Turkey Pacify Kurd States Broken?

[Outcast_BR]

I have the game with all DLCs, no mods, playing from a MAC.

I read that they changed the missions to now use Command Points instead of Political Power. But everytime I use it, wining or losing (often a 50/50chance) it never uses my points. So I can abuse it and do it infinite times, and get unlimited political power. 25 if I lose against the rebels, and 50 if I win. Isn't this broken?

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

I have the game with all DLCs, no mods, playing from a MAC.

I read that they changed the missions to now use Command Points instead of Political Power. But everytime I use it, wining or losing (often a 50/50chance) it never uses my points. So I can abuse it and do it infinite times, and get unlimited political power. 25 if I lose against the rebels, and 50 if I win. Isn't this broken?

Yes its broken. there have been like 4 threads discussing this wonderful exploit.

thank you for being the one kid in class to remind the teacher homework was due

 

[Goodfontana]

It don't believe it is broken, because everytime you click it and fail, you will lose 5% stability. Not to mention that if you fail a few times in a row, and get resistance over 25%, you will also increase the level of the modifier everytime you fail after that and decrease the chances to be succesful even further. When that happens, good luck keeping resistance in check with high level of modifier and non-existant stability

I think it is a beautiful bait for players who use exploits to screw themselves, as you can see in a recent video by certain YouTuber.

Enjoy your unlimited PP and your 0% stability

 

[brainiac1530]

That's barely even a drawback. 0% stability Turkey is the norm, anyway. In my current game, AI turkey is at 0% thanks to all the modifiers, while at peace. Your base stability can't go below zero. So, if you like, you can just bank max PP via those decisions and then slowly build it back up with improved worker conditions, or even promises of peace, since you can mash war propaganda to get your war support back later.

Oh, nah. You can also ignore the resistance, too. Let them revolt. It's not a proper HoI4 exploit unless it involves a civil war.

 

[Goodfontana]

Effects of 0% stability:
-20% PP gain (not that you'll care about this one)
-50% factory and dockyard output (big OOF)
+20% resistance target in occupied territories
Guaranteed strikes when you go to war, increasing consumer goods and reducing factory output dramatically

After that to regain it you can do:

Improved worker conditions = 12,85% stability in 180 days, with +5% consumer goods and -10% factory output during that time, and a 2 year cooldown
Republicanism = 5% stability in 14 days, with a 30 days cooldown (great, but unavailable in certain paths like Ottomans after a bit)
Promises of peace = 6,4% stability in 90 days, with a 1 year cooldown

But of course, you will keep spamming the decisions for the "exploit", so it doesn't matter that much if you increase it

As I said, a beautiful bait for players who do exploits.

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

Effects of 0% stability:
-20% PP gain (not that you'll care about this one)
-50% factory and dockyard output (big OOF)
+20% resistance target in occupied territories
Guaranteed strikes when you go to war, increasing consumer goods and reducing factory output dramatically

After that to regain it you can do:

Improved worker conditions = 12,85% stability in 180 days, with +5% consumer goods and -10% factory output during that time, and a 2 year cooldown
Republicanism = 5% stability in 14 days, with a 30 days cooldown (great, but unavailable in certain paths like Ottomans after a bit)
Promises of peace = 6,4% stability in 90 days, with a 1 year cooldown

But of course, you will keep spamming the decisions for the "exploit", so it doesn't matter that much if you increase it

As I said, a beautiful bait for players who do exploits.

the thing is is that this only works as an exploit if you have some actual foresight. if you are seriously sitting there mashing this button until 1940 then of course the payout isnt worth it.
you just need to leave yourself enough time to bring stability up.

you can get 2000 pp by the end of 1936/beginning of 1937. then be set by when ww2 starts.

you chose not to mention raids against the other factions in your country will boost your stability. also turkey has a several advisors that boosts your stability depending on the route you take the country. On top of that you fail to mention the stability bonuses that are in the focus tree of turkey.

you can easily use the exploit then use the rest of the game mechanics allotted to you to get your stability up enough to be in fighting position.

sounds like your the one whose been tricked here my friend.

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

To prove my point even further. Here is the democratic route, on ironman. while using the exploit for the first year and a half (this is a game i was playing earlier this week to mess with the exploit)

its 1938 and i have 90% stability. i cant run out of pp now, even with all of the decisions given to me.

mind you this WAS NOT a game where i was trying to leave myself enough time to get up to fighting stability.
im sure if i were to do this again with another route you would be in the same position around this time in game if not later. But thats okay, if you followed the exact timing of the playthrough i did its about to be 1939 and you would still have a year to continue to improve your stability.

depending on which route you go down the focus tree determines really how much time you need to leave yourself to focus on stability.

 

[Goodfontana]

the thing is is that this only works as an exploit if you have some actual foresight. if you are seriously sitting there mashing this button until 1940 then of course the payout isnt worth it.

Which is exactly what people say this exploit allows you to do

you can get 2000 pp by the end of 1936/beginning of 1937. then be set by when ww2 starts.

Sure, and produce A LOT less equipment and buildings in the meantime (factory output affects construction speed in case you didn't know)

you chose not to mention raids against the other factions in your country will boost your stability. also turkey has a several advisors that boosts your stability depending on the route you take the country. On top of that you fail to mention the stability bonuses that are in the focus tree of turkey.

Of course I chose not to. Raids only improve your stability by a net 2%, while reducing it by 10% initially, therefore, small increase for a bigger temporary penalty (unless you do it at 0%) at the cost of 50 PP each time, which is the same cost as being succesful 1 time, or 2 if you are not succesful. But sure, let's include it to further prove my point.

Also, I did not include the different effects of the focus tree because that is highly dependant on the path you choose (and that includes hits to stability, not only bonuses). But I'm certain no path in the focus tree will give you 60-70% stability on its own at least to compensate.

you can easily use the exploit then use the rest of the game mechanics allotted to you to get your stability up enough to be in fighting position.

sounds like your the one whose been tricked here my friend.

Again, stability is not something that is important to have just at a certain point in time, but to have it as high as possible throughout the game. Having it high (above 80%) is very important when you are going to declare war (to avoid strikes), having it for the whole game is even more important to produce more equipment, build faster and help manage resistance if that's the case (meaning, less equipment and manpower lost to resistance).

I reaffirm my initial point. A great bait for players who rely on exploits and don't understand the mechanics properly, thanks for ilustrating.

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

Which is exactly what people say this exploit allows you to do



Sure, and produce A LOT less equipment and buildings in the meantime (factory output affects construction speed in case you didn't know)




Of course I chose not to. Raids only improve your stability by a net 2%, while reducing it by 10% initially, therefore, small increase for a bigger temporary penalty (unless you do it at 0%) at the cost of 50 PP each time, which is the same cost as being succesful 1 time, or 2 if you are not succesful. But sure, let's include it to further prove my point.

Also, I did not include the different effects of the focus tree because that is highly dependant on the path you choose (and that includes hits to stability, not only bonuses). But I'm certain no path in the focus tree will give you 60-70% stability on its own at least to compensate.



Again, stability is not something that is important to have just at a certain point in time, but to have it as high as possible throughout the game. Having it high (above 80%) is very important when you are going to declare war (to avoid strikes), having it for the whole game is even more important to produce more equipment, build faster and help manage resistance if that's the case (meaning, less equipment and manpower lost to resistance).

I reaffirm my initial point. A great bait for players who rely on exploits and don't understand the mechanics properly, thanks for ilustrating.

so i did what you suggested

so having not used the exploit and ONLY focused on keeping my stability up while producing as many civ factories as i can, using the political decisions and changing my economy law. i would now have 1-2 more factories than i would if i were to exploit this. and my army is better equipped with a few thousand more rifles. wow absolutely game changing!

now mind you because i havnt used the exploit, i have none of the bonuses i had from my entire FULL cabinet of political and military advisors. i get None of the bonuses from spamming all of the political decisions available to me. I dont get all the research bonuses from taking in refuges from Germany or Italy. I dont have the massive stockpile of pp that i can continually dump into investments or other decisions.

your way worse off not using the exploit.

the thing is is that 50% debuff doesnt matter to small nations. 50% debuff is crippling to someone like germany.

for Turkey? not so much.
50% of 2 is 1.
50% of 120 is 60.

a loss of 60 is much worse than a short term loss of 1.

^thats what it boils down too^

 

[Goodfontana]

so i did what you suggested

so having not used the exploit and ONLY focused on keeping my stability up while producing as many civ factories as i can, using the political decisions and changing my economy law. i would now have 1-2 more factories than i would if i were to exploit this. and my army is better equipped with a few thousand more rifles. wow absolutely game changing!

I never said you ONLY have to focus on your stability. If you don't have enough PP to go for the decisions, is because you are not spending it properly. You can very easily spam the decisions for your civis (assuming you went for integrate the bank focus), get refugees from both Germany and Italy, get all the political advisors you need, improve your economy and conscription laws, and even gamble 1-2 times for foreign investments, while keeping your stability around 80% or higher. What you mainly have to give up are the industrial/equipment companies and military advisors (at least for the first 3 years), which is another reason why I think it's absolutely ridiculous to destroy your stability just to get a few companies and questionably useful military advisors.

Also, that "few thousand more rifles" can mean a huge difference if you try to rush Greece and Yugo for the Ottoman path. So yes, it can be game changing.

There's a video on YouTube on how to do Hardly Anything Sèvres where this is shown, I recommend you watch it.

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

I never said you ONLY have to focus on your stability. If you don't have enough PP to go for the decisions, is because you are not spending it properly. You can very easily spam the decisions for your civis (assuming you went for integrate the bank focus), get refugees from both Germany and Italy, get all the political advisors you need, improve your economy and conscription laws, and even gamble 1-2 times for foreign investments, while keeping your stability around 80% or higher. What you mainly have to give up are the industrial/equipment companies and military advisors (at least for the first 3 years), which is another reason why I think it's absolutely ridiculous to destroy your stability just to get a few companies and questionably useful military advisors.

Also, that "few thousand more rifles" can mean a huge difference if you try to rush Greece and Yugo for the Ottoman path. So yes, it can be game changing.

There's a video on YouTube on how to do Hardly Anything Sèvres where this is shown, I recommend you watch it.

What you say at the beginning here is literally what i did. outside of grabbing the refugees.
im in the exact same spot stability and industrially, as i am with the exploit version, except i dont have all of this pp i can just constantly dump into foreign investments, and any other political decision i choose.

No where here have we discussed rushing strats... This exploit obviously is intended for mid to late game benefit.
if you want to talk about rushing
turkey can take on any of its neighbors( except the allies of course) at the start of the game.
proper use of your generals and you can start war with russia at the very start of the game
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...he-montreux-convention.1444545/#post-27133664

the game in that thread went till way late, but thats because i fucked up with my research early and didnt have mountaineers as juiced as i should have. simply use iran as a wall and encircle the russians using your mountaineers. I unfortunately didnt realise this till almost 1940. live and learn

 

[Goodfontana]

What you say at the beginning here is literally what i did. outside of grabbing the refugees.
im in the exact same spot stability and industrially, as i am with the exploit version, except i dont have all of this pp i can just constantly dump into foreign investments, and any other political decision i choose.

No where here have we discussed rushing strats... This exploit obviously is intended for mid to late game benefit.
if you want to talk about rushing

What I said at the beginning is that is a bait for players to screw themselves, and I haven't changed my mind.

Then someone said losing all your stability doesn't matter, and I explained why it does.

Then you came up with a theory of why the exploit is so good, which relies entirely on assuming you only need to have high stability at a certain point, completely missing the point of the conversation, which was that spamming the decisions non-stop (and therefore destroying your stability) is not good, which you yourself admitted:

if you are seriously sitting there mashing this button until 1940 then of course the payout isnt worth it.
you just need to leave yourself enough time to bring stability up.

After that I tried to explain to you, that the only benefit you will get from the unlimited PP exploit, as opposed as not using it, even in the scenario you came up with, is to get some industrial/equipment companies and military advisors early on at the cost of your stability, when without using it you can still get all the relevant things you can spend PP early on to get bonuses (economic law, refugees, removing TPDA, advisors, civis decisions, and even some foreign investments if you want to gamble) while maintaining high stability throughout the process.

Seriously, assuming you can get all of that without the exploit (which you can, watch the video I told you for reference), what is the real advantage you get from the unlimited PP? What are you trying to prove?

Now you act all surprised when I mention rushing when replying to your claim that you only gain a few thousand rifles more early (and as explained, is not the only advantage) and come up of nowhere saying this is a mid/late game advantage.

There might be some niche scenario where it could have a net benefit using the exploit to an extent, I really don't think so but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. What I know for certain is that, as a rule of thumb, is better not to use it, and that people like you, that promote exploits, and especially bad ones with dubious benefits, are a really bad example for players who are trying to learn how to play properly and improve. Exploit users are only good players until Paradox patches their "skill".

That being said, I'm not going to indulge you anymore, I think this thread already has enough information for players to make their own decision.

 

[Supremeleaderpies]

What I said at the beginning is that is a bait for players to screw themselves, and I haven't changed my mind.

Then someone said losing all your stability doesn't matter, and I explained why it does.

Then you came up with a theory of why the exploit is so good, which relies entirely on assuming you only need to have high stability at a certain point, completely missing the point of the conversation, which was that spamming the decisions non-stop (and therefore destroying your stability) is not good, which you yourself admitted:




After that I tried to explain to you, that the only benefit you will get from the unlimited PP exploit, as opposed as not using it, even in the scenario you came up with, is to get some industrial/equipment companies and military advisors early on at the cost of your stability, when without using it you can still get all the relevant things you can spend PP early on to get bonuses (economic law, refugees, removing TPDA, advisors, civis decisions, and even some foreign investments if you want to gamble) while maintaining high stability throughout the process.

Seriously, assuming you can get all of that without the exploit (which you can, watch the video I told you for reference), what is the real advantage you get from the unlimited PP? What are you trying to prove?

Now you act all surprised when I mention rushing when replying to your claim that you only gain a few thousand rifles more early (and as explained, is not the only advantage) and come up of nowhere saying this is a mid/late game advantage.

There might be some niche scenario where it could have a net benefit using the exploit to an extent, I really don't think so but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. What I know for certain is that, as a rule of thumb, is better not to use it, and that people like you, that promote exploits, and especially bad ones with dubious benefits, are a really bad example for players who are trying to learn how to play properly and improve. Exploit users are only good players until Paradox patches their "skill".

That being said, I'm not going to indulge you anymore, I think this thread already has enough information for players to make their own decision.

go play the game without the exploit, then go play it with the exploit. dont be ignorant and use it the entire game, you only use it to get the pp you need in the first 2 years to fill all of the advisors out and stockpile a good chunk, then you now only have your political decisions to dump into. you can get investments repeatedly without waiting on PP. You can constantly choose the repeatable decisions that buff you. if you keep Ataturk in power you wont go below 30%. all this exploit is intended to do in my mind is take advantage of the tons of political decisions they have and just spam the shit out of them.

in your first post you said it was not broken and its simply a bait. i have proved to you it is broken and isnt bait if you have the forsight to use the pp gain properly. Im sorry if you refuse to take the time to go and test this out for yourself.

not once have i been advocating for players to do this over playing the game as intended, all i have done is to strive to prove to you that it is broken. and apparently actual evidence is not enough for you.

word of advice, when you have to result to insults and accusations you have lost the argument. thank you for assuming im a bad example, as all ive done is proved you wrong through actual screenshots.

 

[Goodfontana]

go play the game without the exploit, then go play it with the exploit. dont be ignorant and use it the entire game, you only use it to get the pp you need in the first 2 years to fill all of the advisors out and stockpile a good chunk, then you now only have your political decisions to dump into. you can get investments repeatedly without waiting on PP. You can constantly choose the repeatable decisions that buff you. if you keep Ataturk in power you wont go below 30%. all this exploit is intended to do in my mind is take advantage of the tons of political decisions they have and just spam the shit out of them.

in your first post you said it was not broken and its simply a bait. i have proved to you it is broken and isnt bait if you have the forsight to use the pp gain properly. Im sorry if you refuse to take the time to go and test this out for yourself.

not once have i been advocating for players to do this over playing the game as intended, all i have done is to strive to prove to you that it is broken. and apparently actual evidence is not enough for you.

word of advice, when you have to result to insults and accusations you have lost the argument. thank you for assuming im a bad example, as all ive done is proved you wrong through actual screenshots.

Let me get this straight:

1) You think saying you set a bad example is an insult.
2) You think deliberately ignoring specific questions and explanations "wins" you an argument
3) You think of discussions in terms of "win" and "lose"
4) You use exploits and you actually believe you "win"
5) You think because you did a quick test with the wrong parameters, where you actually get better results (more factories and guns according to you) despite claiming to get more factories and bonuses with the exploit (also according to you), and posting a focus tree screenshot, is actual evidence of anything you claim.
6) Despite all of the above, you consider you are in a position to "give advice"

I wish you good luck in your life man, seriously, you are going to need it.