Underwhelming Crests
- Thread starter Woolfe
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I've been using the crest my wife designed for me.
I wish there was more visual customization of the 'Mechs - I'd love to add the patch to my command 'Mech.
And those insignia, if I'm not mistaken are already currently in use by said mercs and companies in Battletech.
I doubt they'd like some upstart units plagiarizing their brands.
Yup.... But you can't look at the stuff we have been given and think they are anything like what previously existed?
Well I actually disagree, but I wasn't necessarily asking for already existing Insignia, just some better ones that are more inspired by the existing insignia. Instead of the bland (IMO) tripe we have been provided.
That's actually not even necessarily true, the Helm Datacore actually had a lot of general everday stuff, more so than military tech.... And also based on the previous examples I would put it to you that the aesthetics of the inner sphere are different to your prefences
One of the great things about Btech has been its inconsistencies. These are meant to be diverse nations, with diverse cultures and aesthetic values. You may think Simple is the best, but in a time where a fancy decal may be easy to add to a mech(Magic Paint sprayer tech
), other cultures may look at the more complex imagery as the ideal. There is no reason in the fluff not to have lots of differences.And Yes I get that the inconsistencies came because FASA borrowed from all over the place. But the one thing that did was give a feeling of diverse nations and cultures. Look at the different Mech. They look so different sometimes and yet none of them feel "wrong".
It's not a question of "fancy decal(s) may be easy to add", it's a question of what is visually cohesive and distinctive at a variety of distances. Insignias with lots of small detail look like a messy and indistinct blur at a distance, which is a big problem, because you don't want to be misidentifying friends and foes on the battlefield.That's actually not even necessarily true, the Helm Datacore actually had a lot of general everday stuff, more so than military tech.... And also based on the previous examples I would put it to you that the aesthetics of the inner sphere are different to your prefences
One of the great things about Btech has been its inconsistencies. These are meant to be diverse nations, with diverse cultures and aesthetic values. You may think Simple is the best, but in a time where a fancy decal may be easy to add to a mech(Magic Paint sprayer tech
And Yes I get that the inconsistencies came because FASA borrowed from all over the place. But the one thing that did was give a feeling of diverse nations and cultures. Look at the different Mech. They look so different sometimes and yet none of them feel "wrong".
Let's face it, a lot of the old insignia art is kinda janky. Not like it was/is exceptional in that regard, compared to art for other PnP games, but let's not pretend that it's good because FASA put it together. That doesn't mean people aren't allowed to like it, but we shouldn't deny the technical flaws. This goes for all kinds of media. For example, The Beast of Yucca Flats is B-movie trash, and even though I love it (in part because it's B-movie trash) I'll be the first to admit it's technically flawed in practically every conceivable way.
We can appreciate the diversity of FASA's insignia art while acknowledging that a lot of it is technically flawed, and, were HBS to emulate that style when making their own insignias, they wouldn't render well in game. Additionally, a good many would end up being pigeon-holed and unusable for the kinds of characters and merc companies that people want to make, because an insignia with lots of "character" is not generalizable. I make a new custom insignia for each character/merc company I make for precisely that reason; North Star Sultana and 21 ACES do not have insignias that another merc company could pick up and use without a problem.
It's my guess that: HBS went with soft colour palettes because we didn't initially have bright colours to choose for our merc companies, look at the non-bright colours and the stock insignias mesh with them quite well; they went with simple, distinctive designs so that you could easily pick them out when they appear on the UI and, more specifically, on your 'Mech if you've got alternate skins; they included a lot of symmetrical and geometrically pleasing designs because those tend to be universally eye-catching and attractive, no matter what culture you come from.
But, knowing that a good portion of the player base would never be satisfied with stock insignias, HBS made it a very simple matter for us to add and use our own. They built for a larger audience, but left the game files open so that the fewer who wanted something different could get something different with little effort. That's what I call "the best of both worlds".
What we had previously almost universally made bad stickers that read poorly at distance. I know, I've put them on my minis.
Only a few of the 80s emblems worked well scaling that way. Which was fine at the time. They were originally intended to be printed in books, not on minis.
"Bland tripe" for example, opinion or not, is pretty insulting terminology imho. It's also poor at describing with precision what you'd actually prefer the art to do instead anyway.
Let's all just please agree to move on from the edgy hyperbolic rhetoric and have a civil discussion without such. Every one can have their own preferences so it doesn't require exaggeration to communicate them.
I can say for a fact that there are technical design elements that a good icon would have that the old unit insignias often ignored. The new ones do not, they take it as a prime necessity.
Then there's stylistic and taste elements that will not be agreed on here because that's how taste works.
Take the large number of people who hate the original marauder art. The fandom doesn't even agree on that art.
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How I learned to stop worrying and love custom emblems:
Edit: Using this method I took this:
And turned it into this:
- Make a 256x256 PNG with transparent background
- Flip it upside down AND mirror it
- Convert it to DDS format
- Either
a. Replace an existing file in <Steam>\steamapps\common\BATTLETECH\BattleTech_Data\StreamingAssets\emblems\player
Or
a. Place your file in <Steam>\steamapps\common\BATTLETECH\BattleTech_Data\StreamingAssets\emblems\player
b. Open BATTLETECH\BattleTech_Data\StreamingAssets\data\VersionManifest.csv and under PlayerEmblems add two lines
With the first option you need to re-replace the file after a patch, and with the second option you need to add the two lines after a patch.
a. Place your file in <Steam>\steamapps\common\BATTLETECH\BattleTech_Data\StreamingAssets\emblems\player
b. Open BATTLETECH\BattleTech_Data\StreamingAssets\data\VersionManifest.csv and under PlayerEmblems add two lines
Code:
[SomeUniqueID],Sprite,emblems/player/[EmblemFileName].dds,0,2018-04-21T11:38:11.9043442Z,2018-04-21T11:38:11.9043442Z,,,False,0,False
[SomeUniqueID],Texture2D,emblems/player/[EmblemFileName].dds,0,2018-04-21T11:38:11.9043442Z,2018-04-21T11:38:11.9043442Z,,,False,0,FalseEdit: Using this method I took this:
And turned it into this:
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I agree 100% with my learned colleague.
To add emphasis, I have freely admitted I am not really a fan of Loose's work and much prefer some of the later artists, but I know there are many on here who really do like his stuff. I've never enforced my opinion on them and they have yet to enforce theirs on me.
With regards to the insignia in the game, I actually like them overall. Could the colours be brighter? Sure. But I disagree with the comment about "real military insignia", and that's from someone who deals with it as part of his job. In Battletech the impression has been given that, as @Camicon Dachass has already pointed out, the insignia is used for identification. In these instances you want something simple yet distinctive.
As an apt analogy, up until WW1 British aircraft carried the Union Jack as an identification symbol - right up until gunners confused it with the German's Cross Patee. All those design elements were too confusing. The Union Jack was replaced by the now famous roundel, a much simpler design and easier to recognise. Keeping with the analogy, the type of insignia @Woolfe is thinking of is more in line with squadron badges, but these were never meant to be used as recognition devices and were confined to unit stationery, silverware etc.
Even in the military today, you do not see complex designs like these being used as identification markings on combat vehicles. You only have moments to decide if the target is friendly or not, you don't want to be wasting time trying to identify the insignia.
thats why you got friend or foe tags on untis that show up on radar or whatever....
dont really need visual insignia for identification in the field.
dont really need visual insignia for identification in the field.
EWar exists and is ubiquitous in the lore even in the Succession Wars era. You can't always rely only on electronic Id only.
We don't have to go that deep though.
They do need to be able to be seen clearly by the players eye at the scales gameplay occurs at. Something this games emblems excel at.
Since BATTLETECH is a recreation of the middle ages, with mechs replacing warhorses, we do need insignia. Simply because it fits the idiom so well.
I'm enjoying the insignia choices that come with the game. And it is fairly easy to include your own insignia if you want to do so.
Thus there is no pressing need to complain. Either use one from the game or make one. Dealer's choice.
I'm enjoying the insignia choices that come with the game. And it is fairly easy to include your own insignia if you want to do so.
Thus there is no pressing need to complain. Either use one from the game or make one. Dealer's choice.
true, but i meant it more as in....in game right now we dont need to worry about such things as our HUD in our mechs tells us who the baddies are and who the friendlies are whether it is our own lance or any allies we might have.
but overall i would love the heraldry system to work as it did before and to be seen in mission other then just on certain skins for certain meks.
Two questions?
1) Why flip AND mirror the image? I just flip mine and it works. It has words in it, and they come out just like they should.
2) Is that Thunderbolt a backer skin or something? None of my mechs have unit emblems on them.
Strange. I have to flip and mirror mine; if I don't flip them they're upside down in-game, and if I don't mirror them they will be mirrored in-game.
Yes, it's the Valhalla skin. See this thread for more information.
I think I only needed to vertically flip mine, and it has letters so it was obvious if it was also mirrored.
Mirrored vs. not mirrored depends on your terminology.
Using the terminology that most graphic design programs use, the image is JUST flipped vertically... but that is exactly the same thing as a 180 degree rotation followed by flipping the image horizontally (aka mirroring it). So if you're calling the rotation to upside-down "flipping" it, you'd need the "mirroring".