Türkiye not Turkey

[romavatandasi]

Big so what? We still do not call germany deutschland, greece hellas, nor china Zhongguo (middle kingdom)

Are any of these ever said that their English spelling shall be deutschland or Hellas ?

If they did I'd indeed call them so.

My government said that official English spelling(not the Turkish name, English name) shall be Turkiye, so, what can you do about it ?

Respect.

 

[Brynjar]

Hi there

Recently we have changed the country's official English name to Türkiye.

So, as a Turk, I'd appreciate it if paradox changes it to new English spelling as Türkiye.

That is not a correct description of what has happened. What has happened is that Turkey requested the official name used by the UN to be changed from Republic of Turkey to Republic of Türkiye. That change was accepted, but that is not the same as changing the name in the English language. As American English, (which is used in paradox games afaik) does not have any regulating body which decides what is correct, Turkey will remain correct at least as long as that is what large amount of people use.

 

[yurcick]

what can you do about it ?

We can ignore it. What can you do about it?

 

[Topias]

I couldn't have less respect for this request.

I should write the name as Türkiye and not Turkey, you say, even though those two are obviously just the same name with a slightly different spelling.

I'm reminded of Swaziland. I'm sorry, it's actually called Eswatini these days, which just so happens to mean the land of the Swazis, or, as some might say, Swaziland.

I live in a country that in almost all languages is called Finland, or something very close to that. I'd have a far better case to ask people to use Suomi, the actual endonym with no immediately obvious connection to the common exonym, than whatever OP is on about. And yet I don't, because that'd obviously be a completely ridiculous thing to do.

 

[yurcick]

I now live in a country that's named Հայաստան (Հayastan, Հ sounds like English H in "hot", but even less articulated) in its language. Despite my residency, I don't really have any enmity towards modern Turkey, I love the place and have visited it a dozen times.
However, the idea that you would dictate how something should be written in some other language just isn't right. I can get asking for using another name when the older one was a translation of a compound native name that referred to a form of government/dynasty that's not in power anymore. But asking people of another language to speak and write in a way unnatural to them, and having the audacity to ask them to use a letter that's not present in the regular alphabet, is beyond me.

Or call me a ռուսական տեր from now all as my official English name.

 

[MathyM]

After millennia of being called some variation of “Persia”, some Iranians finally convinced Western institutions to refer to their country as “Iran”.

Games taking place before this change became predominant still refer to the country as “Persia”.

 

[Brynjar]

Are any of these ever said that their English spelling shall be deutschland or Hellas ?

If they did I'd indeed call them so.

My government said that official English spelling(not the Turkish name, English name) shall be Turkiye, so, what can you do about it ?

Respect.

We do however say United Kingdom, Great Britain (yes, I know they are technically not the same), or just UK, not the official United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland which is the official name. We use Bolivia instead of Plurinational State of Bolivia which is the official name requested used instead of Bolivia back in 2009. We also use Brunei instead of Brunei Darussalam. People still use Ivory Coast instead of Côte d'Ivoire despite it having changed the official name all the way back in 1985. We use North Korea in English instead of the official Democratic People's Republic of Korea even though North Korea hasn't even been part of the official name since 1948. Many still use Cape Verde instead of Cabo Verde which was requested changed in 2013. United Kingdom and all the other names actually used are just easier to use in the English language than their official names. The list of unofficial names being used in the English language goes on, but if Turkey actually wanted another name to be used in English they should have chosen a name that is actually easier than Turkey to use for English speaking people. Since they didn't, Turkey is what is going to remain used by most English speaking people. Türkiye is much harder to use for English speaking people. What can you do about it?

P.S. There has been people requesting the name of Great Britain to be changed in Vic 3 as well, I don't believe Paradox cared enough to change it.

 

[Panagean]

We can ignore it. What can you do about it?

Don't say that! You'll make the Académie Française cry again!

 

[Splorghley]

My government said that official English spelling(not the Turkish name, English name) shall be Turkiye, so, what can you do about it ?

I reject the authority of the Académie française to regulate French, I reject the authority of the Real Academia Española to regulate Spanish, and I reject the authority of every other language board - past, present, and future - to dictate to people how to speak their own mother tongues.

You can imagine my feelings on the demands of a foreign dictator that English change to suit his whims.

And absolutely none of this has anything to do with V3, which should use Turkey and Constantinople as era-appropriate common names for the places in question.

 

[Emp_Palpatine]

Wouldn't be a real Victoria III board without the regular turkish nationalist whining post.

 

[Aliquam]

I don't get how wanting to get his country called how his country wants to be called is nationalism.

Was recent shift of Czech Republic to Czechia in english also nationalist?

 

[yurcick]

I don't get how wanting to get his country called how his country wants to be called is nationalism.

Was recent shift of Czech Republic to Czechia in english also nationalist?

Let's put this this way.
Having an opinion on how other peoples should act and the idea that you can make the others in foreign countries act as you want is strongly connected with national pride, and arguably, with a false view on national pride, that is arguably typical for nationalists (in a certain sense of the word).

I don't know what agenda Czech government had when introducing this, but I don't think it's a very good idea to change country's name in a foreign language regardless of the reasoning.

Czechia is at least easier to pronounce, it has a more natural ratio of consonants to vowels. Although with this reasoning they should have gone all in and asked to be "Chekia".

Erdogan is indeed a nationalist.

 

[auzewasright]

I don't get how wanting to get his country called how his country wants to be called is nationalism.

Was recent shift of Czech Republic to Czechia in english also nationalist?

I mean, the name of Czech Republic in Czech isn’t Czechia, IIRC it’s “Česko“. The fact that Czechia is also much less unwieldy than Czech Republic also helps.

 

[grommile]

Was recent shift of Czech Republic to Czechia in english also nationalist?

The equivalent to the Turkish government asking us to call Turkey Türkiye (i.e. the untranslated Turkish name of Turkey) would be the Czech government asking us to call Czechia Česko (i.e. the untranslated Czech name of Czechia).

 

[Panagean]

To soften this slightly - it's been within my lifetime that my social circle has moved from calling "Columbia" Colombia, "The Ivory Coast" "Cote d'Ivoire, "Burma" Myanmar (yes I know this one is actually more contentious than it first seems) and "Kiev" Kyiv. I think it's reasonable, where naming reflects some historical injustice or genuinely represents how the people of that country would wish to be perceived abroad (c.f. "Ethiopia" rather than "Abyssinia" - although, working from Herotodus here, I've never been terribly sure how much of a straight upgrade from "Hell-land" to "the land of the burnt-faced people" really is), to take that into account as language naturally evolves over time.

I just don't think Erdogan (who, ahem, I don't like) has the right to dictate that process, particularly for a change that, as far as I know, reflects no historical injustice, is difficult to spell on an English-language keyboard, and sounds almost identical. I also don't think Erdogan's nomenclature reflects any widespread desire among workaday Turks to change their name in another languages, though I could be proven wrong on that!

 

[Brynjar]

Wouldn't be a real Victoria III board without the regular turkish nationalist whining post.

Not wanting to share the name with these definitions isn't necessarily a result of nationalism, nor is it ureasonable.

Definition of TURKEY

a large North American gallinaceous bird (Meleagris gallopavo) that is domesticated in most parts of the world; failure, flop; especially : a theatrical production that has failed; three successive strikes in bowling… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

Attempting to try to make people using the English language use a name which contains a letter (ü) and combinations of letters (iy) which isn't normally used in the English alphabet/language however, is optimistic at best...

 

[Brynjar]

The equivalent to the Turkish government asking us to call Turkey Türkiye (i.e. the untranslated Turkish name of Turkey) would be the Czech government asking us to call Czechia Česko (i.e. the untranslated Czech name of Czechia).

Well, they kind of did...

On 17 May 2016 the Permanent Mission of the Czech Republic to the United Nations informed the UN that the short name to be used for the country is Czechia.

https://www.un.org/en/about-us/member-states/czechoslovakia

Guess what, most people still use Czech Republic.

 

[grommile]

Well, they already did did...

The Czech government asked for Czechia to be called Czechia in English.

They did not ask for it to be called Česko in English.

 

[Splorghley]

Also, y'all should feel free to reject Czechia too. Bohemia is a much better name.

(Yadda yadda yadda Moravia and Silesia, yeah yeah. Bohemia is still a better name than Czechia.)

 

[nuarbnellaffej]

Are any of these ever said that their English spelling shall be deutschland or Hellas ?

If they did I'd indeed call them so.

My government said that official English spelling(not the Turkish name, English name) shall be Turkiye, so, what can you do about it ?

Respect.

Yea sorry, but Erdogan and his government have no jurisdiction in the wider world. And in demanding “respect”, you’re now guaranteed nothing but laughter and mockery. That was a poor judgment on your part.