Too many black advisors (per usual)

[liamgamer55]

Anyone else finding it a bit ridiculous that as a count in the ERE, in France or in England you constantly get black advisors? They either seem to be Mande or Ethiopian. I've never gotten any Arab traders come to my land to be a diplomat, even though that'd probably be a lot more realistic. I just don't understand why there's a higher chance of a black person being in my court in Germany than a Hungarian or something a little more plausible.

 

[pingupower]

In the upcoming DLC the Aztec ruler will also be black ;D

 

[Voy]

This has most certainly something with the new "trader event" which will give you slave to your own disposal if you let him inside your walls. These "black people" are eunuch slaves who have the right to hold positions at court apparently.

 

[mr_human_555]

Or exiled Nubians / Abyssinans after the muslim crushed them

 

[Comradebot]

I've also gotten Greek eunuchs from the trader event... but most seem to be Ethiopian.

But I've spent almost all of 1.08 as Nubia, so I can't really speak about any over-prevalence of black Africans in other parts of the game world. I've got a few European vassals, but most of them are of Greek descent due to my need for claims in a few areas against the Byzantines. I've also got a branch of House de Normandie that has since turned black and converted from English... to Levantine.

And a wayward, distant cadet branch of House Azim that was at one point Maghreb, and now German, that rules over Tripilotania, and did so for generations in the HRE while maintaining their religion before declaring their independence and ultimately becoming part of Nubia. While they were Arabic in appearance for the longest, their long time with the Germans has influenced them accordingly, and they're now the white Azims of the west.

 

[liamgamer55]

Also, has anyone noticed how if one parent is black and the other is white the children look arab?

 

[pingupower]

Also, has anyone noticed how if one parent is black and the other is white the children look arab?

Well that's more or less how it went actually.

 

[liamgamer55]

Apparently Ethiopians actually look quite arab so that makes sense, however for west Africans that's a bit odd.

BTW does anyone know where these events are? I looked under stewardship ambitions and it seems to link to other events that spawn someone, but there's no mention of which cultures are valid for spawning people so I'm guessing that's in one of the linked to events.

 

[Isaios]

Well that's more or less how it went actually.

Huh?

Apparently Ethiopians actually look quite arab so that makes sense, however for west Africans that's a bit odd.

The similarities between Ethiopians and Arabs are due to the rather long history of co-settlement between the two groups. Not so odd


It is a bit odd how a Mande mother and Frank father gets a Levantine child though. Looks a bit strange. But with a limited number of combinations I guess that's what happens.

 

[Chlodio]

This is pure racism color of skin does't matter.

 

[Amadeu of Savoy]

This is pure racism color of skin does't matter.

Yes, it does matter. I don't want green or blue people in my game, thank you.

 

[Dartheal]

At least you can trust the eunuchs far more than you can trust your vassals.

 

[Oathtaker]

I trust not the eunuch, for what man is a man who is not a man!!!!

 

[Olaus Petrus]

This is pure racism color of skin does't matter.

I don't see it as a racism, but wish for realism. Black people were extremely rare in Christian Europe during the middle ages, but I assume there were at least some black slaves in Muslim Europe. For example vikings had seen black people when they sailed on Mediterranean and looted North African coast, but first recorded visit of a black person in Sweden is from early modern era. In similar manner I find it bit odd how in CKII distant people like Arabs and Georgians occasionally end up to Ireland. Historically these regions had very little contact during this time period.

 

[liamgamer55]

Yes, it does matter. I don't want green or blue people in my game, thank you.

I didn't want red people in my game either... but then they want and made the aztec dlc now didn't they.

I don't see it as a racism, but wish for realism. Black people were extremely rare in Christian Europe during the middle ages, but I assume there were at least some black slaves in Muslim Europe. For example vikings had seen black people when they sailed on Mediterranean and looted North African coast, but first recorded visit of a black person in Sweden is from early modern era. In similar manner I find it bit odd how in CKII distant people like Arabs and Georgians occasionally end up to Ireland. Historically these regions had very little contact during this time period.

Georgians you can't do much about due to marriage being religion wide, but we could at least make the trader events spawn someone realistic like either Italians or Jews or any other plausible merchant culture if in France/Germany/England/That area.

 

[JonStryker]

In reality the opposite is true: Black people usually get decimated real quick. The Fatimids expand southwards and after some years all of the formerly black areas are Egyptian.
If you breed black + white most of the offspring will be Arabic / Persian or something like that. Sooner or later the Black impact will be gone.

 

[Amadeu of Savoy]

In reality the opposite is true: Black people usually get decimated real quick. The Fatimids expand southwards and after some years all of the formerly black areas are Egyptian.
If you breed black + white most of the offspring will be Arabic / Persian or something like that. Sooner or later the Black impact will be gone.

I never noticed that, but if this is happening I agree that it is indeed too quickly. They should stick the whole or most of the game. Maybe the cultural changes should be slower and randomly characters generated should be of the culture of the province...? Doesn't this happen already? I could be wrong.

And isn't the phasing out of those characters meant to indicate that the members of that culture have lost their political power? The habitants are still of whatever race is the culture of their province, aren't they? I mean, when Crusader states were founded in the Levant I think no muslim was in their court, only "franks". But the population of the area remained more or less the same culture (particularly because immigration was so unsucessful).

 

[Sleight of Hand]

To be honest, the thread title is needlessly provocative.

 

[liamgamer55]

I never noticed that, but if this is happening I agree that it is indeed too quickly. They should stick the whole or most of the game. Maybe the cultural changes should be slower and randomly characters generated should be of the culture of the province...? Doesn't this happen already? I could be wrong.

And isn't the phasing out of those characters meant to indicate that the members of that culture have lost their political power? The habitants are still of whatever race is the culture of their province, aren't they? I mean, when Crusader states were founded in the Levant I think no muslim was in their court, only "franks". But the population of the area remained more or less the same culture (particularly because immigration was so unsucessful).

Culture and ethnicity are two separate things.

[edit] (next bit is wrong, see a post on the next page)
I believe ingame there's culture (that determines who dislikes you for being a foreigner), graphical culture (that determines clothes) and also ethnicity or whatever it's called ingame that determines whether the character is european/arab/black/mongol.

Also there wasn't really racism so much in fuedal times so I'm sure if an arab spoke french and acted like it a lot it'd be completely fine with everyone viewing him as having frankish culture etc so the way it works makes sense. Culture ingame is some combination of culture and language spoken.

And isn't the phasing out of those characters meant to indicate that the members of that culture have lost their political power? The habitants are still of whatever race is the culture of their province, aren't they? I mean, when Crusader states were founded in the Levant I think no muslim was in their court, only "franks". But the population of the area remained more or less the same culture (particularly because immigration was so unsucessful).

Indeed, culture ingame is meant to represent the culture of the lower nobles & merchants or so I've heard (since the culture of the peasants is unlikely to change quickly, but at the same time is largely irrelevent for medieval politics). The upper/middle nobility being a different culture is represented by the culture of the king and the general tendency for all the counts and eventually barons to end up being that culture over time. Plus ofcourse if a king is of a random culture and doesn't install any dukes of his culture in various places he tends to get overthrown after a while anyway (it rather nicely represents how french culture was only able to influence the kingdom of england due to england for a long time having french holdings, then once those french holdings were gone the balance of power shifted back to the mainland and the culture became more mainlandish officially)

 

[Garbon]

To be honest, the thread title is needlessly provocative.

Yep. I've no issue with the complaint which makes sense but the title...