to unite Australia and NZ into a Pan Tasman republic of the great commonwealth of GB. It passed in both senates however it was blocked by the Govenor General, who represents the Royal family, without his tick, no law or reffarendum can be passed.

An event for AUS, NZ and then 'seek blessing from govenor general', if he rejects 'make plea to King George VIth'

maybe....

This is a new one on me. I don't ever recall this happening in the 20th century. I knew there was a movement in the early days of both nations, in the late 19th century, but nothing ever came of it. When did this happen?

 

[Epaminondas]

New Zealand was represented at the original meeting of colonial representatives held to establish the basis for federation. This was in 1890 and the participating colonies then held independent referenda to determine whether or not they would proceed. By 1900 New Zealand (and Fiji) had declined to continue.

Since the founding of Australia through federation in 1901, the idea of some form of political union with New Zealand has been floated periodically but never got off the ground (to mix a metaphor). I'm unaware of any event like that Carroarmato describes. Of course that doesn't mean that it didn't happen, only that I'm ignorant of it if it did.

 

[baylox]

Something like this could only work if it happens during the 1936 to 1947 timeframe. Earlier than that, even only by a few years, makes the issue moot in my opinion (even if it would be cool and have definitive benefits).

 

[JRaup]

New Zealand was represented at the original meeting of colonial representatives held to establish the basis for federation. This was in 1890 and the participating colonies then held independent referenda to determine whether or not they would proceed. By 1900 New Zealand (and Fiji) had declined to continue.

Since the founding of Australia through federation in 1901, the idea of some form of political union with New Zealand has been floated periodically but never got off the ground (to mix a metaphor). I'm unaware of any event like that Carroarmato describes. Of course that doesn't mean that it didn't happen, only that I'm ignorant of it if it did.

Yeah, I knew about the 1890 events.

But if you've never heard of it, then it must not have happened!

(See I do believe you on occassion!)
:wacko:

 

[Sir Humphrey]

I am sorry, but I must disagree. After 1901, the idea became utterly unrealistic, unpopular and unattainable for either nation to seek a political or any other union. There was never a serious attempt, and the popularity with such a move would be utterly lacking. I cannot find any historical evidence that would form the basis for such an event in the 20th century, even less in the limited time frame.

 

[Epaminondas]

(See I do believe you on occassion!) :wacko:

I'd make it very occasionally if I were you.

Actually, a long repressed memory has just resurfaced. I believe that Carro might be referring to the role played by the New Zealand governor (there was no office of Governor General then) in opposing the referendum there. It included the threat to withold assent I think, and was based on concern over the provisions of the Treaty of Waikato, generally thought to be the founding document of New Zealand sovereignty. I don't guarantee any of that - I was very young at the time - but I'll stick with it until a dinkum Enzedder sets me right.

 

[Sir Humphrey]

You see, (though this is another issue not for here), if Australia and NZ colonies or nations were merged, you would have a legal dilemia (in that the Maori were initally far different in legal status to the aboriginals until 1967 I think it was), and that was one of the great reasons why people of the time were against the idea.

 

[P3D]

Well, I got the answers I expected ("ahistorical"). But I had to ask.

 

[Epaminondas]

I figure you got a lot more than you asked for, P3. That'll larn ya!

 

[ArmdChair]

Ep said?!?

I was very young at the time

Is that in the context of the 1890 referendum or the 1901 federation period? Or, at your apparent age, is that eleven year difference simply negligible in this particular instance?

Besides, you know what the doctor said about your "repressed memories" resurfacing... :rofl:

 

[Epaminondas]

Has anyone else noticed that this thread seems to be heading for Cuba?

 

[JRaup]

Has anyone else noticed that this thread seems to be heading for Cuba?

No, but if you'd care to open up a Cuba thread, feel free. I'm sure you have tons of ideas how to better simulate the Cuban position in the 36-47 period.