Uneven ground, undo functionality, circular lines

[Lateralus]

Hi, two questions fellow CiMmers:

Problem 1:

I had great problems in the tutorial when building the metro line (as many users before me, it seems ). I first placed a depot, and then realized that the ground at the exit was too uneven to let me go anywhere from the depot (no amount of mouse wiggling, PageUp, PageDown was helping). So I had to bulldoze the depot, and start over etc. I spent over half an hour, and many tens of thousands of bulldoze dollars, to build a working metro line ...

Two questions arise from this:

- What should one usually build first when constructing a new metro, the tracks or the depot?
- Is there really no way to undo anything once I built it and realize I can not connect it (depots that I can not exit from, tracks where I can not place a depot at the end due to uneven ground ...)

---

Problem 2:

The tutorial says that you should build lines like Depot-1-2-3-4-5-1-Depot, so that vehicles service the line and only hit the depot when maintenance is actually needed. How does that work in practice, usually I have a circular line that starts with Stop 1 after leaving the depot, so with this configuration, the vehicle would hit Stop 1, and to go back to the depot, it would need to make an entire round without picking anyone up. Adding a short "service loop" back to the depot is really cumbersome for rail-based vehicles (tram, metro) and ugly and cumbersome, sometimes quite impossible due to space limitations.

Can't the behavior be that the game checks the maintenance level after Stop 5, and it goes to the Depot if maintenance is needed, otherwise starts a new cycle?! So the if-else-branch would start after Stop 5 (go to Depot or Stop 1), not Stop 1 (Go to Depot without stopping at 2-3-4-5, or continue normal line operation). That would be much better, or am I somehow mistaken.

---

General impression: This will be a great great game if the hassle from the "unfun" stuff is minimized (depot management, looping back metro lines at the end needs an "auto-complete-loop" functionality a la RCT)
Happy playing everyone!

 

[unmerged(609936)]

Adding a short "service loop" back to the depot is really cumbersome for rail-based vehicles (tram, metro) and ugly and cumbersome, sometimes quite impossible due to space limitations.

Welcome to realistic world

Can't the behavior be that the game checks the maintenance level after Stop 5, and it goes to the Depot if maintenance is needed, otherwise starts a new cycle?! So the if-else-branch would start after Stop 5 (go to Depot or Stop 1), not Stop 1 (Go to Depot without stopping at 2-3-4-5, or continue normal line operation). That would be much better, or am I somehow mistaken.

Well, it is up to you and your decisions. As a transport manager you need to place Stop "1" in such relative position to depot to achieve desired effect, in this case to minimize distance that off-duty vehicle has to go.

 

[Lateralus]

Welcome to realistic world



Well, it is up to you and your decisions. As a transport manager you need to place Stop "1" in such relative position to depot to achieve desired effect, in this case to minimize distance that off-duty vehicle has to go.

This is what I am referring to (for example in the Tutorial map, the circular line around the main city). What you are saying essentially, if I understand correctly, that instead of laying the solid green line track, you build the dotted green line track. Well, my assumption is that the first scenario is much much much more easy and intuitive to build in 98% of all cases. Don't you agree?

 

[unmerged(609936)]

Actually, circular lines like this strike me as unrealistic, especially for any kind of rail-bound vehicles, because that means that if you want to go from stop 2 to 1, you have to take long way around. Lines going in loops around city center here usually are run in pairs to avoid this issue (called for example "0 left" and "0 right"). Realistic transit line goes both ways, with pairs of stops near, and terminals/loops/street loops at the end.

I whipped quick and ugly picture in paint to show how it looks like, and how you can place track to depot in effective way.

 

[Lateralus]

Actually, circular lines like this strike me as unrealistic, especially for any kind of rail-bound vehicles, because that means that if you want to go from stop 2 to 1, you have to take long way around. Lines going in loops around city center here usually are run in pairs to avoid this issue (called for example "0 left" and "0 right"). Realistic transit line goes both ways, with pairs of stops near, and terminals/loops/street loops at the end.

I whipped quick and ugly picture in paint to show how it looks like, and how you can place track to depot in effective way.

View attachment 77568

You are right of course, in the tutorial I built a double track. I just chose for the sake of simplicity to not include the other direction in the picture. The point for this second parallel, "counter-clockwise" line would be exactly the same, though.

 

[unmerged(609936)]

But that simplicity (as much as "1-2-3-4-5-1" formula) is oversimplification and leads to confusion Of course, hypotethical counterclockwise line will also have the problem you described. However, line set up on my ugly drawing and set up to go "Depot-1...14-1-Depot" will complete its duty cycle and go off-service by only skipping stop 2, not doing whole circuit. Also, when going on duty, it will just pass stop 14.

And if you move stops 2/14 to the other side of crossing, not even that.

 

[unmerged(721172)]

I have a problem building circular (or any other kind) of underground metro lines. I create one part, double click to create the line, but when I try to expand the line, I can't. I even tried to build the rest of the line and then connect them but still a failure... Is this another bug?

 

[unmerged(510160)]

The issue is that, perhaps with a depot, you can connect both sides of double-track to each other, but you can't connect both sides of track to both sides of other track on, for instance, a T junction.
I find this quite the oversight, it was in CiM1 and it was immensely helpful with creating efficient lines.
This way, you were able to have and use only a single stop at the end of a straight line and have the track connect from one side to the other, so the vehicle would just go into reverse mode on the way back, which plenty of vehicles do.
That, and I'm also missing the option to create little turn-around parts for anything but metros.